To post this for road users unaware of upcoming highway code changes

[FluffyBooBoo]

That's loads of info available online, but the AA have done a study that shows that two thirds of people are unaware of the charges.

Photo attached with basic info.

@ItsAllAboutTheLighting

I try and let pedestrians cross where safe anyway.

The bike one is gonna cause havoc, people are gonna get pissed off and I predict accidents and rage.

I can just imagine all the drivers behind beeping their horns in rage while the car in front waits for a pedestrian to cross the road they're about to turn into.

Will it even apply at junctions that have pedestrian lights as well as traffic lights, I wonder? There's a very busy crossroads near me that has 3-way controls for cars, plus a pedestrian phase. If cars have to wait at a green light while pedestrians cross when there's a red man illuminated, the tailbacks will be massive.

Well I didn't know about these changes. The DVLA have my contact details so why haven't they contacted me to warn me?

How are we supposed to find out that that rules have changed if no one tells us?

And how near a junction does a pedestrian need to be to have right of way over oncoming vehicles?

I don't really understand the thing about the junctions - if I've slowed down and started to turn or stopped and am waiting to turn (either right or left), I have to give way to a cyclist that's coming up behind me from either side? Why can't they just wait for the vehicle that was already ahead of them to manoeuvre?

@missminutes24

There is no such thing called road tax so in thst respect we won't pay something that doesn't exist

I see the usual arguments being bounded about its always 100% the drivers fault, yet again were heading to a situation where pedestrians have to take zero responsibility for their actions.

"New research from a survey by Deloitte has today shown that some people admit checking their phones hundreds of times a day (the average being 27).

In all, Brits check their phones 1.1 billion times a day and 400 billion times a year, with the most worrying stat being that a fifth of 18-24 year-olds admit checking their smartphones when crossing the road.

'Pedestrian distraction' has become a recognised safety issue as more and more people use their smartphones or hand held devices while walking on the pavement and crossing roads."

@ShirleyPhallus

I like the idea of giving way to the most vulnerable road users, but I’d also argue that a pedestrian isn’t really a road user

I think it’s nuts to suggest that motorists would give way to pedestrians crossing. Busy town centres will just be start stop with pedestrians darting out all over. I’d feel quite nervous about a pedestrian stepping out on a dark evening, in dark clothing, and being at fault if there was an accident

A pedestrian is a road user. That was already clear. You sound as if you are frothing about the changes to the HWC without ever having actually read it in the first place.

The thing is it’s not about pedestrians walking out into on coming traffic for me.
It’s the car stopped in the road indicating left because there is someone on the pavement waiting to cross. The pedestrian might not even be looking round behind them! Normally pedestrians look left down the road and just a quick glance over the shoulder. They are not going to be expecting cars turning left to wait for them! Meanwhile the car waiting to turn left is holding up all the traffic and wondering what to do because the pedestrian is still standing on the pavement waiting for the road to be clear

@MissMinutes24

That may have read as sarcasm btw and it definitely isn't. Why should cyclists get all the benefits and none of the responsibilities of using the roads?

How are they not taking responsibility? Do you mean they should make themselves as small as possible so they don't get in the way of cars? Or actually is it their responsibility to make themselves as visible as possible and also help cars identify when and when it isn't safe to overtake?

When I am a pedestrian, which is often, I will still be waiting to see what the oncoming cars do before I step out. I might have right of way but I am not going to argue the point with a tonne of fast moving metal!

The bit about cars wanting to turn left having to wait for cyclists behind them to go past first, surely that is common sense anyway. If you don't do that you risk knocking the cyclist off.

The bit about cyclists riding in the centre of the lane is also sensible advice but I notice the article says to do it when quiet and to pull to the side when cars are coming. Wonder how many will doggedly stick to the middle?

No frothing from me @eastegg ✌🏼

Wait, hold on, you're to give way to cyclists BEHIND YOU?! How the fuck is that going to work?

I let pedestrians cross if it's safe to do so, but I'm very wary about waving people over because when drivers do so quite often pedestrians don't check the other way - I'm not blaming them, I think it's maybe an instinctive response when someone waves you to move - but it's potentially very dangerous if they don't check the other way.

These rules sound very badly thought through.

Surely most bike users and pedestrians don't know this either and will stick to old way anyhow? But changing it does seem reckless, even though I support not putting cars first for everything.

@ArabellaScott

Wait, hold on, you're to give way to cyclists BEHIND YOU?! How the fuck is that going to work?

Use your mirrors before turning and Heck for any cyclists if you see one taking a second or two to see if they are slowing down isn't going to kill you.

As a driver and cyclist maybe I'm more patient and dont think I own the road as a driver or a cyclist. Sometimes cyclists might not see your indicator not that many people use it anymore. So anytime I see a cyclist behind me and I'm turning ill just wait a second or two to make sure they know I'm turning and what they are doing e.g. slowing or still carrying on.

I'd rather I don't hit someone by accident and its easy for accidents to happen.

These rules are about protecting vulnerable road users.

I missed that as well. You’d have to be mental to be a cyclist and risk going up the inside as a car turns left.
I do slow and check they’ve stopped before turning, I will also not bother over taking if it means I will cut in front to turn but you could easily miss them in blind spots etc.(especially lorries with their massive blind spots).

