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Original poster

At true breaking point with sleep

52 replies

Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 12:54

Posting here for traffic sorry.

I have a 3 and 2 year old, they are both the worst sleepers. Neither have napped since before turning one, and they are a struggle to get down. Have to sit with Each for half an hour. They go down at 6-7 and by ten both are up. The 3 year old is in a toddler bed to wanders down if I’m still up or into my bed if not. By 3am the 3 year old who is in a cot in my room wakes screeching and comes into my bed too.

They both kick abs fight either side or me poking each other and snatching the duvet, then when this gets boring they begin poking me, pulling my hair and laughing. We are all up abs downstairs by 5am without fail.

I just don’t know what to do anymore, I Am truly exhausted and I don’t have the energy to play with them, I am beginning to resent them which is an awful feeling

About six months ago the perinatal health visitor who I was still seeing referred us to another lady who was an “expert” on sleep who said to put them in their bed/cot and just leave them. I tried it, it didn’t work, and I couldn’t bear it.

Sorry I say it didn’t work, it worked in the sense that they both eventually cried themselves to sleep but I felt horrid.

Please help me! I can’t go on like this, I look and feel ill

OP posts:
Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 12:55

I have depression and anxiety anyway, I am taking my medication meticulously but this morning I have just been weepy, been up since 4 this time and I know there is no break until at least 6, and a brief one at that.

OP posts:
RedskyThisNight · 26/12/2021 12:57

I've been through this with one child and the advice you got (leave them to it) was absolutely the only thing that worked. The 3 year old at least should understand the concept of staying in bed until morning unless good reason.

We put up a stair gate on our bedroom door (not DC's as going to the toilet was a reason to get up). If he got up we asked him what was wrong. If there was genuinely something wrong we would obviously see to it, otherwise he was told to go back to bed and then ignored.

yes, it was horrible, yes it took a while and yes I thought my heart would break, but if you are at breaking point anyway (I was) then I think it is the way to go.
(They may still get up at 5 but if they sleep from 7-5 the world just seems a better place).

Youdoyoutoday · 26/12/2021 12:58

I'd sleep train them, you can't carry on like this.
When you do it though just keep going back in and put them back in bed, don't talk, just keep going back in and keep putting them back in bed.

You don't have to just leave them crying for ages.

Good luck

RedskyThisNight · 26/12/2021 13:00

Youdoyoutoday 's suggestion is also a good one.

I should say this didn't work with my determined non-sleeper as he thought it was a game and it just ended up being even more exhausting for me. The "totally ignoring" method worked better for us.

Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 13:04

The ignoring could work with the 2 year old but the three year old will not stay in his room unless literally locked. We were told by health visitor to use a dressing gown cord tied to a close by door so he can open it but not get out. I tried this but he was so distressed. It just feels evil because I read time abs time again that leaving them is like abandoning them (to be fair this advice is for young babies but I worry they will feel I don’t love them). I’m just not cut out for this

OP posts:
coodawoodashooda · 26/12/2021 13:05

I found going to a homeopath helpful.

Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 13:06

Sadly I haven’t the money for a homeopath, I’d try anything if I did!

OP posts:
WouldIBeATwat · 26/12/2021 13:07

6-7pm is very early for them to be going to bed, isn’t it?

WouldIBeATwat · 26/12/2021 13:08

@coodawoodashooda

I found going to a homeopath helpful.
How does that placebo effect work then? You think it’s doing something so are calmer around the children at bedtime who are then calmer for bed?
Notwithittoday · 26/12/2021 13:08

Goodness me. Poor you. For a start I think they need to be in their own rooms or at least not in your room. I’d get a gate for their rooms and once they’re in there that’s it for the night. By all
Means go in to them if they cry but then leave again, they need the message that that’s their night time space. Are they in nappies still at night? If they are urinating or need to urinate that could be waking them up. I used to get my dd up at that age at 10pm and take her for a wee, then put her pack to bed. She was always an early riser 5/ 6am so I used to have a tv in her room and put peppa on for her and get another hour myself. Sometimes she’d fall asleep again anyway. Not ideal but I needed the extra hour to function

mayblossominapril · 26/12/2021 13:10

It’s really difficult. Is there someone else who can take them for part of the night to give you a break?
Things I have tried that have worked at different points.
Putting them to bed later
Going to bed when they go to bed
Making sure they eat enough during the day so they don’t wake hungry in the night
Enough fresh air and exercise
Leave one or both with someone else for a bit, works better if the house is big enough so you can’t hear the on off crying.

