To ask what child maintenance is meant to cover?

[MoiraNotRuby]

STBXH and I need to agree child maintenance. I know there is a suggested calculator and that's great for getting a figure.

But what I can't make my exhausted brain wrap around is, say DC are with me 5 nights a week and 2 with xh... I feed and clothe them when they are with me. Xh does the same on his nights. What about stuff like their:

Dinner money
Phone contracts
Music lessons
Sports club fees
School trips

Do I pay for 100% of that, or 5/7ths, or something else?

Thanks in advance.

£20 is not unemployed, my ex was suppose to pay £7 a week for our 4 children. I cancelled the claim. That’s the amount if unemployed.

The CMS calculator is absolute crap. My ex has DD 2/3 “nights” a week, however most of those he only finishes work at 6 so picks her up 6.30-7 when she’s already had tea, bath etc. Sure she spends the “night” as his house but my expenses hardly go down.

I’d discuss it with your ex but personally mine won’t contribute towards her iPad, any expenses from school or ever buys her new clothes. I get £120 a month.

When my friend split with her husband, he paid the minimum CM and refused to pay for anything else. Said she had enough money with her wages, benefits and his payment. She didn’t, but he didn’t give a shit.

Agree it's shit by the way

I ended up working four jobs but it was better than living with that piece of shit so...

Sweet fuck all in this house!

If CMS was MEANT to cover life essentials then absent parents would not be able to get out of it like they do. Because so little effort is put into backing it up is why society has a view that it is somehow bonus money and single parents are supposed to be grateful. Whenever my ex complains I spend that money on fun activities i remind him it's not serious money, it's a joke.

If he's already emotionally manipulating the kids it is going to be a tough ride. Set very strong boundaries.

The idea is the maintenance is to cover ‘necessities’, which does vary with income. Added extras are at the discretion of the parent whom the child is with.

So, if you are passionate about skiing, and take your child skiing, that is on you. Of course, you can make the case that both of you want your child to learn to ski, so your ex should pay half, but he is under no obligation.

In an ideal world, both parents should have a civilised discussion and agree on a fair outcome, but it rarely happens that way (sadly).

I had my (separated) H making comments about whether I was spending DS’s maintenance on things not for him recently. I pointed out that, no. That maintenance doesn’t even cover half of the nursery fees that allow us both to work. So actually he’s not paying for any aspect of DS’s living expenses.

He’s so busy whinging on about how he has to pay so much etc etc. But he’s actually benefitting financially. He can work whenever and however he likes because I’m subsidising him in relation to childcare expenses. And I’m the only parent paying for anything for DS.

It’s a shit system. But it’s hard to imagine how it could not be shit in several ways. Fix one aspect and create a new problem.

The main issues are that everyone will necessarily be worse off in a separated family. And that gendered inequalities in society become even more exaggerated after separation.

The idea is the maintenance is to cover ‘necessities’, which does vary with income. Added extras are at the discretion of the parent whom the child is with.

I don’t think it is. If it were no one would pretend that £7 a week for 4 kids was a meaningful contribution. It’s about making some gestures towards ensuring that nonresident fathers contribute towards their children, with the intention of reducing the burden on the welfare state.

I think in a ideal world they'd contribute half towards clubs, lessons, school trips and uniforms.
School dinners I think comes under food, a packed lunch could be cheaper. So I'd put that into the general maintainence.

In my circles men always pay the bare minimum they have to. Even when they begin by promising the world. Its a shut system. Hope you get something sorted.

The system is crap, as has been said the figure is just based on their earnings, and nothing to do with actual costs. The figure on the calculator he will legally have to pay, depending on how often he has them (even if he says he wants 50/50 I bet when reality hits he won't think its worth it to save a few quid)- if you can agree on an amount more than that fair play but I'd just count on that.

Even then sadly often it can be tricky.

Honestly, the whole post separation finances and division of labour is so often utterly shit. As well as effectively subsidising my H in relation to childcare, and then paying for every single other expense for DS (who is with me every single night), I’m also paying the mortgage on the house we co own. Every month I contribute about £500 towards the capital repayment. Given the way assets are split in a divorce (especially one where I started with more assets than him - even though he earns triple what I do), I’m basically putting £250 towards him every month just by paying the mortgage.

And I’m the one arranging my work around childcare. And who has to take time off when DS is ill. His father can basically benefit from all this to advance his career further.

