To ask you if our dentist can strike off husband from their nhs patient list without telling us?

[Teefteefteef]

So posting here for traffic:
Husband lost half of a filled tooth last night. The tooth is more filling than actual tooth. It looks very much like it needs to either be removed or crowned. Not in pain yet but only half the tooth is remaining. He called our nhs dentist to book an appointment. Was told that seeing as he hasn’t had an appointment over the last 3 years that they now consider him a new patient and he would have to pay full private fees because, (surprise surprise,) they aren’t taking on nhs patients at the moment. Does anybody know if there is a code of conduct I can reference? To see if they are actually allowed to just strike people off? We think this may be a bit unfair seeing as they weren’t actually seeing anything other than emergency patients the majority of the time for the first huge chunk of covid. Any insight would be very helpful.

I don't understand the comments people are making about dentists booting people off so they can get private. They make the same money whether the patient is NHS or private don't they? As the NHS patients have a portion of their costs paid (by the NHS.) So if they did 2 crowns (for example,) that cost £1200 for the two, the NHS patient would pay the tier 3 amount (£282,) and the NHS would fork out the rest for the dentist.

Happy to be corrected. But I am pretty sure this is what happens.

Many private dental fees - especially for crowns/bridges/dentures/veneers can run into the low 4 figures. I don't understand why people don't keep up their dental checks. You need a tooth crowned - max £282 NHS, as much as £700-£800 privately. Sometimes more.

@Looneytune253

What?!? This is crazy. I had regular appointments with my dentist but it's probably been close to 3 years now thru Covid etc and would be disappointed if I was struck off

I would ring them tomorrow, the chances are high that you have been struck off. I hope not, but I expect you have. Covid has been around for 1 year and 10 months, and most dentists have been open for more than half of that time. You can't use that as an excuse. They definitely won't buy it.

I do agree with @WonderfulYou though, that they really should have cut people some slack with us having covid. Maybe give people an extra year. Of course, with my friend's sister, the OP's DH, and @Looneytune253 who I just quoted, they would still be booted off, as they have hit 3 years, and my friend's sister and the OP's DH are only contacting them because they NEED them now.

I still feel for them though, because as I said, some dental fees are hella expensive. I wouldn't wish being booted off the NHS dental practice on anyone. It's very upsetting, because everyone knows that the fees are limitless. Like vet bills. (Not having a go a dentists OR vets by the way, I am just saying... )

My dentist has only been seeing emergency patients for most of the time during Covid, and even now their website says that routine examination appointments are 'limited'. I'm not even sure what that means. DH has been seen recently for emergency treatment, which was probably more extensive than it would have been had he been able to have the usual check-ups in the interim. Our last actual check-ups were just before the first lockdown, but subsequent ones were cancelled. I'd be mightily pissed off to be removed from their NHS list just because they couldn't see me.

There is no patient registration for NHS dental patients since 2006. It’s not like your GP, where you are registered at a practice. A NHS dental practice doesn’t “register” anyone so they have no obligation to see a patient unless they are currently in the middle of a course of dental treatment with them.

This is standard practice in NHS practices. They need to strike people off to allow for new patients

I book my next appointment when paying for my check up.
My dentist receptionist rings the day before my appointment to remind me.

Yes. Why would they keep your husband registered under the NHS scheme when he is not using the NHS service as it is designed? It removes the opportunity for someone who wants to look after their oral health, with regular check ups, to utilise the service appropriately.

@DahliaMacNamara

My dentist has only been seeing emergency patients for most of the time during Covid, and even now their website says that routine examination appointments are 'limited'. I'm not even sure what that means. DH has been seen recently for emergency treatment, which was probably more extensive than it would have been had he been able to have the usual check-ups in the interim. Our last actual check-ups were just before the first lockdown, but subsequent ones were cancelled. I'd be mightily pissed off to be removed from their NHS list just because they couldn't see me.

I wouldn't have thought they would tbh. Not if you're making the effort, and they are saying that they are limiting appointments.

I am with an NHS dentist, and had to have 2 crowns in August/September, one new one (as an old filling broken away,) and one replacement one. Would have cost some £1100 - £1300, but cost £282. As I said, the private fees are limitless. There is no 'cap' and you could end up paying thousands.

I would still touch base with your dentist @DahliaMacNamara to double check when your next appointment is, and to make sure you're not de-registered!

@Riapia

I book my next appointment when paying for my check up. My dentist receptionist rings the day before my appointment to remind me.

Same here. That's why I can't fathom really how people can go/have gone 3 years.

The same thing happened to me and all I can say is good luck finding a new dentist! I called in excess of 50 and couldn’t find one accepting nhs patients, I called nhs England who told me they had a duty to find me a dentist but could be anywhere in the country! My dentist is now 57 miles away 🤷‍♀️

Yeah they do, it happened to my friend and she had to go to my private dentist in the end. I've been private for years now as my dentist changed from NHS to private when they opened their own surgery so I followed them. I did tell my friend if she found an NHS dentist to make sure she sees them even if there's nothing wrong, to keep her on the books.

