(TW - possible abuse) AIBU to still be angry?

[Headwhirling]

This could be long but I’ll try not to go on!

Basically my question is should I say anything to my 84 year old mother?

When I was 15 she was having a relationship with a (married) man. She was divorced.

I had a boyfriend at the time and we were experimenting but I was still a virgin.

Her bloke would sometimes come round to the house but I tended to keep out of the way.
One day he came round but brought another bloke with him(from what I remember they worked together & it was probably a work day).
My mum and her bloke obviously wanted some time alone so the other bloke (I think he was probably about 20 / early 20s) came upstairs to talk to me.
More than talking happened-I remember he touched my breasts and between my legs (clothes on) and we did kiss.

I remember telling him I had a boyfriend, which makes me think I wanted it to stop.

It didn’t go further than that. I guess the men had to leave (maybe they were on their lunch break!)
My mum never mentioned it or asked me about it.

When I had my daughter, several years later, my mum was a social worker. She worked with a lot of families where there were child protection issues.
She was absolutely obsessed that my daughter would be abused by every man she came in to contact with.
I was a lone parent and met someone when my daughter was about 2. We had a relationship (mostly long distance) for about 2 years.
My mum implied he was only seeing me to get access to my daughter.
I am horrified to write that down.

I don’t think about this all the time but tonight it’s all come back with full force.
I feel so angry with my mum for putting me in that situation as a teenager and for then projecting it all on to me as a young mother on my own.

Do I say anything? Is her age (84) relevant?

Sorry if this has upset anyone and thanks for reading this far.

@Headwhirling.

What do you want to happen if you tell her?

I think it depends what you want.

Do you feel she knew and was complicit in some respect so are looking for an apology and acceptance of guilt?

Do you want to point out that she was a crap Mom who didn't protect you but made you feel like shit when you WERE being a good Mom?

What will that conversation mean and change for you?

No wonder you're still angry. Your mum actively put you in a position where you were abused in your own home - it's absolutely horrific.

I think whether you say anything to her depends on a few factors. Firstly is she in a position to have a conversation given her age? Is she too vulnerable to be up to it, does she have anything like dementia?

Next, what outcome would you like? How would you feel if the conversation goes badly or she denies it all? Are you happy to take the risk in order to have had chance to confront her or would it leave you feeling worse?

Lastly, are you happy to potentially lose the relationship you have with her over this? I don't think anyone reading here would doubt you, but who knows what lies she's told to herself over the years to justify what happened. Her reaction may just be to bury it deeper by avoiding you completely.

But ultimately if this feels important to you and you think you're OK with the consequences then do what you need to do. It might be a good idea to have a counselor or your doctor to be talking it through with before and after though.

YANBU to be angry.

Thanks for replying and for the flowers.

@SleepingStandingUp don’t think she knew exactly, but she put her needs way ahead of my safety I think.

@TooBigForMyBoots I think to be honest I want to punish her (I know that doesn’t sound great).
I’m pretty sure I know how she’d react. There would be quite a lot of drama, nothing actually about me, all about how she knows she was a terrible mother. This has happened before and it just shuts things down, because I ‘have’ to respond by saying ‘no you weren’t a terrible mother’.

Thanks @Rodion there’s a lot to think about.

I think the hypocrisy is what infuriates me, in regards to my own daughter.

I was / am not a perfect mother either (I don’t think there are many around!) but I would never accuse my daughter of deliberately endangering her children after doing exactly that myself (if that makes sense-tired now!).

P. S. I remember reading somewhere that it's reasonably common for parents who were abusive to fixate on the danger of their grandchildren being abused - spotting it when it's not there, accusing their own children of abusing the grandchildren etc.

No idea if it's a real documented phenomenon because I can't remember where I read it, but your OP struck a chord. It suggests she knows (even if not the details) how she failed as a mother and overcompensates by trying to prevent the same happening to her grandchild. Of course that's doubly hurtful to you because it insults your ability to keep your child safe yourself, whilst still not taking responsibility for what happened to you.

I really appreciate you reading and responding. I’ve only ever told one person (an ex-partner) and he was understandably furious on my behalf.

When I have thought about the incident I have usually half blamed myself.

Yes, you're making perfect sense. It sounds really hard.

Was she a terrible mother @Headwhirling? Do you suspect her hypervigilence around your children is because she knows she let you down?

She wasn’t a terrible mother @TooBigForMyBoots but she was and is quite difficult. Everything is about her. I live in fear of turning in to her!