It’s worth trying to get them to nap even if it means some exercise for them a snack then either push in buggy or drive round in car until they fall asleep and you take a coffee and book with you to read whilst you are parked up with two sleeping children.

My DP was handed a screaming toddler at 3 this morning when I’d had enough.

Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 13:11

6 is earlyish but they don’t nap, and actually I think 7 is quite a normal time? The three year old is in nappies only at night, the 3 year old has only just turned two and I haven’t even started potty training him yet. They will have to share a room, I worry they will wake each other up abs make things even worse.

When you put this age child to bed to you stay until they fall asleep or do you read story say night and leave? I feel clueless - I have a 13 year old also and he was a dream so I’ve never had to deal with this issue

OP posts:
Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 13:13

Sorry the 2 year old has just turned two, obviously

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coodawoodashooda · 26/12/2021 13:13

Ouch.

WouldIBeATwat · 26/12/2021 13:13

7pm wouldn’t be normal in this house. DD was always an owl so being asleep at 7pm was either a nap or she was very poorly indeed.

ToykotoLosAngeles · 26/12/2021 13:14

It is quite early. Mine is 3 and does now sleep through but the absolute earliest he will sleep is 7.30.

girafferafferaffe · 26/12/2021 13:14

7 is a normal time for bed. I sometimes get my 4 year old upstairs for 6:30 as she gets so tired.

AperolWhore · 26/12/2021 13:15

At that age they both should be down for 7pm latest and both napping for 1.5-2 hours per day. Do they have white noise machines in their rooms, pitch black rooms with no lights anywhere and a set bedtime routine such as dinner, bath, story then bed?

I can highly recommend the blissful baby expert and even if you paid for one call with her she would be able to help x

ToykotoLosAngeles · 26/12/2021 13:16

I'm friends with 8 NCT mums. 7 out of 8 of us have (just turned) 3 year olds that haven't napped for months.

WouldIBeATwat · 26/12/2021 13:17

At that age they both should be down for 7pm latest

WTF? Who says? Why?

As long as they are getting enough sleep it really doesn’t matter what time it happens. Maybe they are larks and naturally awake early leading to an early bedtime, but if they aren’t then putting them to bed at the wrong time could be the issue.

(Millions of kids elsewhere in the world aren’t asleep - or even fed - by 7pm every night!)

DebbieHarrysCheekbones · 26/12/2021 13:19

Do you have a partner?

I have been here with two do my three kids and my youngest is still in bed with me.
It is absolute torture and I still feel like a shell even though at least he is now asleep by 11 pm most nights. Most nights it takes until then and countless trips upstairs putting him back in bed settling and creeping out again.

With my daughter once she started school she was so tired it just stopped. Now she is a great sleeper as is my eldest

We have been prescribed melatonin, seen specialist consultants and the sleep training was hell on earth. The screaming sounded like they were being murdered and I felt so mean.

I am sorry I don’t have any firm advice as I also tried

  • baths with all kinds of herbal and age appropriate sleep inducing things
  • white noise
  • reading
  • no tv or tablet time at least an hour and a half before bath time and bed
  • food to encourage sleep like bananas, porridge
  • fresh air
  • routines

To a great extent none of it worked

You’re not alone with it, many of us have been there but sending you some normal support

Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 13:20

They don’t have a strict bedtime routine no, I find having a bath excites them rather than winds them down so I do it around 5. I read a bedtime story, the three year old has a tonie box and a dinosaur nightlight projector thing which has made no difference either way. They both refuse to even lie down without a bottle of milk - another failing.

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Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 13:21

I do have a partner but the less said about him the better. Another thread exists re that. I won’t rely on him so I’ll have to figure this out alone, they’ll need to be in a room together. It feels impossible

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Skinnymimi · 26/12/2021 13:21

Hello lovely. I have been shamed to death by all friends and family for letting the kids cry themselves to sleep. You would have thought I was a baby eating witch. Actually LOST friends over this. A week in and all children slept non stop 12/13 hours per night and are full of life and energy during the day. I am fresh as a daisy. All others are exhausted with kids upset because they do not get enough sleep. It is just a habit that takes a week to 10 days to take. Let them cry!

Original poster
Essexmummy88 · 26/12/2021 13:22

Fair enough to the poster saying 7 is early but I need some sort of alone time and evening to myself so I’m not having them up any later, I can’t.

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