To think this is a bit dodgy (job application related)

[CrumpledCrumpet]

I applied for a job over the weekend (fairly senior, semi-specialist role). CV and covering letter. I didn’t think I would get the job, it was a bit of a punt, but I did meet all the criteria they had set out.

Deadline for applications was midnight on Sunday, my application went in about 11pm. By 9:30 on Monday morning I had a rejection email (after careful consideration, high volume of applicants etc…).

I don’t think I have ever been informed of the outcome of a job application less than 2-3 days after the closing date - how have they completed the sifting before many people have even poured their morning coffee? What’s going on here?

Why leave it so late to apply?

One hour before deadline would ring alarm bells to me, perhaps they use that as a filtering tool, as it may indicate that you are always going to leave things to total last minute, cant manage workloads effectively etc etc

Im not saying thats how you are, just that sending in the application at the very last possible moment could imply this.

Its one thing spending time going over an application, re-reading and tweaking etc, but an hour before deadline is taking the piss a bit imo.

When I worked in HR, all the applications were submitted to the HR department who passed them to the recruiter after the closing date. So they were all considered together. No chance of interviews before the closing date, you'd never get everyone together more than once anyway!

Also, IME, a lot of people leave their application to the very last minute. We had a set deadline for applications on a Friday and I would get people contacting the HR Department to see if their application had got through (that they'd sent only minutes before) or handing it in personally and wanting a receipt.

We don’t require cover letters etc no need for people to ‘craft’ an application. So no difference between first and last. Good candidates we hire immediately

Overseas HR assistants, perhaps? You make it sound like a reasonably big company, not everyone works around GMT.

I’ve worked in public sector & charities and am horrified to read here that so many orgs in the private sector see nothing wrong with interviewing candidates and making job offers before the stated closing date!

Surely it’s a basic issue of fairness and transparency. You can’t set a deadline that’s not a real deadline. In the same way my boss can’t tell me I need to do something by Friday and then get angry or discriminate against me when I’ve not done it by Tuesday.

And who is going to have time to spend hours crafting a good application the day the job ad comes out? Likely people with lower levels of caring responsibilities. And whose going to wait until Sunday evening once kids are finally asleep before doing their applications? Doesn’t sound fair to me…

And if you really really need to get someone in as soon as possible then don’t put a closing date in the ad at all. Surely a line in the job as saying ‘applications will be considered on an ongoing basis so there is no closing date’ or similar could be used?

As PPs have said - automatic response. Entirely possible every external applicant got it as they have an internal applicant they want to give it to.

My workplace is doing a fucking ridiculous exercise at present where brilliant (and inexpensive) workers are being invited to reapply for their own jobs. Due to “policy” and “regulations” (we are private sector) these jobs are being advertised outside (and internally) but there is fuck all chance of anyone else getting one unless one of the people they are intended for sees sense and fucks off to a less sociopathic organisation.

@PurpleIndigoViolet

I’ve worked in public sector & charities and am horrified to read here that so many orgs in the private sector see nothing wrong with interviewing candidates and making job offers before the stated closing date!

Surely it’s a basic issue of fairness and transparency. You can’t set a deadline that’s not a real deadline. In the same way my boss can’t tell me I need to do something by Friday and then get angry or discriminate against me when I’ve not done it by Tuesday.

And who is going to have time to spend hours crafting a good application the day the job ad comes out? Likely people with lower levels of caring responsibilities. And whose going to wait until Sunday evening once kids are finally asleep before doing their applications? Doesn’t sound fair to me…

And if you really really need to get someone in as soon as possible then don’t put a closing date in the ad at all. Surely a line in the job as saying ‘applications will be considered on an ongoing basis so there is no closing date’ or similar could be used?

Most job adverts that I've seen recently do have exactly this kind of clause, stating that interviews will be held as soon as possible and reserve the right to close applications early. My company has several ads out at the moment for roles and they all say this.

Why leave it so late to apply?

