To resign because my job suddenly requires me in 3 days a week?

[Earlyflash]

We got told on Friday that we would be required to do a minimum of three days a week in the office from monday.

I’m new at the company (4 months) and this was never mentioned in the recruitment phase. That said I didn’t push them for a written answer.

Given we’ve spent the last two years working 100% at home, this seems like a massive overreach, and I’m intending to tell them to do one.

It’s going to have such an impact on me, my partner, and my children (from previous relationship).

I already have interviews for fully remote roles.

So, AIBU for reacting to such a request?

@AmaryllisNightAndDay

But for an employer to suddenly change the post to 3 days in the office suggests that something is not working. Maybe I know this is hard to believe but it maybe the Employees. Maybe they have found out like one Very Senior Manager that whilst they have been WFH to suit themselves the business has not been performing as it should.

Which means that senior management are very out of touch. Otherwise how would they suddenly discover with no warning that the business isn't performing, and that the reason is staff working from home, and that everyone must go in right way? Surely a competent senior manager would have been monitoring business performance from the start and would have been able to give more than a weekend's notice.

leaving aside the short notice , again its amusing that those that are so bent on staying on work from home have every argument to counter why they should go back in the office , now we have the senior mangemant are out of touch , i expect they have realised or known for a while that it would be better if employes went back in part of the week . unless its a really crap company op works for im sure they have had meetings to decide whats better

maybe they have decided although inconvenient i will grant when it comes to arranging childcare at short notice to do it this way because they assume if they give loads of notice they will have a ton of emails with excuses and arguments from ppl regarding why not , i dont know , none of us can know , or maybe they are being hardline about it and assuming that anybody that decides they dont want to come in is welcome to leave and they can be replaced , no one is indispensable ,there are plenty of people looking for jobs that would not find it a big deal to have to work in the office 3 days out of 5

Yes, massively unreasonable telling them to “do one”, but, I think we all could see the changes coming, perhaps ask for a bit of leeway for first couple of weeks, but it’s a job, go to work and do it, or don’t.

Look to create a mashup of this thread and the LinkedIn one

maybe they have decided although inconvenient i will grant when it comes to arranging childcare at short notice to do it this way because they assume if they give loads of notice they will have a ton of emails with excuses and arguments from ppl regarding why not , i dont know , none of us can know , or maybe they are being hardline about it and assuming that anybody that decides they dont want to come in is welcome to leave and they can be replaced , no one is indispensable ,there are plenty of people looking for jobs that would not find it a big deal to have to work in the office 3 days out of 5

There is a severe shortage of job applicants in some sectors! Where do you get the idea that there are loads of skilled workers looking for jobs and that employers can always take their pick.

@tigerfeet73

Yes, massively unreasonable telling them to “do one”, but, I think we all could see the changes coming, perhaps ask for a bit of leeway for first couple of weeks, but it’s a job, go to work and do it, or don’t.

But people are allowed to make reasonable requests to the company they work for. The company doesn't have to agree to them but it doesn't mean the OP shouldn't at least ask.

@Belladonna12

maybe they have decided although inconvenient i will grant when it comes to arranging childcare at short notice to do it this way because they assume if they give loads of notice they will have a ton of emails with excuses and arguments from ppl regarding why not , i dont know , none of us can know , or maybe they are being hardline about it and assuming that anybody that decides they dont want to come in is welcome to leave and they can be replaced , no one is indispensable ,there are plenty of people looking for jobs that would not find it a big deal to have to work in the office 3 days out of 5

There is a severe shortage of job applicants in some sectors! Where do you get the idea that there are loads of skilled workers looking for jobs and that employers can always take their pick.

office workers are not really at the same skill level as brain surgeons there are going to be im sure companies that will provide and be able to train newer recruits who are less experianced i wasnt trained when i started at my company 19 years ago and obviously i am now , but the company still take on new recruits to the business and train them up

AmarylisNightandDay I guess the changing of the rules may have had something to do with it🤔. Also a good Senior Manager is only as good as the information they are fed. People posting are generally disillusioned if the believe that everyone is a conscientious worker and always feeds the truth.