@LittleRoundRobin no that is not correct and has't been ever
the NHS have a set fee for crowns a band 3 treatment in England the patient pays the band 3 fee and the NHS pays an extra percentage but it is still band 3 The NHS have a standard set of fees with fixed patient contributions
a private crown is not the same price without NHS contribution the private crown fee will be what the dentist decides a private dentist will have a fee scale but it won't be the same as dentist down the road, the fee list will vary depending on type of crown whether it has a post whether it is ceramic composite or gold it will be more than NHS by some way as often use better colours more translucent porcelain with more shading etc though the accuracy of fit should be no different

the system is different in Scotland where different tyopes of crown have different fees on NHS and pt pays 80% unless exempt up to a maximum so in England it is a band 3 payment whether you have 1 crown or 3, in Scotland it would be a fee for each crown

@LittleRoundRobin

I don't understand the comments people are making about dentists booting people off so they can get private. They make the same money whether the patient is NHS or private don't they? As the NHS patients have a portion of their costs paid (by the NHS.) So if they did 2 crowns (for example,) that cost £1200 for the two, the NHS patient would pay the tier 3 amount (£282,) and the NHS would fork out the rest for the dentist.

Happy to be corrected. But I am pretty sure this is what happens.

Many private dental fees - especially for crowns/bridges/dentures/veneers can run into the low 4 figures. I don't understand why people don't keep up their dental checks. You need a tooth crowned - max £282 NHS, as much as £700-£800 privately. Sometimes more.

My dentist who retired recently stopped taking new NHS patients but kept on his existing ones quite a few years ago now. He said that dealing with NHS bureaucracy was driving him crazy and he had to chase to get paid every single time. He said that the amount that he could be paid by the NHS was capped which meant he had to dial his treatment back to what the NHS would cover and not what might be best for the patient. He said that it wasn't the thing about being able to fit more private patients into treament time but about having to do much less admin for the private patients.

Our dentist cancelled DS1s appointment and told me they would send another one. They didn't, I called them, and was told he was off their books as he'd missed his last appointment. He was 2.

Yes they can BUT the last two years have not been normal times and many dentists have not been offering check ups.

Actually, for much of that time they have mostly/only been doing check ups. It's drilling that creates the risk and requires massive extra precautions.

I do agree with WonderfulYou though, that they really should have cut people some slack with us having covid. Maybe give people an extra year.

It's nothing to do with Covid, the DH hasn't been in touch for 3+ years.

NHS dentists have a contract which requires them to do preventative dental care- there simply aren't enough slots for surgery to keep people on their books who don't have check-ups.

Exactly the same thing happened to us, my husband hadn’t been in 3 years, called up to make an appointment and was told he’d been struck off. Neither of us had any idea this was a ‘thing’ and felt really annoyed the dentist hadn’t informed us as of course then we would have gone more regularly, but now from this thread it seems like this is common knowledge that somehow we’d just never heard of!

@TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross

Yes, they can - our dental practice is very clear on that: if we don’t make regular appointments for check-ups, we lose our place on their books. Not surprising - why should they keep you on as patients if you’re not using them?

That's ok if you can use them! I was due a check up at the start of lockdown in March 2020 which obviously didn't happen. Despite being able to open from June 2020 they remained closed for two more months while they decorated the surgery. I phoned when they finally reopened in August and they refused to make me an appointment as I had to wait to be contacted and not to call them again unless I had a problem. Guess what, I never heard from them.

I found a new dentist who is actually far better but it's annoying that they can pretty much do what they like. I can't help thinking if I'd asked to see them as a private patient they would have seen me but I wouldn't do it on principle.

This happened to us too. They had always sent us letters to say "your next checkup is due, please phone to make an appointment". Then they stopped sending them but didn't bother telling any of the NHS patients they were changing their booking system. When I phoned up to make appointments for us it turned out we'd gone overdue as they'd cancelled our appointments due to the pandemic, I'd been trying for months to rebook but we were now no longer on their books. I looked on their website & there were a lot of complaints from people in a similar position. They did try to get us to re-register as private patients but I told them that we were only with them as they were NHS, & why would we travel an hour each way by bus to them to spend a fortune on private dentistry when we could walk to a dentist in our home town. The receptionist got quite unpleasant with me & said I should have realised we'd gone overdue & it was irrelevant that they'd changed their booking procedure without giving notice... I'm afraid I wasn't very polite. I don't usually swear. It's costing us over £45 a month now for insurance that covers checkups & hygienist work only, no fillings etc but it's with a local dentist, not those scam artists that didn't even do a good job with DH's teeth anyway. Majority of the cost is for DH's cover.

