Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2

Original poster

Overly harsh school punishment?

47 replies

HouseofSkullduggery · 16/12/2021 13:50

This is very outing but never mind! Earlier this week my 11yr old son was punched in the face by another student a year older than him. This was out of school grounds but on the way there.
School have done a full investigation and interviewed several witnesses so find out exactly what happened.
There was a group of 3 boys who kept throwing bags at my son and he ignored it. When it was time to leave they demanded he picked up their bag and he said no and walked away. Then there was a scuffle and I have been told my son attempted to punch this boy first but missed! The older student retaliated by punching him in the cheek hard enough to still have a bruise now, 2 days later.
My son didn't admit to throwing the 1st punch as he was scared to and this is why the school decided to punish him.
So on the day it happened the older student spent the day out of class and was told he could be excluded as he admitted punching my son but said he did it back and wasn't believed at that point. Then yesterday he received further punishment and was put with year 11's all day.
Then it came to light my son had not told the whole truth so he has had a telling off from the heads of both year groups but probably no further action would be taken as he was so upset and worried and had learnt his lesson. However the Head disagreed. Today my son has received the same punishment and spent the day out of lessons in isolation and an hour after school detention. He was so upset over this and really didn't want to go to school. He has never ever been in any trouble before.
I'm struggling to decide if this is a justified punishment or very harsh.
I realise my son could have made contact and punched this boy firsr but he was doing so in self defence as the other boy had hold of him. He has been very shaken up, scared to walk to and from school and been assaulted and punished when he didn't start any of the situation.
But I'm obviously biased.
Aibu?

OP posts:

CatsArePeople · 16/12/2021 14:23

I'd be furious. Kick up a stink. Older kids ganging up on a younger one. Cowardly little shits.

Whatiswrongwithmyknee · 16/12/2021 14:25

I'm not sure that 'there was a scuffle' means and I can see why your son is in trouble for lieing. I did wonder why he was so concerned that he'd be in trouble? I wondered whether he has been entirely honest about how much physical there was from the year 8s before he tried to punch them. If it was genuinely his being assaulted in the moment that he punched the other boy then he is totally justified in trying to defend himself. What would make him hide that though? Regardless, it's clear that 3 people throwing bags at one child is serious and should have resulted in a more severe punishment for them than the boy who then threw a punch - as someone else said, by throwing items at him clearly they started it.

HibiscusIsland · 16/12/2021 14:26

The only thing your son has done wrong is not tell the truth. I think him hitting out was justified as he was under siege and in a high stress situation so probably reacted instinctively. No way should he have the same punishment as the aggressors

Hillarious · 16/12/2021 14:28

At the end of the day the school cannot be seen to condone your son's actions in throwing the first punch, but if he feels he's being targeted by the older boys, he should now be able to bring this easily to the attention of the management of the school and get their support should anything similar happen again. If you feel he acted correctly in throwing the first punch to defend himself, you can show him he has your support, despite any punishment meted out by the school.

BurntO · 16/12/2021 14:32

They have handled that awfully and be telling them exactly that.

ClaudiaWankleman · 16/12/2021 14:35

As you've had a lot of comments on your side, just to voice the other for the sake of thinking things through from all angles - your son lied and continued to lie/say nothing whilst the y8 was being punished.

While the y8 was rightly being punished for being the aggressor.

I would keep quiet too.

MRSAHILL · 16/12/2021 14:38

My ds was repeatedly tripped up everyday walking to and from high school by a "class clown/joker" type who was in the year below him. My ds was over 6ft tall, skinny and very shy. Never caused trouble, never bullied anyone and kept himself to himself. We'd adopted him aged 4 and he'd come from an abusive background, he'd known extreme violence and hated any form of it. This idiot used to take great delight in sneaking up behind him and sticking his leg between his legs to trip him up. My ds was minding his own business, was never in any altercations but finally snapped one day, after he fell flat on his face and felt everyone was laughing at him. He turned and punched this boy very hard in the face. We'd brought him up to walk away from fights and ignore bullies but this was after weeks of being tripped up and being humiliated. He bust the boys nose really badly and was severely punished by the school. I met with the headteacher who was not at all interested in listening to my son's side of the story. However, no one ever laid a hand on my son or ever tried to bully him again. We are very proud of him and he knows it.

DysmalRadius · 16/12/2021 15:15

Surely throwing the bags was the first act of physical abuse? Your son may have used his hand first, but the physical fight was started when he was hit - the fact it was a bag not a fist makes no odds!