I don’t think she actually knew what was going on over her head that day, but I don’t think she cared.

The hyper vigilance is a lot to do with her job at the time, where she was surrounded by children at risk, but didn’t seem able to accept that she was seeing a snapshot of society, rather than every family being in that situation.

But I’ve also wondered if it had something to do with guilt, even unconsciously.

My DM has done something similar in that she was telling me how to parent when she did the exact opposite with me. I shut it down by first saying "seriously? Given that you did X, Y and Z to me do you really think you have the right to tell me not to do those things?!"

When she responded with "I learned from my mistakes and I want you to do better than I did"

I responded with "Yes, I've learned from your mistakes too, so I don't need YOU to teach me to be better.".

She has since learned that if she tries to give me hypocritical advice then her poor parenting gets thrown back in her face and that is very painful for her, so she has dialled it right down.

I'm not sure from what you've written that your mum either knew or was responsible for your abuse. So I think yabu. At 15 you are well old enough be left alone at home, and also to tell your mother what had happened which it appears you didn't do from your post? I honestly don't know how raking this up when she's 84 is going to be helpful to either of you unless there's more to it than you've posted?

@RedHelenB I agree that there may be no benefit in raking this up.

I’m sorry that you think I was to blame. I wasn’t alone in the house, my mum and her bloke were downstairs. The younger man was sent upstairs to …..? (I don’t know how it would have been framed) to keep him out of the way.

I was 15.

I’m also wondering whether to tell my partner about what happened. If he’d been awake at 3am today I’m pretty sure I would have told him as it was all spinning around in my head.
But now I don’t know.
He doesn’t really have a relationship with my mum, I don’t see her that often (we live about 200 miles apart) and he doesn’t always come with me when I do visit.
But, I think it would completely change the way he thought about her and I would feel guilty about that I think.

In some ways, I regret never speaking to my mother about abuse that went on for several years from when I was about 9 to 15. I always resented my feelings that she hadn't been aware, but should have 'protected' me more (or was aware, but chose to ignore it). In many ways I felt angrier with her about that than the abuser.
It's twenty years since she died, but I still think about whether I should have had that conversation with her, and what her reaction would have been, probably as much as when she was alive.

If it was a one off, do you think your mother was aware - either at the time, or with hindsight, when she was expressing concern about your daughter?
What do you think will be acheived by telling her?
how will you feel if her reaction isn't the one that you'd hoped for?

If your mother worked with vulnerable children as a social worker, one would hope that she would be accepting of what you disclosed. - But do think through the options of how she might react, and how you would feel about that.

If the two of you had the conversation in relation to your daughter, it sounds as if you have a more open relationship than I did with my mother. If I still had the opportunity, I'd like to think that I would have the conversation now - I really wish I had done, whether as a child or thirty years ago when the memories of what had happened really started to impact.

I'm not sure from what you've written that your mum either knew or was responsible for your abuse

Inviting your partner round along with a random male friend that you’ve not met before, and sending him upstairs to your 15 year old daughter so you could have some time alone is 100% the mother’s responsibility and 100% NOT the fault of the fifteen year old OP. The bloke could have turned out to be lovely and horrified to find himself in that situation and could have gone and sat in another room- he didn’t. The mother didn’t know either way, because he was a stranger.

I am so angry on your behalf OP. I don’t know if telling your Mum will make you feel better or not, but you have every right to be angry.

There is something similar that I am battling about discussing with my own mother, she is 76. Knowing my mother though, she would be angry and cut me out of her life as she has done with my other siblings that have challenged her about things over the years. So I keep it in.

@ThinWomansBrain I’m sorry about your situation, it sounds awful. And I’m sorry you feel that regret about not addressing it with her. I need to consider all your points.

@TheVolturi sorry you are also struggling. I hope you are able to find the best way forward.

@RoseGoldEagle thank you for your words. It does mean a lot after all these years that other people can understand how horrible it would have been for me. Of course I thought I was very worldly wise at 15 but when I look back now (& meet 15 year olds) I can see how young I was.

[quote Headwhirling]@RedHelenB I agree that there may be no benefit in raking this up.

I’m sorry that you think I was to blame. I wasn’t alone in the house, my mum and her bloke were downstairs. The younger man was sent upstairs to …..? (I don’t know how it would have been framed) to keep him out of the way.

I was 15.[/quote]
I didn't imply you were to blame. You were 15 and under the age of consent. From your OP it didn't state that he was sent upstairs to be with you, that puts a different slant on things and your Mother was irresponsible given her background in SW.