To this that there should be enough spaces for all kids who want to go on a primary residential..

[drainitallout]

I accept that this is a first world problem and that I probably ABU, but my DD is so sad. Her state primary is usually brilliant for residentials - one night in yr3, two nights in yr4, then 4 nights with yr5 and 6 together.

She's now is year 5 and this has been the first one that she would have gone on due to covid cancelling the others (totally understandable)

The school have (again totally understandably) allocated placed to all the yr6 kids that want to go, and have pulled name out of a hat to allocate the remaining spaces to yr5s. There are hardly any yr5s going.

In previous years there have been enough spaces for all kids who want to go, so clearly there is more demand this year. But I just feel really sad and a bit bitter that kids including mine are missing out, especially after the last couple of years. In our area quite a lot of schools went through with their residentials in June / July of this year but ours decided against it which I accepted of course.

DD hadn't been only anything like this before as she's didn't want to joint beavers / rainbows etc when she was younger unlike her older brother.

I'm just cross, I guess. It would be lovely for her to have something to look forward to when the next few months, at least, are likely to be a bit rubbish

@Senmumm2021

I don't know of any school that does a year 5 residential. This doesn't need to be a big issue

But the thing is our school does. Only this year they aren't following through.

Yanbu to be upset on your DD's behalf. It's not like anyone can guarantee a trip next year.

Is the problem increased demand for year 6 or fewer staff so less kids can go?

@luverlybubberly I don't know. Maybe both?

@TeenMinusTests

You wait until you get to secondary. All trips are space limited.

Some schools have a 'closing date' system, but others go on a 'first come' system which impacts on families who need to check finances before applying.

Yes I'm expecting that at secondary! It's one of the reasons I'm so annoyed about this as we just don't know if she'll be lucky enough to go on trips once she's in high school because of spaces or because of them being shockingly expensive.

@KatherineofGaunt that sounds horrible! I'm glad you got a space in the end.
I could be recalling it wrong but at primary (for me) everyone who wanted one had a space. Once into secondary we only had geography residential so you had to be taking GCSE, and two really expensive activity / skiing trips that were for all years as not that many families could afford them!

Oh I’m sorry but YABU.

It’s a NIGHTMARE planning school trips. You really have no idea just the level of planning and admin that goes into the tiniest trip and a residential in covid times would triple that.

If all the y6s got a place, that’s the main thing. Your daughter will have her turn next year.

Parents don’t often comprehend the logistics of how many places can be offered, for so many reasons. It isn’t as simple as just “get another coach”. It would impact prices hugely and tbh they probably couldn’t staff it.

They really aren’t doing it just to be arses. Let this one go.

At our primary, each year had their own trip. Most of the year went on each trip with the ones who didn't do joining the year above or below temporarily.

The yr 3 residential in our primary is supposed to be happening in April, I'm being very very careful with positioning at the moment as would not be at all surprised given current Covid position if it were cancelled.

I think it's unfortunate that your DC is missing out but given we can't really plan much more than a week ahead at the moment it's possibly good that she's not getting her hopes up about it.

It’s a shame but if there isn’t room I can understand priority to yr 6.
PGL is very similar and she can go on her own or with a friend. Usually intro deals or cheap last minute.
Or it’s it’s something she fancies join Guides - ours have 2 outdoor activity days in January and February to look forward to.

I think your right. Every year is doing something except year 5 that's not very fair.

@LividLaVidaLoca

Oh I’m sorry but YABU.

It’s a NIGHTMARE planning school trips. You really have no idea just the level of planning and admin that goes into the tiniest trip and a residential in covid times would triple that.

If all the y6s got a place, that’s the main thing. Your daughter will have her turn next year.

Parents don’t often comprehend the logistics of how many places can be offered, for so many reasons. It isn’t as simple as just “get another coach”. It would impact prices hugely and tbh they probably couldn’t staff it.

They really aren’t doing it just to be arses. Let this one go.

She missed the year 3 trip, she missed the year 4 trip, she's missing the year 5 trip. None of us know (unless you have a crystal ball) if there will be a trip next year.

If schools can't be inclusive they shouldn't organise these things.

@luverlybubberly

Yanbu to be upset on your DD's behalf. It's not like anyone can guarantee a trip next year.

Is the problem increased demand for year 6 or fewer staff so less kids can go?

I would assume that lots of year 6 want to go because you can guarantee they will not get a chance to go next year.

Whether you are being unreasonable or not really depends if realistically they could take more kids this year (are they limited by number of adults available to attend, size of accommodation, etc?)

@LividLaVidaLoca

Oh I’m sorry but YABU.

It’s a NIGHTMARE planning school trips. You really have no idea just the level of planning and admin that goes into the tiniest trip and a residential in covid times would triple that.

If all the y6s got a place, that’s the main thing. Your daughter will have her turn next year.

Parents don’t often comprehend the logistics of how many places can be offered, for so many reasons. It isn’t as simple as just “get another coach”. It would impact prices hugely and tbh they probably couldn’t staff it.

They really aren’t doing it just to be arses. Let this one go.

Agree. They'd be doing it for all of Y5 and 6 if they could.

Might they be able to expand the year 4 one to include year 5 as well this year? (Obviously it all depends on capacity where they go. Our primary's year 4 residential is camping on the school field*, so could easily extend.)