Yet he imagines he’s a poor unfortunate soul because he’s got to pay me maintenance. Like so many men do. 🙄🙄

The hilarious thing is that my H would insist that he’s a brilliant father because he coughs up the CMS amount and takes a toddler to the park for an hour or so occasionally. He’s be really angry at any insinuation that he’s actually totally useless.

I don't think it is meant to cover a list of costs, the calculation is based purely on NRP earnings and number of overnights so no correlation to what the DC costs.

From my experience the best solution, if you can manage, is to budget for the CMS figure as that is the minimum and be clear on who is responsible for what days and handover points and make your ex pay for anything on his time eg after school care until he can collect on his night.

However, it very much depends on the attitude of your ex, as although common sense says he should provide dinner money or a packed lunch and clean uniform following them staying overnight if he doesn't your DC don't have it unless you cover for him. This was my situation and I couldn't let my DC go without so ended up covering more.

Sorry, that's long. In short, agree an amount based on CMS, negotiate big expenses as extras, plan for the worst, hope for the best, expect it to change and try and rely only on yourself.

@TheReluctantPhoenix

The idea is the maintenance is to cover ‘necessities’, which does vary with income. Added extras are at the discretion of the parent whom the child is with.

So, if you are passionate about skiing, and take your child skiing, that is on you. Of course, you can make the case that both of you want your child to learn to ski, so your ex should pay half, but he is under no obligation.

In an ideal world, both parents should have a civilised discussion and agree on a fair outcome, but it rarely happens that way (sadly).

Agree with this, I'd consider CM to be for covering a portion of essentials like clothing, food and contribution towards standard day-to-day living stuff, including dinner money etc.

Everything else, I think if there is something extra/optional you want the children to do and you want a contribution from ex for it then you'd need to be willing to discuss and agree it all with him beforehand (like sports clubs, phones etc).

"Agree an amount based on CMS, negotiate big expenses as extras, plan for the worst, hope for the best, expect it to change and try and rely only on yourself"

This is exactly the approach I'm going to take, thank you!

So sorry for all of those dealing with a shitty ex. Keep your head held high

ExH and I have a very simple and streamlined setup - an amount was calculated by CMS, he doesn't pay it, I bust my ass and pay for everything so the kids don't go without. It's great because I always know exactly where to set my expectations, it saves me so much hassle!

I suspect lots of people have a similarly streamlined set up @Welshmaenad. 🤦🏻‍♀️

@LucentBlade

People with the really low payments of £20 is that because your ex partners are unemployed? I just looked at what I would have got, DS finished school a year ago so it is irrelevant but I was just interested.

I know two women whose partners moved overseas when their dc were babies so they received zero maintenance. Another whose ex managed to do God knows what but he was a solicitor and managed to pay hardly anything.

Good luck op.

Mine is because EX suddenly decided to go self employed and declare a tiny income.

@MoiraNotRuby thanks for the link
I can't believe that UK CS is less than Polish CS 😮

I get £9 a month for my daughters from my ex, via CMS.

Child maintenance is suppose to cover everything on the list.

Some non-residential parents will cover other things but not dinner money. It depends on how they view their children and whether they see you taking the piss what they will cover.

I've worked with colleagues who had ex-wives who would ring them up at work as they knew they couldn't get into abusive argument.

Anyway as long as the ex-wife didn't ask for dinner money they tended to get money towards sports clubs, music lessons, school uniform and school trips.

The phone contract the child needs to pester the parent directly for.

How ours worked is we worked out what our dc cost with the mediator. Ex is a high earner so the girls have always done ballet lessons etc etc. The child maintenance calculator said £1000pm, but that didn't cover mine and their outgoings, so the mediator suggested a further £900pm as spousal maintenance. Ex was a bit horrified, so I said he had a choice - he could just pay the £1000pm and then I'd ask him for half of everything every time it popped up, ie half for school shoes etc. He couldn't be arsed with that so agreed the £1900 and I pay for everything, except food when they're with him. He's a generous guy so buys them loads anyway, but doesn't have to.

We separated last year - 2 kids.
Calculator came out at £950 per month so he pays £1000.
But, he pays for half (or even pays for) big purchases etc. Even added £20 a month when I suggested starting pocket money even thought I absolutely didn’t expect him to pay half of that.
But I help out with stuff, I’ll physically just buy them clothes for his house and then he’ll give me the money back.
For things like school uniform, I just buy it because I know I can afford it. I say I don’t need half but he more often than not just sticks it in my bank.
I am aware I have a good ex - but he only seems them 2 weekends and 4 nights (just for dinner) a month so I think it’s guilt from him not seeing them all that much even though it’s his choice!