Children's access arrangements

[wafflieversatile]

I'll keep this as brief as I can:

ExH left 6 years ago, went to work night out, fell in love with a woman he met and never came back.

ExH now married to this woman and they live 4.5 hours drive away from us with her DC.

I live where I did during my marriage to ExH with my 2 sons now aged 7 and 9. I am now happily remarried and have a 2 year old too. I'm an NHS worker so money is tight.

ExH step son is also 9 and has a history of hurting my sons, they don't particularly like him for this reason. ExH had an inheritance of over £1m. This is relevant further down this post.

Divorce was prompt, both happy with the financial split, contact between sons and ExH was sporadic for the first year as he felt he needed to prioritise setting up his new life. No court orders or anything. Then after a year he demanded EOW and 50/50 school holidays (when they were old enough). I agreed to this on the basis the weekend contact took place at his parents home which was approximately 45 minutes from where the children and I live. They only did the 4.5 hour journey (9 hours there and back in total) during school holidays.

Fast forward to now, ExH parents have moved to where he now lives so the option of local contact was removed. He insisted the boys did the travel to his home EOW.

Both boys are now at an age where they don't want to do the long journey to their dads in a weekend, they want to do their weekend sports here.

After a huge blow up from ExH and sons, it was decided that ExH would do one weekend a month of contact by staying locally in a hotel. He doesn't work due to inheritance and he splashes the cash on them (this Christmas they each received a laptop, an x box x, a ps5 and £200 of v bucks). So my point on this bit is that something basic like an air b'n'b or premier inn is very much within his budget. He now rents a huge beach front house once a month so that he can have all the extended family stay (circa £1200 for the weekend, admittedly we live in expensive area).

This morning they were both begging me not to send them to their dad again this weekend as they don't want to go to his home. They want to do their sports and they both say they want to chill as they've just got back into school routine.

My AIBU is two fold really - firstly is the current contact arrangement unreasonable in your opinion?

Secondly, what would you suggest in my shoes would be a reasonable contact plan?

I have considered whether they could just see him one weekend in 4 and then more time in school holidays but they don't want to do that and to be honest I would lose out actual quality time with them (I work full time across 4 days a week but can take holiday to be with them during school holidays).

Ideally they would only do the trip to his home during school holidays but is that unreasonable?

Many thanks in advance for opinions and ideas.

Not unreasonable.

That’s a piss take of a journey time, it was his choice to move and he more than has the means to move closer.

I'd leave it with him to sort it out. Tell him the DC don't want to travel, its not fair for them to miss their activities, and it's up to him to come up with an arrangement that they are happy with.

@Hospedia

I'd leave it with him to sort it out. Tell him the DC don't want to travel, its not fair for them to miss their activities, and it's up to him to come up with an arrangement that they are happy with.

We've tried this. Resulted in him driving down anyway, kicking off at the kids and I. This was just after lockdown restrictions were lifted.

He thinks it's me manipulating them, they just tell me they're scared to tell him the truth because he blows up if they don't agree with him.

@BitcherOfBlakiven

Not unreasonable.

That’s a piss take of a journey time, it was his choice to move and he more than has the means to move closer.

That's basically it in a nut shell!

My understanding is rather don't travel now just to a luxury beach house nearby.

If it is nearby then surely they still continue their sports commitments but with their Dad facilitating this?

An aside note - is there no scope in the divorce to have his inheritance looked at? I'm no legal whizz clearly , I believe there is a line in divorce decrees which basically says "this is final - no takebacks", but not all decrees have this line. If yours doesn't, could there be scope that you could have a judge take another look and decide whether you are entitled to anything else? As RP I would think its fair to have it at least looked into...

Or, has his child maintenance gone up since he came into all this money?

I'm sure someone with more knowledge will be along to correct/add to this point.

@SeasonFinale

My understanding is rather don't travel now just to a luxury beach house nearby.

If it is nearby then surely they still continue their sports commitments but with their Dad facilitating this?

Sorry I should clarify, he now has managed to say he excludes his school Holiday contact from the EOW agreement so they only end up staying here on his weekends rarely.

