Advice on returning an iPhone

[StrongLegs]

Hi,

I wondered if I could ask for advice on returning an iPhone to John Lewis?

My AIBU is - would I be unreasonable to try to return it again even though it has been rejected?

I bought this phone on 11th November 2021 from John Lewis, and then tried to return it, but they will not take it back.

They said that that is because the box has been opened and the phone is scratched. However, I just got the phone back and it definitely it not scratched. It is easy to close the box because it just means putting the lid back on, and they had done that to send it back to me.

When I returned it to them I had included all the original packaging and the film that covers the screen, but they have binned the screen film before returning it to me.

Here is why I am returning it: I am not able to use LED backlit screens, because they give me a headache, and I had been hoping to use this phone by attaching it to my computer and viewing the phone interface on my Windows PC screen. That would mean that I could use the phone to send text messages, use apps, scan lateral flow tests and all that stuff. It's really tricky to manage without a smart phone these days, and this is the only way I can have one.

Anyway - it turns out that the mirroring software that is available for iOS doesn't work very well, so although I could see the phone interface on my screen, I could not control the phone from my PC. Since I couldn't use the phone, and after 2 days I decided to send it back.

The phone is in perfect working order, and I have never taken it anywhere, or made a phone call on it. I just attached it to my PC by USB cable for a couple of days, and then put it back in the box.

I have contacted John Lewis Customer Services on twitter when the phone arrived back, but there is no reply.

I wondered if you think I would be unreasonable to keep trying to return it? If not, how do I get in touch with them to try again? Does anybody have experience of this?

The alternative is to sell it at a loss on ebay.

Thanks

Oh OP, that sucks being as you need it for such a specific purpose! Once you've managed to sell this one on, could it be worth contacting various manufacturers to see if they could recommend something? You can't be the only one with this issue.

@HunterHearstHelmsley thanks that's really kind of you. Unfortunately I have looked into this in epic detail and I think switching to android and using from my PC is the only answer. My husband is a computer scientist and knows a ton of stuff about this, and I am working 1-2-1 with one of the lead scientists who is trying to sort the lighting thing out and we're still stumped. It's a really tricky one.

I did actually try an e-ink phone (like a kindle screen) from China as well. It had an international operating sytem and had google play working and everything. I think it had a problem with turning the LED backlight off as I also got headaches from that screen. After a while it developed a fault that could only be fixed by someone who could read Chinese, so I've unfortunately just sold that on ebay too at a huge loss.

I'm not sure smartphones are really that good an idea.

iPhone still won't turn on and I'm still on hold to John Lewis. Still no answer from them on twitter either.

I feel your pain, LED gives me massive migraines too. Can you use an OLED display?

Thanks @TheCanyon, I'm sorry to hear that you struggle with it too. Do you have a lot of older technology in your house like me then?

I can't use OLED either.

I have got through to customer service now.

No help with returns but I do know a bit about screen tech so I have some questions and maybe some options:

Do you actually get headaches from the iPhone screen? I think iPhones use OLED screens that are quite different to LCD screens. If you do get headaches from the iPhone then it suggests the refresh rate rather than the lighting tech per-se. I think iPhones refresh at 60Hz, although your computer monitor screen probably does too!

See if you can try some alternate phones with screens that refresh more often. I think the One Plus models do, or probably better to try Samsung's top end phones due to the combination of OLED and 120Hz refresh rate.

I run the dark mode on an OLED screen to save battery - but it would also mean large areas of the screen are inactive (black) so no flickering from what would normally be white light.

@Rollercoaster1920 I've definitely tried all that, but thanks for the thought.

John Lewis say that I've got to wait four days and ring them back as the system won't let them start a new return until then.

The person was kind of dismissive, saying I'd have to go through a massive amount of technical trouble shooting, since I'm trying to return it for a second time.

There's no point trying to sell it on ebay now though, as it seems to have turned into a paper weight. Oh dear.

The idea of landline phones is really growing on me.

Thank you for all your help. It was nice to have someone to talk to about it.

