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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be incredulous at much property prices have risen in the UK!

182 replies

TwistyKnickKnocks · 27/01/2022 23:50

Looking at buying a house and saw a 3 bed terrace for sale. bog standard 90s build box, tiny garden, no garage, needs work at £430k. It was sold 20 years ago for £105k so an increase of 300% or £16k a year.

20 years ago the average wage was £18k and it is now £29k, so an increase of £11k. Although where we live a managerial salary is less than £25k. Most jobs are advertised at around £20k and quite often want a degree! It’s quite a deprived area too.

How the actual fuck was this allowed to happen?

OP posts:
user1497207191 · 28/01/2022 12:38

@DGRossetti

There is massive house building projects all over the place so hopefully things will get moving soon.

"Massive" - not really.

Look at London, Birmingham, Liverpool, Bristol, Manchester (etc).

Millions of houses built in the 30s and 50s.

A couple of holiday lets for lego families isn't really the same thing.

But "some" areas are seeing massive housebuilding. There are entire fields being built on around Preston/Blackpool/Garstang with hundreds of houses per site. Thousands of new homes planned for Bailrigg at Lancaster.
Sallycinnamum · 28/01/2022 12:51

I can't see our DC ever being able to buy their own homes where we live in the SE.

We paid £250k for a 3 bed semi 10 years ago and it's now worth £700k although we have added an extra bedroom. It's absolutely mental.

When I bought my first flat in 2002 the interest rate on my mortgage was 5.5%. That rate would cripple many if it went up that much now.

Mummyoflittledragon · 28/01/2022 13:55

@RandomLondoner

Something I read looked at several explanations for the rise in house prices in the UK and found that the biggest explanatory factor was lower interest rates. Surprisingly, they found there was actually slightly more housing availability now than 2 or 3 decades ago, the housing supply had actually increased more than the population. (So, while more housing always helps, a shortage of construction does not explain it being harder to buy now.)
Something I read looked at several explanations for the rise of house prices in the U.K. and found the biggest explanatory factor was lower interest rates.

I remember as a teen in the 80s being utterly convinced I would never, ever own a property. With double figure interest rates and soaring prices, there was real fear in the air with houses becoming increasingly unaffordable. This lasted in the late 80s with a peak in 1989 of 14.88 percent and heralded in a monumental crash, made worse by the removal of the double tax relief for unmarried couples.

I think perhaps a lot of mumsnetters either weren’t born or cannot remember this time. It was scary and nothing like 2008. Interest was in the higher single figures shortly before the 2008 property price crash and the drops were around 16% in 2008 and 1.3% the following year. Whereas the previous owner of the house we bought in 1994/5 paid more than 1.5 times more a few years earlier, ie a drop of just over 35%.

Additionally, people had to save to get on the ladder as there were no 0% deposit mortgages (albeit with a higher interest rate) until 2014. There were no government ftb stamp duty allowances or shared ownership properties. Obviously the interest rate for these mortgages is higher. However, these elements have all boosted demand and driven up costs.

If today someone pays an interest rate of £900 a month, they can borrow around £180k. In 1997, a rate of 7.7% would have allowed for £120k and a rate of 15% in 1989, £70,500. This is very relevant in terms of house prices.

It is hardly surprising when putting these factors together that prices have soared.

The Tory government is only too happy scapegoat btl landlords, who saved their bacon when it sold off swathes of housing stock. However, the government has allowed oligarchs to purchase massive amounts of housing stock, particularly in cities such as London and launder billions, which had a serious impact on London property prices. It’s the equivalent of what people do to little kids when they tell them to look over there and steal their toy in jest. Except this is not a game.

Rents in my experience at least have not yet doubled in the past 20 years. They have gone up a lot recently due to governmental policies targeting landlords with one or a handful of properties. Notably the largest change has not affected those with the old property businesses and portfolios. A lot of government ministers own such portfolios. Another ‘look over there’ trick.

Mummyoflittledragon · 28/01/2022 13:57

Oops forgot to delete old in the last paragraph. A lot of government ministers own property businesses and portfolios.

Hadharra · 28/01/2022 13:57

@ninnynonny

Yep. Bought ours for £160k in 2004, now would sell for £500k. As others have said, although this is great for us, we have 3 children all of whom are adults or nearly adults, and they will never be able to stay in their home city unless they get hugely highly paid jobs or lucky. We are being pushed out of our own hometown due to BTL landlords and incomers (a bit Royston Vasey - apologies :D )
You could downsize when they've all left the nest give them 50k each for a deposit and still have 350k to put towards a house (that's what I would do anyway, of course I don't know your situation). But yes, it's insane. I'll never own a house. I will probably be working until the day I die to pay rent.
Hadharra · 28/01/2022 13:58

So many people saying they're living in houses worth a tonne and they have no idea how their kids will afford deposits when they move out. Erm, hello! Give em a hand maybe?

withiceplease · 28/01/2022 14:14

It feels a bit demoralising that my house 'earns' more than I do
YANBU

Nevilleslongbottom · 28/01/2022 14:16

Unfortunately, in spite of their sadness at their DC not getting on the ladder, a huge proportion of the older generation still think that the reason younger generations can’t buy a house is because they are feckless with money.