When we discussed it before the kids and I were under the impression if they went to his home for school holiday contact then then next contact weekend would be at the beach house/local. He says not.

I think you possibly need to approach a solicitor and / or consider mediation. If your dc were teens then I would agree with allowing them to prioritise sports. But at 7 and 9, they would - legally - only get minimal input, and the general feeling would be to prioritise contact. That said, as he is the one who moved away, the onus is on him to facilitate the travelling.

@mynameismaybe

An aside note - is there no scope in the divorce to have his inheritance looked at? I'm no legal whizz clearly , I believe there is a line in divorce decrees which basically says "this is final - no takebacks", but not all decrees have this line. If yours doesn't, could there be scope that you could have a judge take another look and decide whether you are entitled to anything else? As RP I would think its fair to have it at least looked into...

Or, has his child maintenance gone up since he came into all this money?

I'm sure someone with more knowledge will be along to correct/add to this point.

It's a good point - it was looked at at the time but to be honest I stand to one day inherit a hell of a lot too so my view was to clean break and take the chance. The money doesn't bother me in terms of I wouldn't want his family money, I just hope he's got a watertight will for my sons sakes.

@ColdTattyWaitingForSummer

I think you possibly need to approach a solicitor and / or consider mediation. If your dc were teens then I would agree with allowing them to prioritise sports. But at 7 and 9, they would - legally - only get minimal input, and the general feeling would be to prioritise contact. That said, as he is the one who moved away, the onus is on him to facilitate the travelling.

Over the years I have had a good solicitor but the trouble is ExH, despite his wealth, insists on self representation so it ends up costing me thousands that I don't have spare. I guess you could argue the money should be worth it if it resolves the situation though, so point taken.

My DH's ex wife moved 3 hours away and the children come to us EOW and half of the holidays. They have a court order in place and it's about 5 years old now. They are similar ages. She has tried to reduce contact once since the CO was implemented and was told no. Her reasoning was that they would rather do clubs instead. Judge told her that she has them 75% of the time and clubs can be done then. Doing clubs in the other 25% of time is not more important than a relationship with dad. Judge also said that even at 9, the children were too young to make a choice like this as they are unable to "understand the far reaching consequences of not having a relationship with their father".

As my DH does all of the driving (there and back) the judge was happy to let this set up continue as long as my DH was happy to do all that distance.

In my experience, a judge would not seek to reduce contact between your children and their father unless he were putting them in danger. Obviously I'm not 100% as each case is judged on its own merits. But that is what happened with us.

Tbh I think at those ages contact shouldn’t be their choice, what if they didn’t want to come home would you be happy with him keeping them then? Or if they didn’t want to go to school would you just not send them?

Well, being as he’s a shouty, aggressive arsehole, I can see why they don’t want to go.

@PeeAche

My DH's ex wife moved 3 hours away and the children come to us EOW and half of the holidays. They have a court order in place and it's about 5 years old now. They are similar ages. She has tried to reduce contact once since the CO was implemented and was told no. Her reasoning was that they would rather do clubs instead. Judge told her that she has them 75% of the time and clubs can be done then. Doing clubs in the other 25% of time is not more important than a relationship with dad. Judge also said that even at 9, the children were too young to make a choice like this as they are unable to "understand the far reaching consequences of not having a relationship with their father".

As my DH does all of the driving (there and back) the judge was happy to let this set up continue as long as my DH was happy to do all that distance.

In my experience, a judge would not seek to reduce contact between your children and their father unless he were putting them in danger. Obviously I'm not 100% as each case is judged on its own merits. But that is what happened with us.

Thank you for this @PeeAche it's good to see it from another perspective because sometimes I think am I just being clouded by the fact ExH is an arsehole in my opinion.

I have no issue with the amount of contact or the school holiday contact location, it's purely the term time trips that cause problems.

If they were teens I would get it re sporting commitments.
But I think they are too young and the priority should be facilitating contact sorry.
I had the same issue and ex husband ran them to rugby and football. When they got older they generally stayed here if they had a big game.

