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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think my cleaner should stay for two hours?

231 replies

Holeandthentwo · 20/12/2021 15:27

I pay for a cleaner to clean my house every other week. The minimum you can pay for is two hours, which is fine.

However, I’ve noticed over the months that she leaves early. At first it was only ten minutes or so and I didn’t care, but it’s built up and built up so that today she arrived at 2pm and left at 3pm. I always make myself scarce when she’s there so I’m not getting in her way, but I know the times because my Ring doorbell sends an alert as she arrives and leaves.

I’m torn about whether to say anything, because it’s now half the time I pay for, but she is a good cleaner, provides all the equipment, and is happy to let herself in with the key, and I feel trusting of her having a key.

Should I say anything? Or just accept that she can clean the house in half the time I pay for?

YABU - say nothing because the clean is still being done

YANBU - say something because it’s not what I’m paying for

OP posts:
rainbowstardrops · 21/12/2021 07:29

Yeah that's not on! I agree, just mention you'd noticed she was getting everything finished in an hour (doesn't sound very thorough!) and could she do x y and z to take her up to the 2 hours.
If she says no then contact the owner/find another cleaner.

Blackkitty · 21/12/2021 08:47

Ergh.. I had this, pay for two hours and she was there forty five minutes. Didn’t even clean the loo! I think she glanced at it and decided it was already clean… but I have a very high standard so I could tell it hadn’t been touched. We moved so I was able to get rid without it being too awkward. Haven’t got another one. YANBU

IWhipMyHairBackAndForth · 21/12/2021 08:50

If she's getting everything done in one hour, can't you just say from now on you'll book her for 1 hour instead of 2?

rookiemere · 21/12/2021 08:51

@Thatldo - what on earth has the fact that most cleaners are women got to do with it ? Are you saying that because we're both the same gender we should let someone do less than what they're meant to ?

I pay someone- male or female- for two hours work, that's what I expect to get, and most cleaners are not on minimum wage.

IWhipMyHairBackAndForth · 21/12/2021 08:52

Sorry I've just realised you said the minimum is 2 hours.

Newmumatlast · 21/12/2021 09:00

@TellySavalashairbrush

I am going against the majority and saying YABU, largely because I was a house cleaner years ago and know how bloody hard I worked. If her work is of a good standard and she manages to get everything done to your expected standards, then I fail to see why she should be penalised and paid less tbh. If in the second hour you have other tasks for her to do, then of course ask her and if she says she hasnt got time, this can then be when you need a serious chat. I left an employer who I worked really well for, who quibbled that I left 20 minutes early one week (I had done everything as expected) and didn't feel I deserved £20 and offered me £10 instead. £10 for dealing with her teenager's filthy bedroom and the family bathroom that was like something out of a horror movie before cleaning- told her to keep the money and never went back again.
It's a balance isnt it. If you get what you expected for 2 hours but they complete it early arguably they deserve the value of 2 hours in pay as they've given the value of 2 hours in work. However if they leave excessively early you then feel that even if they worked fast you cant have received 2 hours worth as how would they do that amount in half the time.

This is why being paid in hours rather than for the job is not always the best way. It means people who are very good actually get a rubbish return as they are doing much more work for the same money compared with a less productive worker in the same 2 hours. Ideally people would agree a sum for the task and then it wouldnt matter how long it took. I guess its difficult with cleaning as you dont know what you'll face each week hence the hours based agreement. But then if you have an hours based agreement contractually you should be there working for that amount of hours regardless and the person paying has the absolute right to expect you not to leave even 5min early.

balanceo · 21/12/2021 09:00

£14 an hour - in cash ? So, assuming not being declared to the Inland Revenue, the equivalent of £20 per hour for anyone who does pay tax/NI.

notanothertakeaway · 21/12/2021 09:11

@maddening

It is easier if she works for someone if you don't to deal with ending her service, next time she is coming be home and say you need to borrow your key back as a friend/ relative is coming etc etc. Once you have the key back call the owner and either ask for another cleaner as this one is not doing the hours you are paying for or that you are going with someone else full stop.
@maddening I think the cleaner should be given the opportunity to improve before taking drastic measures
notanothertakeaway · 21/12/2021 09:16

@balanceo

£14 an hour - in cash ? So, assuming not being declared to the Inland Revenue, the equivalent of £20 per hour for anyone who does pay tax/NI.
@balanceo

I don't think OP has said if she pays cash

In the past I assumed that paying cash = undeclared income, and I expect that's often the case. But there have been several recent threads where people have explained it's to avoid the hassle of chasing payment, to avoid £ being swallowed by bank overdraft charges, to hide £ from an abusive partner etc

maddening · 21/12/2021 09:16

@Holeandthentwo
Possibly, but also this is an adult working in your home, you need to be able to trust them, they should be aware of this. Leaving an hour early every time is effectively stealing an hours pay, this is not the same as "must try harder", doesn't get the cobwebs, needs to take care over the bathroom etc, this is a matter of trust, you are entitled to refuse to have someone you don't trust in your home.

