To ask about chores

[Saysama]

Judging from the posts I see on here all the time, I’m apparently extremely lucky. I’ve never encountered strategic male incompetence. My brothers and father always did their share growing up, my partners have always pulled their weight, none of my male mates have ever been useless and my husband does his share of domestic labour.

In my circles, this is very much the norm. However, this is apparently not a widespread thing. And some of the situations one reads one here are, quite frankly, insane to me. So, I’ve a few questions, if anyone wouldn’t mind answering them. Just to be clear, I’m not referring to a SAHM situation or one where you’ve agreed on a specific chore share. I’m also not talking about abusive relationships. I’m talking about situations where there is a clear imbalance in domestic labour and the woman is unhappy.

• If your male partner is shirking their share of domestic labour, have you spoken to them about it? If so, in what terms? And what has their response been?

I’m having difficulty envisioning a situation where you say to someone (in a healthy loving relationship): “I’m doing XYZ, and you’re only doing Z, intermittently. That’s not fair, let’s make it fair.” And they…just refuse? How is this refusal articulated?

• Would you say that your relationships are otherwise respectful and loving? Do you believe it’s possible for a man to love and respect you whilst treating you like a skivvy?
• Was your partner always like this or is it something that crept up on you?
• Are you planning on staying in your relationship?

Go on, which publication are you writing for?

You are lucky, but nosey haha!

@delilahbucket

Go on, which publication are you writing for?

You can search by username. I’m not a new poster and I haven’t NC for this, so if I’m a lurking journalist, I’ve really been biding my time! 😂

@ticktockriojaoclock

You are lucky, but nosey haha!

Super nosey! 😂 I see at least one of these posts every day and I just have SO MANY QUESTIONS!

Bump.

I'm lucky to have men in my life like you OP. But I have to say, you sound insufferably smug.

I don't really know how I've managed to avoid these schmucks. It might be because I had an abusive misogynistic father and I've always steered well clear of anyone who reminded me of him. Or because I find nothing sexy about incompetence so I've truly never been drawn to men who are defeated by a washing machine. I don't think it's cute or funny or an opportunity to show my feminine superiority in the form of thankless shitwork. I just think it's weak and unmanly and I don't go for it.

I'm not particularly houseproud and my husband has always had higher standards than mine, so that helps too, I guess. I hear a lot of men are fine and then "turn" when a baby comes along, so I guess I'm just lucky mine didn't. But I was such a mess of PND, if he hadn't stepped up, we would just have lived in a tip. I wouldn't have cared at the time.

I don't know. I haven't been single for a long time, but while I was, I never worried about whether I was a bad person if I didn't want to give a man a second chance or put up with bullshit that annoyed me from day four. If I were dating now, at a different life stage, I don't know what mistakes I'd make. But back then, I just never seemed to draw these types.

@DorothyZbornakIsAQueen I’m genuinely sorry if that’s how the post comes across. It certainly wasn’t my intention.

My husband is great but that's why I've never created a post on AIBU or relationships about him. I think the useless tossers are overrepresented on MN. Probably still very common, but overrepresented.

@DrSbaitso 100% agree. I saw this the other day and thought it was the worst example I’ve ever come across. Can you imagine being with a man this pathetic? www.buzzfeed.com/shelbyheinrich/tiktok-woman-husband-ableism?d_id=3047203&ref=bffbbuzzfeed&utm_source=dynamic&utm_campaign=bffbbuzzfeed&fbclid=IwAR3moavFA9c7VRC5hnvjrUJ-MJusyyrZd7p1TIjTGfe71ISRZsv6S8tJyGI

@WhyYesYABU Very true! We don’t get people posting about great relationships very often (why would they?) do it does tend to paint a rather depressing picture of the world. It’s important to remember that it’s not necessarily representative.

I would be interested to know how you define ‘fair share’ of chores. Do you work the same amount of hours? Do you have kids? And if so, who deals with all the kid-related admin?
A lot of women I know say that their OH does his share, but actually the majority of planning and organising still falls to the woman.

Yeah.

I'm not blaming any women for this. It's only after I spent time on MN seeing women all the time asking if they're in the wrong after their husbands act like total shits over housework and leisure time that it occurred to me I don't really do this.

@Elisheva Personally, I’d consider it to be fair and equitable if you both have roughly equal amounts of leisure time. It’s not an exact science, but DH and I both work 9-5 jobs, so it does make working things out easier for us than it might for other couples.

In terms of specific tasks, I do all of the cooking and food related stuff. He does all the day to day cleaning/tidying (cleaner comes fortnightly for proper ‘deep’ cleans), all laundry and the bins. Those are our ‘set’ tasks. Everything else we do as and when it needs to be done and some things we tend to alternate. I am far too lazy to do the majority of planning and organising.

No kids, as of yet. There will have be a shift and reassessment when we do have them and I’m on ML. But subsequent to that, we’ll have a similar setup to the above (with considerably less leisure time, I suspect 😂).

Well, I do do more of things like gift giving, birthday party arranging and so on. And more housework. But I'm part time. My husband definitely does his share for being full time. Actually he came in and unloaded the dishwasher and cleaned the stove unbidden just now while I was pissing about on MN on my phone.

See I think kids makes the real difference to the balance in a relationship. There is just so much stuff to organise around them, and one person needs to be in charge of that because otherwise it wouldn’t work. When the woman is the one who reduces her hours to look after children then she takes it on, and that’s when it becomes unbalanced. It’s easy to do when there’s just two of you.

@Elisheva If one of you reduces your work hours (or leaves work entirely) to do more childcare or take the lead in XYZ, then that’s fine. It’s not something that people I know tend to do, and our brothers on both sides have wives, kids and our exact same setup (and work it out so that they get equal leisure time). It works for them and I’m confident it will work for us. However, I understand that other couples have other arrangements that work for them. That’s not what I’m asking about, though.

I’m asking about male strategic incompetence around domestic labour and situations where there is a clear imbalance with which the woman is unhappy.

So how would you deal with it?

The only thing I notice is those who say there is a fair split of chores have no children.

@Elisheva I think I’ve just told you how we would deal with it?

@LemonDrizzles That hasn’t been my experience. I know people with kids who have what I (and they) consider a fair chore split. And there have been numerous posts on here by women who have no kids, but still have partners who expect them to do all the domestic labour.

So you would say: I’m doing XYZ, and you’re only doing Z, intermittently. That’s not fair, let’s make it fair.

And OH says, “Yes, of course. What would you like me to do?”

How would you answer that?

@Elisheva

So you would say: I’m doing XYZ, and you’re only doing Z, intermittently. That’s not fair, let’s make it fair.

And OH says, “Yes, of course. What would you like me to do?”

How would you answer that?

In my relationship? He wouldn’t say ‘what would you like me to do?’ because he’s aware of the concept of emotional labour and that project managing household tasks isn’t something I’m willing or should be expected to to do. My husband and I have conversations and find solutions, I don’t delegate him tasks.

In other people’s situations? I have no idea. That’s one of the things I’m asking. What would you say?

@Ionlydomassiveones I’m glad you worked things out!