I am liking the post Chaosrabbitland

i wasnt trained when i started at my company 19 years ago and obviously i am now , but the company still take on new recruits to the business and train them up

Mine is the opposite. My job, that I've been doing for a similar length of time is now degree level and needs at least one other language. If I had to reapply for my job I'd be unlikely to get it now.

If that’s what you expect of a job (and you can get another) then go for it. Personally I think it’s unusual to work from home (I can do no days from home so probably a little bitter abou this chat) . Sorry. But of course you could/should apply for something that suits you better; that would be standard.

office workers are not really at the same skill level as brain surgeons
there are going to be im sure companies that will provide and be able to train newer recruits who are less experianced

How do you know they haven't got the same skills as a brain surgeon? Some people who work in offices will have. Just because they work in an office doesn't mean they're doing admin or whatever you do. It's not all one job. Many will have degrees, professional qualifications and quite unique skills etc.

i wasnt trained when i started at my company 19 years ago and obviously i am now , but the company still take on new recruits to the business and train them up

So you I think everyone who works in an office does the same thing that you do and that nobody has any qualifications because you haven't.

office workers are not really at the same skill level as brain surgeons
there are going to be im sure companies that will provide and be able to train newer recruits who are less experianced

How do you know they haven't got the same skills as a brain surgeon? Some people who work in offices will have. Just because they work in an office doesn't mean they're doing admin or whatever you do. It's not all one job. Many will have degrees, professional qualifications and quite unique skills etc.

i wasnt trained when i started at my company 19 years ago and obviously i am now , but the company still take on new recruits to the business and train them up

So you I think everyone who works in an office does the same thing that you do and that nobody has any qualifications because you haven't.

*i wasnt trained when i started at my company 19 years ago and obviously i am now , but the company still take on new recruits to the business and train them up
*

What about the ones doing the training though. You can't replace them with untrained new recruits. There are more difficult to replace.

I do love the blanket term "office work" as if it's the same job and therefore a transactional easily replaceable skill set.

In my office we have trained accountants ( degree level), lawyers (degree), instructional designers ( degree), digital designers ( degree), animators ( usually degree or other qualifications, certified Project Managers, film crew and directors ( years if specific niche industry experience). Not that easy to just go and and replace any of those without poaching from competitors...

So yup, employees that are in offices often have very distinct skillsets in a very competitive marketplace.

Our industry has grown because of covid actually and covid wasn't the only precipitator - it just accelerated a change that was happening anyway.

We are constantly recruiting to add headcount and have relatively low churn. Candidates with the right qualifications and experience are very targeted in the recruitment process as they are in demand.

Some of us want to stay WFH, some of us want to be in the office, some of us want hybrid - luckily our employer is a) forward thinking b) actually acts in a caring manner to its staff and c) wants to hold on to its skilled and valuable staff as they are a significant competitive advantage versus competitors...

Exactly, @missfliss, I'm a solicitor, and a brain surgeon is as unlikely to be able to do my job as I am theirs. It takes a degree, post-grad study and then a training contract to get where I am (or did; there is a different route to qualification now, as well as the route I took).

'Office work' isn't synonymous with 'unqualified paper-pushers'.

Some of us want to stay WFH, some of us want to be in the office, some of us want hybrid - luckily our employer is a) forward thinking b) actually acts in a caring manner to its staff and c) wants to hold on to its skilled and valuable staff as they are a significant competitive advantage versus competitors...

Spot on. We are similar and have used digital workplace techonologies for many years and business actually accelerated growth during the pandemic as our clients suddenly had to make the same shift.

Using the office as a form of control and discipline is a very poor long term management or retention technique.

Making the office available and with services to encourage hybrid working gives a retention benefit.

Completely your choice. Do what’s best for you and your family. My partner and I both have remote working contracts and haven't looked back. Far happier.

@Buttermuffin

I think they should have given people at least 2 weeks notice to arrange pet sitters , childcare etc. Their attitude would put me off.

It's an employees market from what I hear. I don't think people will stick around in jobs that don't offer a significant amount of WAH, although maybe not all the time.