Well I assumed it wouldn’t make any difference as to my mind the deadline is the deadline - where I work we don’t even get applications to review until after the deadline.

I’m having issues with my kids sleeping at the moment so rarely get an evening to myself - I ended up finishing the application lying on the floor in the dark with a blanket over my head - was hoping to avoid that but when it got to the deadline, needs must!

When I've dealt with recruitment, I've sometimes had 100+ applicants for a job. If there are 99 that have come in before yours then you are far less likely to have yours read fully- if they found the shortlist they needed then there would probably be no need to bother reading yours.

I pre-judge those who make applications close to deadlines.

@mumda

I pre-judge those who make applications close to deadlines.

Why? What is the point of a deadline?

Unless you're recruiting for highly sought after jobs you and others are in for a rude awakening I reckon.

It is most likely automated software which has read your CV and deduced you do not fit the shortlist criteria.

Its really crap when agencies or companies do this because basically if someone submits a CV which is laid out differently or contains elements the software wasn't able to 'read' they can be rejected.

If for example your CV was a PDF, or contained tables or images or fancy fonts, or even headers and footers, there is a chance the software was unable to read parts of it, whereas a basic no frills word document would have a much higher chance of key words being picked out and thus the CV shortlisted for an actual human to read.

I've had the opposite, getting an interview invite the morning after the deadline. Really surprised me.

It is rather odd. Perhaps there were only a handful of applications over the weekend, and the HR person starts early? I'm clutching at straws though!

It's worth dropping an email to the company. If anything it's in very bad taste for a candidate to be rejected so quickly after submitting an application they probably worked hard to put together. While it takes someone screening the CV minutes to make a decision, it is still best practice to leave 48 hours before rejecting. There are auto-screening applications but usually these only screen the yes or no questions you answer as part of the application, (might be worth having a think about what you answered there if applicable)

E.g if a question is - do you have x qualification and you answer - no. Then you might be auto-rejected if it's an absolute necessity to the job.

Drop an email and say thanks for responding to my application, I see in the job description you required xyz and as per my CV I have xyz. My application was rejected so quickly I wondered if it might have been an administrative error?

And for what it's worth no good company will make an offer before the deadline closes. You could be shooting yourself in the foot if an excellent candidate submits last minute, plus reputationally it's extremely bad form.

They won't wait until the deadline is closed to start organising interviews - nothing odd about that. It's just good organisation. It can be a complex task organising interviews and fitting everything in to suit times of all involved. You jump on a good candidate as soon as possible.

But making an offer - giving someone the job before the deadline to applicants closes - very very poor form.

@ThePlumVan
Yes, I'd also heard it was more likely to be men who had the confidence to do this.
My 16yr old DD who is a rule follower, didn't manage to get a job this summer as lots of the employers were advertising for 18+, so she didn't apply for those jobs, only to find the jobs went to her 16yr old schoolmates. She was incandescent, not sure she has learnt from it though.

@PurpleIndigoViolet

I’ve worked in public sector & charities and am horrified to read here that so many orgs in the private sector see nothing wrong with interviewing candidates and making job offers before the stated closing date!

Surely it’s a basic issue of fairness and transparency. You can’t set a deadline that’s not a real deadline. In the same way my boss can’t tell me I need to do something by Friday and then get angry or discriminate against me when I’ve not done it by Tuesday.

And who is going to have time to spend hours crafting a good application the day the job ad comes out? Likely people with lower levels of caring responsibilities. And whose going to wait until Sunday evening once kids are finally asleep before doing their applications? Doesn’t sound fair to me…

And if you really really need to get someone in as soon as possible then don’t put a closing date in the ad at all. Surely a line in the job as saying ‘applications will be considered on an ongoing basis so there is no closing date’ or similar could be used?

Most large graduate schemes specify ‘rolling basis’, Ive also seen ‘right to close applications early’ which i think is fair. Agree with you on that point.