Sparklfairy · 21/12/2021 09:17

@balanceo don't assume that all cash payments are used to avoid tax. £14 when you're self employed isn't £14. It used to cost me a lot in marketing, cleaning products, insurance, DBS check, plus I could never fit in 8 hours of jobs in a day unless it was a big end of tenancy type clean. With packing up and travelling between jobs the most was about 5-6, but out of the house almost 12. I also declared every single penny for a future mortgage application. Its really unfair to jump to this nasty assumption.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 21/12/2021 09:17

Interesting that the posters who said it's unacceptable to give her more work to do haven't come back to say why

It's almost as if they feel being paid for two hours and only doing one is acceptable ...

maddening · 21/12/2021 09:19

Apologies that was meant to be @notanothertakeaway

Puzzledandpissedoff · 21/12/2021 09:20

I don't think OP has said if she pays cash

It's probably unlikely since the cleaner's employed through an agency
IME very few of them will accept cash being given direct to the employee for fear of never seeing the money themselves

BraveGoldie · 21/12/2021 09:50

I'd just make it positive and forward looking:
'Dear cleaner- thanks for the great cleaning- particularly appreciated x last week. I notice you're managing to complete in under the two hours, so I would love you also to fit in x and y, to make up the full two hours. Thanks very much for the great work.'

Justheretoaskaquestion91 · 21/12/2021 13:11

Interesting that the posters who said it's unacceptable to give her more work to do haven't come back to say why

Just giving more work to do without explaining why is an odd and passive aggressive thing to do. It also doesn’t make loads of sense as I don’t believe anyone can clean a house properly in 1 hour so she’s failing to do basics and doesn’t need extra work. The best way to address this is to just ask why she left an hour early. Have a list of exactly all her leaving times as well in case she says it was a one off so you can clearly present that she has been leaving 20 mins early on X date and 15 mins early on Y date.

sarahandduck12 · 21/12/2021 13:14

I had a cleaner like this once - was paying her for two hours but found out she left, usually after an hour, once after 40 minutes!

I then found out that she would leave our house, having claimed 2 hours, go to clean my friends house claiming 3 but doing about 1.5. And I don’t think she declared to the tax office as this was on the side to her main job.

A total crook so got rid of her

TractorAndHeadphones · 21/12/2021 13:34

YANBU. Tell her and if it doesn’t work tell the owner

Nonnymum · 21/12/2021 13:43

If she can do the job in s hour I am no it sure what the problem is. Presumably you knew the minimum time you could hire her for was two hours?
If you make her stay for two hours what will you gain if the job isn't done any better?
It might be better for you to find another cleaner who is willing to to take bookings for an hour

TractorAndHeadphones · 21/12/2021 13:47

@Nonnymum

If she can do the job in s hour I am no it sure what the problem is. Presumably you knew the minimum time you could hire her for was two hours? If you make her stay for two hours what will you gain if the job isn't done any better? It might be better for you to find another cleaner who is willing to to take bookings for an hour
Unless the house is spotless already it’s impossible to clean properly in an hour. There is always stuff that can be done e.g tidying

A good cleaner always finds something to do, isn’t a jobsworth. Of course employees give guidance (in my case they can’t do the whole house so I tell them what to prioritise) but there’s no such thing as ever having only enough work for an hour

Iwonder08 · 21/12/2021 13:48

How ridiculous, she is payed for a certain period of time. She is doing a half of that time, you absolutely should give her more work to do or ask her to do it more thoroughly if you are not happy with the quality. You employ her, there is zero room for any awkwardness

BertramLacey · 21/12/2021 14:03

£14 an hour - in cash ? So, assuming not being declared to the Inland Revenue, the equivalent of £20 per hour for anyone who does pay tax/NI.

I see we're at the making things up and running with it stage of the thread. The OP hasn't said she pays £14ph that was another poster. And she hasn't mentioned the form of payment either, although it is apparently via a small cleaning company. And not everyone who takes cash payment is cheating HMRC. I run everything through the books, cash or not. Sometimes cash is easier, especially if a customer is a poor payer.

MaryAndGerryLivingInDerry · 21/12/2021 14:18

Ahhh but cleaners are always on the fiddle, didn’t you know @BertramLacey? Professional tax dodgers. Never do a full hour either, always shirking. Theives too. Hide your phone chargers. Essentially they get paid £50 an hour to take your belongings.

AyeOop · 21/12/2021 15:32

The other side of the coin
The business owner charges a minimum of two hours, not the cleaner so maybe the cleaner has been told to get it all done as soon as possible to fit more jobs in
Contact the owner or check your contract to see what you agreed to first

BertramLacey · 21/12/2021 16:16

@MaryAndGerryLivingInDerry really they're Scrodinger's cleaners. Cleaning is simultaneously so easy that anyone can do it, it's unskilled, and asking for the living wage is daylight robbery but also, so difficult that no-one does it properly and you can never find anyone to do this very easy job that pays a king's ransom. It's a mystery why cleaners don't stick around to be treated like the poorly-paid master criminals they actually are.