It’s just common sense for the cyclist to stop and wait for the car in front who is busy looking at junctions, looking for pedestrians before turning. Adding in another obstacle they have to look out for is asking for trouble.

@ArabellaScott

Wait, hold on, you're to give way to cyclists BEHIND YOU?! How the fuck is that going to work?

Exactly last year I watched a cyclist get knocked off his bike for this idiotic move, luckily he was not hurt.

We were stopped in a que the car in front was sat indicating to turn in a side road, as soon as the traffic started to move the car in front started slowly to turn onto the side road. All of a sudden a cyclist came fling down the inside passed me and ran into the side of him.
He started yelling at the car in front who had been sat with the indicators going well before the cyclist even appeared on the seen and decided to fly down the inside, bloody dangerous.

Okay, found your link to the actual guidance, OP. Thanks.

'You should give way to any cyclists in a cycle lane, including when they are approaching from behind you – do not cut across them when turning or when changing lane (see Rule H3). Be prepared to stop and wait for a safe gap in the flow of cyclists before crossing the cycle lane.'

Right. That makes a lot more sense.

'You should give way to cyclists approaching or using the cycle track when turning into or out of a junction (see Rule H3). Be prepared to stop and wait for a safe gap in the flow of cyclists before crossing the cycle track, which may be used by cyclists travelling in both directions.'

Okay. I can't see anything on giving way to pedestrians when turning?

I can just imagine all the drivers behind beeping their horns in rage while the car in front waits for a pedestrian to cross the road they're about to turn into.

@LakieLady doesn't happen in my part of London. I know when lights fail or crossing are randomly closed where I live as a pedestrian I know I can safely cross the road.

It's interesting driving around London and the SE as different parts have different "unwritten" rules on how more vulnerable road users are treated.

The only difference this law change makes is that I just do what I do where I live every where.

@Silverswirl

The thing is it’s not about pedestrians walking out into on coming traffic for me. It’s the car stopped in the road indicating left because there is someone on the pavement waiting to cross. The pedestrian might not even be looking round behind them! Normally pedestrians look left down the road and just a quick glance over the shoulder. They are not going to be expecting cars turning left to wait for them! Meanwhile the car waiting to turn left is holding up all the traffic and wondering what to do because the pedestrian is still standing on the pavement waiting for the road to be clear

This would be me as a pedestrian. I’d also think it might be that car has stopped in busy traffic to allow driver on the side to turn or driver may take the chance to turn.

I think the problem is people will miss vulnerable road users. We can all do our best to look, but sometimes, sometimes it goes wrong and you miss something, sometimes our fault, sometimes they are hidden. You hope you get away with it.
Making the vulnerable “invincible” is not helpful. We all need to drive, ride and walk defensively.

Wait, hold on, you're to give way to cyclists BEHIND YOU?! How the fuck is that going to work

It's not. Unless they also make it law for cyclists to wear reflective clothing and lights the number of accidents is going to sky rocket. With the best will in the world and even at slow speeds drivers who are watching for other cars, pedestrians who now have right of way even before they've started to cross at a junction and cyclists in black tearing up the inside (and yes, they do, before any cyclist maintains that only ever happens on a day beginning with A) will make mistakes. Everyone needs to be responsible and accountable - not just car drivers.

@5foot5

When I am a pedestrian, which is often, I will still be waiting to see what the oncoming cars do before I step out. I might have right of way but I am not going to argue the point with a tonne of fast moving metal!

The bit about cars wanting to turn left having to wait for cyclists behind them to go past first, surely that is common sense anyway. If you don't do that you risk knocking the cyclist off.

The bit about cyclists riding in the centre of the lane is also sensible advice but I notice the article says to do it when quiet and to pull to the side when cars are coming. Wonder how many will doggedly stick to the middle?

A cyclist should stay in the middle if they know that road is not wide enough for them to pull over and for the car to then to pass with a safe distance between them. It's called taking the "primary position" and has been in the Highway Code for years. I cycle along a narrow (but short) road as part of my commute. I always stay in the middle for the reasons outlined above. I regularly get cars beeping or sitting right up my arse. I've been verbally abused to. People just don't understand the right of other road users.

@5foot5 you are suppose to cycle in the middle of the lane unless you know a vehicle can safely pass you.

When I'm driving if there is something like a skip lorry/coach behind me and a cyclist who is in front of me and slightly to the side I often won't over take the cyclist even though I safely can. This is because I know the larger vehicle can't and my own experience cycling is those vehicles tend to do close passes.

@EvilPea

I missed that as well. You’d have to be mental to be a cyclist and risk going up the inside as a car turns left. I do slow and check they’ve stopped before turning, I will also not bother over taking if it means I will cut in front to turn but you could easily miss them in blind spots etc.(especially lorries with their massive blind spots).

It’s just common sense for the cyclist to stop and wait for the car in front who is busy looking at junctions, looking for pedestrians before turning. Adding in another obstacle they have to look out for is asking for trouble.

If a cyclist is in a cycle lane and approaching from behind you then you need to cross their lane before turning left.

Just as you would if it was a regular lane, you wait to make sure it is clear of traffic before crossing it and making your turn.

I think all drivers should do a road cycling course.