When you bought the phone did you explain about your specific requirements and did the salesperson state that the Phone would work as you needed it to?

In which case, they have mis-sold it.

You can reject it under Consumer Rights Act 2015 as it’s not Fit for Purpose

“The goods should be fit for the purpose they are supplied for, as well as any specific purpose you made known to the retailer before you agreed to buy the goods.”

It’s completely irrelevant that you’ve taken it out if the box and used it. In fact, that shows you checked and discovered it doesn’t do precisely what you need it to do.

Can you take it into a John Lewis store? I had an awful time with them recently over a scarf I received as a gift. Was ridiculously painful.

Hi @FatBettyintheCoop, no there was no statement that the iPhone would do what I needed to, except by the third party software that I was hoping to use.

@Flamingolingo I don't think so unfortunately. It's too far for me to go. I think I will try the phone again.

@StrongLegs

Some screens use flickering as a way to produce less light, so that when the user dims the screen, the screen actually starts flickering instead of actually being less bright. That is called Pulse Width Modulation.

You can tell which screens use that by looking at this website:

www.notebookcheck.net/Why-Pulse-Width-Modulation-PWM-is-such-a-headache.270240.0.html

They test all the new screens coming out and put the data on their website.

Pulse width modulation is used a lot on car lighting - so the daylight running lights at the front that are dimmer at night and the difference in brightness between tailights and brake lights is almost always PWM.

I have friends who see the flicker - lucky for me I can't.

@daimbarsatemydogsbone that's really interesting to know, thanks.

There are cars that park at the school gates here and leave their lights on and I have to shield my eyes with my hand to walk past them. I keep hoping that they will take the hint, but they haven't yet.

Well if JL have broken it somehow, or it no longer works, then you will definitely be able to return it. But I was going to suggest going down the " not fit for purpose" route.

Have you checked the IMEI number of the phone you've been sent? If you have the IMEI number of the original phone (maybe on the invoice or in an email) it's possible they've got mixed up and sent you the wrong one. The IMEI number is a unique identifier so it will be easy to see if it's been changed

@DuckWithOneWing I did wonder that, but I don't have it as it was sim-free so there was very little documentation.

It still won't turn on.

Did you buy this online?

@TyrannysaurusXXrightshoarder yes I bought it from the website. That was why I thought I could return it. I was sure there used to be some regulation that said we could return things if we had bought them online.

There is. You have the right to return the goods, for any reason, within 28 days (you have to tell them within 14 days though) under Distance Selling rules. You obviously opened and tried the product before returning - though there is no specific mention of this circumstance in the rules, there is provision that they only have to offer refunds for ‘ unwrapped CDs, DVDs and computer software’ if they are faulty. Though the act doesn’t specify whether distance selling rules apply if you have used the item obviously you could only determine whether something was faulty or not by opening and using it, so, it implies that the consumer can open and try the product. But you weren’t originally returning it because it was faulty so it think you’d struggle to get anywhere with that. However, as the phone is now faulty (assuming you still can’t turn it on). They are now obliged to offer you a refund, repair or replacement under the Consumer Rights Act - how long has passed since you received the phone? After 30 days they are entitled to offer only to attempt repair. If they are unable to they do have to refund. John Lewis customer service is appalling though unfortunately - good luck!!

@TyrannysaurusXXrightshoarder thanks, that's good to know.

The lady I spoke to on the phone said that if I tried to return it as faulty now then they would probably take the line that I had broken it by trying the mirroring software. The phone was definitely working perfectly normally when I sent it back though. The mirroring software didn't do anything to it.

I've to wait and ring back in three days. Fingers crossed it will be okay.

Better news this morning.

DH figured out that it was the cable that was not working (ours, not the one that came with the phone). We are charging the phone with a different cable and now the phone can be turned on just fine.

I have listed it on ebay again. Phew!

Hi OP, glad it’s working! I actually need a new iPhone. Would you mind PMing me the ebay link?

You’ll see that I have been both a buyer and seller on eBay for 20+ years with 100% feedback.

No worries if you’d prefer not to!