It took us about a year to get registered with a new dentist as they were all closed, DH lost 2 teeth due to poor dental hygiene & a fall in the meantime. The very first things I bought at the start of the pandemic were oil of cloves, cocodamol, & an emergency filling kit from Boots.

[quote TeacupDrama]@LittleRoundRobin no that is not correct and has't been ever
the NHS have a set fee for crowns a band 3 treatment in England the patient pays the band 3 fee and the NHS pays an extra percentage but it is still band 3 The NHS have a standard set of fees with fixed patient contributions
a private crown is not the same price without NHS contribution the private crown fee will be what the dentist decides a private dentist will have a fee scale but it won't be the same as dentist down the road, the fee list will vary depending on type of crown whether it has a post whether it is ceramic composite or gold it will be more than NHS by some way as often use better colours more translucent porcelain with more shading etc though the accuracy of fit should be no different

the system is different in Scotland where different tyopes of crown have different fees on NHS and pt pays 80% unless exempt up to a maximum so in England it is a band 3 payment whether you have 1 crown or 3, in Scotland it would be a fee for each crown[/quote]
@TeacupDrama

I must be getting tired, because I can't make head nor tail of that post. ^

My dentist sent all their NHS patients letters last year informing us all that they no longer do NHS not even for children so everyone who wanted to stay had to pay for private treatment.
Most people had been with them for years.
We live in a small market town so now half the town have been trying to find a new dentist in the surrounding areas and we are all being told that there is either a waiting list of more than a thousand or they aren't taking on new clients.
I am so worried about it especially for my children because there is no way I can afford to pay private fees. We had been going since they were babies and all we got was Sorry, thanks for your years of loyalty

So I think YABU because your dh was lucky to have an NHS dentist and should have been going for his check ups.

@AnotherMansCause

This happened to us too. They had always sent us letters to say "your next checkup is due, please phone to make an appointment". Then they stopped sending them but didn't bother telling any of the NHS patients they were changing their booking system. When I phoned up to make appointments for us it turned out we'd gone overdue as they'd cancelled our appointments due to the pandemic, I'd been trying for months to rebook but we were now no longer on their books. I looked on their website & there were a lot of complaints from people in a similar position. They did try to get us to re-register as private patients but I told them that we were only with them as they were NHS, & why would we travel an hour each way by bus to them to spend a fortune on private dentistry when we could walk to a dentist in our home town. The receptionist got quite unpleasant with me & said I should have realised we'd gone overdue & it was irrelevant that they'd changed their booking procedure without giving notice... I'm afraid I wasn't very polite. I don't usually swear. It's costing us over £45 a month now for insurance that covers checkups & hygienist work only, no fillings etc but it's with a local dentist, not those scam artists that didn't even do a good job with DH's teeth anyway. Majority of the cost is for DH's cover.

It took us about a year to get registered with a new dentist as they were all closed, DH lost 2 teeth due to poor dental hygiene & a fall in the meantime. The very first things I bought at the start of the pandemic were oil of cloves, cocodamol, & an emergency filling kit from Boots.

That's bloody dreadful.

@PinkSparklyPussyCat

I found a new dentist who is actually far better but it's annoying that they can pretty much do what they like...

This pisses me off too. There should really be more control and governing over dentists, and they should ALL be NHS (IMO, before anyone starts!) And the fees should be capped. It's not like people choose to have dental problems and fillings etc...

Also, the dentists pre early-1980s have got a lot to answer for too, for 'drilling and filling' for cash, and doing work that was not needed. For that reason alone, people born before 1975, should have free dental treatment as a given.

My teeth were drilled and filled when I was a child/teen in the 1970s and early 1980s, and I have had many of the fillings drop out and need refilling over and over, and 5 of them have had to be crowned. I have also had 8 extracted.

Most people I know over 48-50, have a mouth full of fillings and crowns now. I swear if I had never gone to a dentist, my teeth would be in much better condition. At first glance, when I smile, my teeth look OK, as my first 6 (top and bottom, so 12 altogether,) look OK, and are fairly OK apart from 3 or 4 small white fillings. But all the back ones are compromised. Filled, crowned, or extracted ... I only actually have 24 teeth now, of the original 32.

Dentists are much better now, but as I said, ALL dental fees should be capped, as people don't CHOOSE to have dental issues.

I had the same dental surgery for 30 years. During covid lockdowns they were either closed, only accepting under 18s and then I was back working (self employed so no work no pay). The last chance I had to go they couldn’t find an appointment that I could make so they struck me off. Tried to tell them the first year was their fault but they weren’t bothered. Luckily found another dentist before their waiting list closed

Very glad I am a private dentist and can set my own fees. NHS dentistry is in its death throes.

@guiltynetter

It's not like the doctors - surely everyone knows you have to go to the dentist regularly to stay on?!

You can be strick off for not attending the doctors as DH found out last year. It had been 4 years since his last appointment and he'd been struck off about 18 months earlier.