I’m house hunting now and my mum keeps saying “wouldn’t a detached be lovely” “maybe you could save for a few more months to get a detached.” A detached house round here is 800k! We are two full time workers with good salaries and professional careers but that’s never going to be achievable.

My Mum was a SAHM with 3 kids in a coveted detached house in the SE by the time she was 28, my dad was a civil servant with a final salary of 32k. Those times are long gone!

DGRossetti · 28/01/2022 14:20

@withiceplease

It feels a bit demoralising that my house 'earns' more than I do YANBU
I can't remember the comedians name, but he noted that some parking meters in London are earning double the minimum wage.
Blossomtoes · 28/01/2022 14:21

there were no 0% deposit mortgages (albeit with a higher interest rate) until 2014

That isn’t true. I know because I got one in 1991.

rubytubeytubes · 28/01/2022 14:22

I agree that it is shocking and I do wonder when it will stop. A three bed semi in North west where I am is £500k, 4 beds can be over a million

ufucoffee · 28/01/2022 14:27

As usual, depends where you live. Not all areas have had massive increases.

user1497207191 · 28/01/2022 14:28

At some point, there WILL be another correction, just as there was around 1990/1 and 2008/9. The extent of the correction is obviously unknown. I don't think the 2008/9 was as bad as the 90/91 one was, but obviously people losing their homes etc in the 08/9 correction was disastrous for them, but I think a lot of people/experts were surprised that the 08/9 correction wasn't as severe as expected. The next correction could well be a big one, especially as we won't have low interest rates to cushion the fall, and will be looking at higher inflation at the same time. One thing is for sure that rising prices can't carry on forever, so it's a matter of when, rather than if, there's a correction on the way.

DGRossetti · 28/01/2022 14:29

@Blossomtoes

there were no 0% deposit mortgages (albeit with a higher interest rate) until 2014

That isn’t true. I know because I got one in 1991.

The late 80s and 90s were crazy with their 0% (and if memory serves some -ve) mortgages and the miracle of endowment mortgages (the cryptocurrency of it's day) on top.
Blossomtoes · 28/01/2022 14:32

The late 80s and 90s were crazy with their 0% (and if memory serves some -ve) mortgages and the miracle of endowment mortgages (the cryptocurrency of it's day) on top.

Agreed. It was the only way to keep the market moving though. In 1991 the market was awash with repossessions and houses sat on the market for months. People were afraid of catching a falling knife.

DGRossetti · 28/01/2022 14:48

In 1991 the market was awash with repossessions and houses sat on the market for months

And in 1992 we had 5 more years of Tory. One of the reasons why I wouldn't be betting on anything changing anytime soon.

80sMum · 28/01/2022 14:52

@QuestionsorComments

The small starter home I bought in 1992, when I was 22 and earning £4500 pa cost £42k, about 9 x my salary.

The same house is currently on the market for £350k, which means an "equivalent" 22yo's salary today would need to be close to £40k Shock.

I could give my DCs a decent sum towards a deposit (say£50k) but they still don't stand a chance.

Not quite. Interest rates were a lot higher in 1992 so the mortgage would have cost more per £10k borrowed than it would now. But I agree, the rate of price increase is astonishing.
user1497207191 · 28/01/2022 14:56

@DGRossetti

In 1991 the market was awash with repossessions and houses sat on the market for months

And in 1992 we had 5 more years of Tory. One of the reasons why I wouldn't be betting on anything changing anytime soon.

Labour lost the 1992 GE because of Neil Kinnock. A decent popular Labour leader at that time would have easily beaten John Major.

History does seem to repeat itself for the Labour party, doesn't it??

EatSleepRantRepeat · 28/01/2022 15:10

What is it about this country that has made it so crazy? Is it just shortage of building land, materials, or what? I'd be interested to know what it's like outside of Europe.

DdraigGoch · 28/01/2022 15:14

@Alyosha

Not enough homes..occupancy rates in the rental sector are also too high, as there aren't enough homes. This means it's hard to move out quickly to good quality accommodation, so landlords have the upper hand.

NZ banned foreign buyers - but their property prices increased hugely even so.

We all agree we need more homes but the planning system enables NIMBYs - even where the development is brownfield (like on a car park!).

Not sure that I'd agree with your last statement, there's a lot of pressure on planning departments now to get houses built so anything rejected often goes through on appeal.
TalkSomeSense20 · 28/01/2022 15:36

I blame the Government entirely. Nothing to do with a house being worth what people are prepared to pay for it.........

DoTheMerengue · 28/01/2022 15:38

There needs to be a secure, accessible alternative to home ownership, namely a decent stock of well-maintained social / council housing with reasonable, controlled rents, that isn’t sold off.

addictedtotheflats · 28/01/2022 15:45

Yes its crazy. Houses we looked at 18 months ago (3 bed extended semis) were around £280k with nothing to do. Now im looking at minimum £325K and they are proper fixer uppers. Only good thing for me is my house has gained £65K equity in 5 years so we will have a healthy deposit

onlychildhamster · 28/01/2022 15:45

Well my London has barely gone up...it's gone up by 25k cos I bought it in 2019. I don't expect it to go up at all. But London rents are apparently crazy now (average more than £2k) so I wonder how that would affect property prices! Doesn't projected rental yield affect property value?

DGRossetti · 28/01/2022 15:48

There needs to be a secure, accessible alternative to home ownership

Why ?