HibiscusIsland · 16/12/2021 16:11

Agree Dysmal.
MRSAHILL Your son sounds lovely and I'm glad he was left alone after that

littleowls83 · 16/12/2021 16:22

Why did he stay stading there if boys were throwing bags at him? Where was he? Is there a history with these other boys? The scenario doesn't quite make sense. I think isolation and an afterschool detention is fair enough for being in a fight and lying in the investigation of it after, regardless of him coming off worse.

littleowls83 · 16/12/2021 16:22

*standing

MRSAHILL · 16/12/2021 16:24

@HibiscusIsland Thank you.

Original poster

HouseofSkullduggery · 16/12/2021 16:42

He was at the park before school. On some kind of equipment when the bags were thrown at him.
He's home now and looks utterly miserable. I regret sending him if I'm honest. He has sat in silence in a room for 6 hours. Only a quick break for lunch and 1 short piece of work this afternoon. Then 1hr detention doing nothing
Missed yesterday's after school extra lesson as he was too upset to go and obviously today's as well as the whole day of learning.

OP posts:

RightAngledTriangle · 16/12/2021 17:11

Can you clarify @HouseofSkullduggery?

This happened on the way to school? Was it on school transport (as you say "when it was time to leave" - leave where)?
Who were the witnesses? If school transport - driver? Other adults?
Your son walked away, but you say there was a scuffle - did these boys follow him?

Your son throws the first punch - you say that he was being held at the time? If so, I feel that is justified self-defence in order to get away from the others. But lying is a big no-no when the heads of dept/head teacher are investigating, so yes your son needs a sanction for that, but what sanction depends on the school's behaviour policy.

If your son is worrying about any future repercussions on the way to/from school from this group, I would certainly be discussing how school could support him and reassure you.

Topseyt · 16/12/2021 17:13

@MRSAHILL

I don't blame your DS at all. He sounds like a great guy who had been pushed beyond endurance. Your DS communicated with Twatface in the only language that was going to be understood, and far more effectively than school did. Well done to him.

The headmaster sounds more like a wet blanket.

OP, I think you should complain about this. Your DS seems to be being bullied by these others and the school don't sound as though they are doing a whole heap about it.

Hemingwayscatz · 16/12/2021 17:14

He was being bullied by boys probably twice his size (very big of them!) so he attempted to defend himself, he didn’t even hit them even if he tried but they did hit him. Of course the school have acted unfairly towards your son who is a clear victim.

RightAngledTriangle · 16/12/2021 17:16

@HouseofSkullduggery Ah, I see it was at the park. Is the park part of his route? I'd be getting him to avoid going there if possible for the time being, straight to/from school/home at the moment. Any friends he walks with?

Topseyt · 16/12/2021 17:18

@HouseofSkullduggery

He was at the park before school. On some kind of equipment when the bags were thrown at him. He's home now and looks utterly miserable. I regret sending him if I'm honest. He has sat in silence in a room for 6 hours. Only a quick break for lunch and 1 short piece of work this afternoon. Then 1hr detention doing nothing Missed yesterday's after school extra lesson as he was too upset to go and obviously today's as well as the whole day of learning.

Don't send him tomorrow, if it is still a school day where you are. When you phone the school to say that he will be absent then say it is because you are worried that they are not heeding the situation so are not able to keep him safe. Say too that you won't be sending him in until they have called you back, arranged a meeting and you are satisfied with the outcome.

MRSAHILL · 16/12/2021 19:46

@Topseyt thank you. Sadly, sometimes a punch on the nose is all that these bullies understand.

cansu · 16/12/2021 20:25

I think part of the issue is that your son lied. School staff spend a long time investigating these incidents. It is very time consuming and difficult when kids lie. He may well have felt he had no choice but he lied about his part and this is where the punishment comes in. How can the head know the rest of the story is true? You know it's true. Presumably the other boy's mother will believe her son's side. How can the head know who is telling the truth?

CatsArePeople · 17/12/2021 08:44

Teachers and staff aren't referees. Yet they need to show they "did something". Especially as the altercation happened out of sight.
OP, you need to mitigate your child's upset. Buy him an icecream or something.

HibiscusIsland · 17/12/2021 09:53

@HouseofSkullduggery

He was at the park before school. On some kind of equipment when the bags were thrown at him. He's home now and looks utterly miserable. I regret sending him if I'm honest. He has sat in silence in a room for 6 hours. Only a quick break for lunch and 1 short piece of work this afternoon. Then 1hr detention doing nothing Missed yesterday's after school extra lesson as he was too upset to go and obviously today's as well as the whole day of learning.

I think you did the right thing sending him because schools just escalate it if you try and skip it so you and he would have had the worry of that whereas now at least you can move on. I think you should treat your ds to make him feel better. Does he have any friends he could meet up with before Christmas? I agree your ds has been hard done by.

Flip

1 2