*Great for a first residential - going to the toilet in the night is much less scary if it's a familiar place, and those that can't cope with sleeping away from home can join in everything but the sleeping.

It isn’t physically possible to invite everybody in the real world, though, is it?

Say there were four staff that could go with thirty kids (for example).

There isn’t always a fifth staff member for ratios for the thirty-first hypothetical kid.

Or the coach seats 34 and the next size up is a 60 seater that costs twice the price.

Ad infinitum.

And those people who say “all or nobody” are seriously saying NOBODY should get to go on a trip ever, if the real world logistics mean they can’t literally all go?

Trust me, the teachers will be on their last legs at the moment. This sort of stuff is what ends up making them quit because it’s just too much extra work they aren’t paid for.

Lets imagine your dd and her friend got a place in the draw. Another parent said it was unfair and the school decided to pull the trip for everyone. How would that be? If there was a way to take everyone, they would. These places are booked years in advance. Usually a school keeps the same booking each year. I don't know what you hope to achieve by complaining. If I was organising it, I would be tempted to say let's just cancel it this year as there is no chance to make everyone happy. The year 6 children are in their last year. They clearly won't get another chance. They may not even get it this year as no one knows what the situation will be with covid anyway.

Thefuturestory
The centre has a finite number of places for the week. The schools book well in advance to secure their slot. It is not possible to reserve as many places as might be needed and then find out who is interested and then readjust the cost and book that number of places.

It really does suck this year. Our school does a year 3/4/5 and 6 residential trips.

My dd got her year 3 missed year 4 and year 5 too many children applied this year due to missing last years as such the school booked more places.

Surely schools should of known more would apply after missing last years.

Firstly, there are finite numbers of places due to beds, size of canteen, staffing and equipment. It is not a case of just saying of more people will want to go next year, let's reserve 60 instead of 30 spaces. I honestly cannot understand the number of people who can't get this.
Secondly, the school are not a holiday company. Their main and principal job is the education of children. Maybe they have also been a little busy coping with a pandemic!

All the places our school book have the extra capacity they just decide not to book it to start with thus after becoming overbooked have managed to get the extra spaces. They don’t book 20 bed b&bs they book places that are designed for school trips and large gatherings.

@cansu

Lets imagine your dd and her friend got a place in the draw. Another parent said it was unfair and the school decided to pull the trip for everyone. How would that be? If there was a way to take everyone, they would. These places are booked years in advance. Usually a school keeps the same booking each year. I don't know what you hope to achieve by complaining. If I was organising it, I would be tempted to say let's just cancel it this year as there is no chance to make everyone happy. The year 6 children are in their last year. They clearly won't get another chance. They may not even get it this year as no one knows what the situation will be with covid anyway.

With my kids school they just said they couldn't all go. When parents objected they booked the extra rooms/tickets and the coach. Everyone agreed we would rather pay more and have the extra coach rather than have kids left out. So I can't' agree that they would take everyone if they could as it was possible and the school only did it when they realised people weren't happy. Obviously it would have been awkward if some refused to pay the extra but at least we were given the choice.

Hopefully she will be able to go next yr Op, in the sense of fairness it sounds like it should be a one yr group trip if they can’t take all of 2 yr groups, most schools only do yr 6.

My dd missed out on er week long residential last yr, they cancelled and rebooked for spring and it got cancelled again, so she didn’t ever get to go on one im going to try and save to send her on one in the summer holidays. Ds hasn’t been on any at school, all the educational subject ones were ££££s for 3-4 days. He got a part time job to help pay for skiing one to Italy with school but that also got cancelled.

Some kids have or will miss out on stuff these past 2 yrs and wont get a second opportunity.

@cansu

Thefuturestory The centre has a finite number of places for the week. The schools book well in advance to secure their slot. It is not possible to reserve as many places as might be needed and then find out who is interested and then readjust the cost and book that number of places.

At our school you pay a deposit (very small) a year in advance so they know numbers, it might vary slightly if someone changes their mind but basically they know.

@LividLaVidaLoca

It isn’t physically possible to invite everybody in the real world, though, is it?

Say there were four staff that could go with thirty kids (for example).

There isn’t always a fifth staff member for ratios for the thirty-first hypothetical kid.

Or the coach seats 34 and the next size up is a 60 seater that costs twice the price.

Ad infinitum.

And those people who say “all or nobody” are seriously saying NOBODY should get to go on a trip ever, if the real world logistics mean they can’t literally all go?

Trust me, the teachers will be on their last legs at the moment. This sort of stuff is what ends up making them quit because it’s just too much extra work they aren’t paid for.

Well if they can't organise a suitable trip for all the kids maybe it would be better if they didn't do it at all. Either it is an important thing to do and all should have the chance to go or it isn't important and maybe they could do something that is more important.

Well if they can't organise a suitable trip for all the kids maybe it would be better if they didn't do it at all. Either it is an important thing to do and all should have the chance to go or it isn't important and maybe they could do something that is more important.

Then schools should ask for the full (none refundable) balance a year in advance, costs should also include the hours worked outside of contracted hours for the staff and the school in no way should subsidise the trip (for the benefit of low income families) as some parents seem to think that it's just like booking an Airbnb for a couple of nights.