However needing someone ASAP isn’t the only reason to close early. The application deadline is just a rough estimate. Cases where :

1. There are more than enough suitable candidates
2. Ideal candidates are few and will be snapped up by others

Sometimes they leave the application open but there are too many, so a lot of applications get tossed for arbitrary reasons anyway.

So why waste people’s time by keeping the application open implying they have a chance? Better to close it and save them time … sending application as OP found doesn’t mean that it will be considered

[quote SusannaQueen]@ThePlumVan
Yes, I'd also heard it was more likely to be men who had the confidence to do this.
My 16yr old DD who is a rule follower, didn't manage to get a job this summer as lots of the employers were advertising for 18+, so she didn't apply for those jobs, only to find the jobs went to her 16yr old schoolmates. She was incandescent, not sure she has learnt from it though.[/quote]
I used to be your DD but am now a confident blagger.
Once I got into the workplace I realised that very few people actually know what they’re doing. And I’m good at grasping the key points so I might as well go for things. Strangely people lap it up

I once applied for a job via the company's own web platform. When I clicked "submit" my PC froze and I got the hourglass thingy for a minute or so, so I decided to close the window and log back in again.

When I did, my application status already read "rejected."

I'm guessing automation is a thing. Also, as others have said it is not uncommon for adverts to be live even if an offer has already been made or there is an internal candidate lined up and you have no realistic chance of being seriously considered.

@kinko
It's worth dropping an email to the company. If anything it's in very bad taste for a candidate to be rejected so quickly after submitting an application they probably worked hard to put together.

There's no points for effort with a job application.

Many applications are put together with a great deal of effort, but wouldn't get across the line with a big truck and a tow rope.

A lot of effort is wasted in applications by people thinking that the person that's reading it can be persuaded they're the right person for the job. The first person that reads it isn't open to persuasion. It's Yes, No, and occasionally Maybe (which is a No held back in case there aren't enough Yeses to make up a decent shortlist).

A deadline is just the point where applications definitely won't be considered if they arrive after. Often there is a couple of weeks or more before applications close. If the right candidate applies straight away the company are able to hire them immediately, in fact sometimes it is critical that they do so, before the applicant has the chance to accept a job elsewhere.

The deadline is also used as a gauge of the candidate's desire for the job. Rightly or wrongly, a person who applies promptly will often be viewed more favourably than someone who leaves it to the last minute. The timing gives a vibe as to what the candidates attitude to deadlines is - will they leave everything until the last minute if they got the job? (Equally applying to quickly is bad too, it looks like the candidate isn't preparing and is just firing off applications at random.)

In the old days when applications were posted, some recruiters dismissed applications without opening the envelope, based on how neat the address was written or whether the stamp was askew.

It may sound ridiculous but that's how things happen sometimes.

I am surprised by the amount that close early from peoples experience here. We are absolutely not allowed to at my workplace.

I've had to advertise recently and extended the closing date three times. It was easier to have a shorter closing date and then extend it, then have a long one and end up with hundreds (admin vacancy) of applications to shortlist. That's equally frustrating in my experience, and if a candidate sees it has been extended they assume they have been rejected. This wasn't what was happening with me, I wanted to make sure I had a decent pool of people to interview and get the right person for the jobs.

I've also rejected some recently when I had three similar jobs advertised. Joe Bloggs filled in the first application properly and went onto apply for the other two with "please see application ref..."

Erm. No. But then wanted to know why they hadn't been shortlisted when they met the criteria.... BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T COMPLETE THE APPLICATION. Gah.

V interesting thread.

If it is a director role, its reporting to the MD, right?

These people know what they want and so although you say you had all the skills, your university, your degree subject, your past employers could all have ruled you out.

I think for director posts reporting to the boss the 'fit' becomes super important and that boss' personal idea of who he is looking for goes beyond skills, because you're looking for someone who will geo with the exec team etc

Not saying it is right but it is v different from posts that don't report directly to the top.