The level of entitlement which has developed through the pandemic is astonishing. Anyone working from home since the height of it when childcare and schools were closed should have put their arrangements back in place already. Anyone taking on a new job should read their contract and if the contracted place of work is an office should ensure that they have the ability to work from that office. It is not unreasonable at all for the employer to require staff back in now that restrictions have lifted, and employees who are scrabbling about arguing it won’t work for them are extremely unreasonable. It’s naturally not going to go down well that the OP has wasted their time and money entering a contract of employment that she can’t actually fulfill.

The level of entitlement which has developed through the pandemic is astonishing. Anyone working from home since the height of it when childcare and schools were closed should have put their arrangements back in place already.

Don't be ridiculous. The pandemic hasn't made people "entitled". It has made some people question why they should go into an office if their job can be done effectively at home.

Anyone taking on a new job should read their contract and if the contracted place of work is an office should ensure that they have the ability to work from that office. It is not unreasonable at all for the employer to require staff back in now that restrictions have lifted, and employees who are scrabbling about arguing it won’t work for them are extremely unreasonable. It’s naturally not going to go down well that the OP has wasted their time and money entering a contract of employment that she can’t actually fulfill.

I don't think most contracts state where the work has to be done. Unless OP's contract specifically stated that she would be working 3 days a week in the office they arguably wasted her time rather than the other way around.

What's depressing is how many women are complicit in attitudes that directly lead other women being held back from their earning and progression potential.

1. childcare isn't always available at pre pandemic levels whether you are organised or not. What do you suggest then?

2. women still earn less than men on average and so are the default to manage the childcare responsibilities - which guess what, holds them back when childcare isn't available or is reliable and cost effective.

Let's just keep this wonderful situation going for our daughters shall we? Because it's bloody brilliant!

Or .. we could recognise that flexible working that includes WFH options for some is one route to giving women more choice and voice.

Oh .. we could stop slagging people off who were verbally told something and then given less than one working days notice to reorganise an infrastructure that may not yet be in place ...

Sheesh

I would type more but I'm at my desk - working from home .. and have been since 8 .. a full 60 mins of my contracted and paid hours because I don't have a commute.

Boo boo for my poor employer eh!!

@missfliss

What's depressing is how many women are complicit in attitudes that directly lead other women being held back from their earning and progression potential.

1. childcare isn't always available at pre pandemic levels whether you are organised or not. What do you suggest then?

2. women still earn less than men on average and so are the default to manage the childcare responsibilities - which guess what, holds them back when childcare isn't available or is reliable and cost effective.

Let's just keep this wonderful situation going for our daughters shall we? Because it's bloody brilliant!

Or .. we could recognise that flexible working that includes WFH options for some is one route to giving women more choice and voice.

Oh .. we could stop slagging people off who were verbally told something and then given less than one working days notice to reorganise an infrastructure that may not yet be in place ...

Sheesh

Indeed, I took my first call at 7.00 this morning - not something I'd be able to do on public transport.

I don't think most contracts state where the work has to be done.

All mine have. It's key to claiming expenses like travel. "True" WFH contracts state the place of work as the employees address.

HMRC check mileage claims to make sure you haven't been set up a disguised bonus - if your claim are for travel to a sole location then you may have a little chat with them ahead.

I was drafting WFH IT policies back in 2010, and it's been fascinating seeing the shift since 2020.

@DGRossetti

I don't think most contracts state where the work has to be done.

All mine have. It's key to claiming expenses like travel. "True" WFH contracts state the place of work as the employees address.

HMRC check mileage claims to make sure you haven't been set up a disguised bonus - if your claim are for travel to a sole location then you may have a little chat with them ahead.

I was drafting WFH IT policies back in 2010, and it's been fascinating seeing the shift since 2020.

None of mine have stated where the work has to be done. For travel expenses I just state where I travelled from and to (so either the workplace or home) and it is signed off by why my line manager.

What's depressing is how many women are complicit in attitudes that directly lead other women being held back from their earning and progression potential.

(and a generation of men say) I know. Good isn't it* ?

(Irony. Any system which devalues 50% of it's resources is pretty shit. But someone voted for Nadine Dorries*) .

(**Other bigots are available. Ask instore. Your Tory government may be at risk if you stop believing the Daily Mail or other right wing rags. Terms and Conditions apply. This offer is transferable to the political party of your choice. Offer restricted to one generation.)