I agree that 9 hours of traveling in a weekend is a lot. My ex step kids lived 3 hours away and we often all traveled to exMIL for every other weekend and when my DD startedschool nursery I stopped it and we went down every once every 4 or 6 weeks while ex continued the original arrangement as my DD was so tired after all the travel and the full on weekend that the next few days at nursery and home were a nightmare. I don't know what you can do about it but I totally understand where you are coming from.

Unfortunately it sounds like he's a selfish arse and you won't be able to change that

Whilst it all sounds very difficult and complicated,the one thing I will say is...

If there is no court order for contact then you have as much say in the arrangements as dad does. So if you and the kids say only 1 weekend a month doing the travel, the other weekend stay local - he can disagree and negotiate - but he does not get to automatically overrule...

I think you need to take this one back to the courts/lawyers sadly.

Hi chose for move away

The kids are off an age they dont want to go, soon my opinion shouldn't be forced to. So he has a choice

He either comes to your area EOW, and sees them, or he doesn’t and sees them once a month when he rents his beach house

Could you be there when the kids tell him how they feel and they don’t wan5 to do the journey, and that the other child hurts them? Then if he kicks off at them you have evidence he is not prepared ro listen to them, and you can walk away with the kids

The thing is @PeeAche some clubs only operate at weekends. I do martial arts; there are classes in the week but all graduations/gradings/black belt prep is on a Saturday. Sometimes I can rearrange, but it very much depends on the instructors being free and not holding the rest of the class back.

@wafflieversatile no problem. I love your username by the way. I can practically smell the waffles. 🤤

It's not to say that your ex isn't an arsehole. The two scenarios are not mutually exclusive. 😂
But I would say that it's unlikely to change. Court would be very expensive and you might find yourself saddled with half of the driving to boot.

Try to remember that the long drive is less damaging for your children (overall) than feeling abandoned by one of the people that made them. These are formative years and it really is good for them to know that their dad is there for them in some capacity (even if he upped sticks and moved 4 hours away - such a crappy thing to do!)

It will help them grow up feeling loved and confident.

And it won't be for much longer. Once they are in secondary school, they will become much pickier about what they do with their weekends! Nobody sees much of them then and your ex will be left trying to argue with a teenager (good luck to him!)

@ChrissyPlummer

The thing is *@PeeAche* some clubs only operate at weekends. I do martial arts; there are classes in the week but all graduations/gradings/black belt prep is on a Saturday. Sometimes I can rearrange, but it very much depends on the instructors being free and not holding the rest of the class back.

No doubt, no doubt. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, I'm just letting the OP know of my experience with it. The ages of the children involved are very comparable and so I thought I might have useful knowledge for her.

It may be very different for OP. In our case, it was mum that upped and moved with kids. And not to be nearer to family or work, but just for a fresh start. Judge felt it was RP being obstructive to contact. Judge may have a different view point if it's the NRP that upped sticks.

My niece had a 5hr drive every contact weekend, it was brutal, but she liked the one on one time it gave her with her dad for a chat. As a young adult, she now says the car ride was actually the best bit. As long as they’re home at a decent time on the return journey then maybe it just needs reframing?

My DC are older than yours and whinge enough when we drive somewhere half an hour away so I can’t imagine forcing them to sit in a car for 4.5 hours every other weekend, they would hate every second.

They don’t want to do it, that’s probably the most important fact here. If they were desperate to see him then fair enough but they’d rather not bother if it means such a long drive. Your ex needs to accept this and sort an alternative method out. It’s too much for any child to deal with or even an adult tbh, I wouldn’t want to do that EOW either.

I think that £1 million isn’t going to last long if he spends like it sounds like he’s spending!

@gingerscot

My niece had a 5hr drive every contact weekend, it was brutal, but she liked the one on one time it gave her with her dad for a chat. As a young adult, she now says the car ride was actually the best bit. As long as they’re home at a decent time on the return journey then maybe it just needs reframing?

I think this is a good point. It's not like the kids are actually doing the driving. They can chat, read, snooze, listen to music etc.