To say dd is not responsible for landlord's electricity bill

[Snozzlemaid]

Dd is second year at uni and shares a flat with two others. Bills not included in the rent.

They signed up with an electricity supplier when they moved in at the beginning of September and have been paying this monthly.

The landlord has now messaged them saying she has received an electricity bill from the previous supplier that needs to be paid for the period up to the beginning of November. She wants them to pay it.

She has sent screenshots of the letter. It was addressed to her, the landlord, and posted to her address. It is from a different company than they have signed up with.

The flat was empty for months before dd and friends moved in so I'm guessing the landlord would have been responsible for electricity charges during that period. So surely she should have cancelled her contact when the flat was occupied again.

Sounds to me as if she hasn't cancelled her contract.

I've told dd she shouldn't be liable for this. They have no contract with the provider sending this bill. The landlord does, so she is responsible.
They are with another provider who they have been paying.

Any advice I can give dd for them to deal with this?

Stand firm.
For as long as it takes.
(had hassle with DS's landlord over deposit paid - took 6 months of regular polite letters and lo and behold they paid up!)

Of course she shouldn't be liable for utilities before her contract started.

I guess it all relies on EXACTLY when:

Took over tenancy
When exactly the new supplier started supplying.

I suppose there may well be some money owed if there was a lag... If the landlords supplier was supplying them until theur preferred supplier took over?

I would send (in writing) Screenshots of monies paid to new supplier to the landlord, saying you've been paying direct to xyz company and clearly detail the dates of tenancy /moving in and when new suppliers.

It does sound that either landlord has been a bit daft OR they're pulling a fast one.

I had this once... I moved into a student place - asked for xyz to take over supply and landlord tried to make me pay a bill for 700£ for a period before I took tenancy .

He was just pulling a fast one. I didn't pay, but it did take a few letters back and forth.

If this isn't sorted quickly I'd ring shelter for advice - in fact I'd do this straight off

Thanks.
Unfortunately the bill is for the period of their tenancy so not for the time before their contract started at the property. But they are paying their own supplier.

They don't want to rock the boat with her as she's been good up to now but I think they need to stand firm and not accept responsibility for this bill.

Legally, the company surely will chase the debt with the account holder, which is the landlord, not dd and flatmates.

It usually takes several weeks for suppliers to change. Can be sometimes up to 8 weeks.

So for at least the first few weeks, dd and housemate's would have needed to pay for the old supplier.

Dd and friends needs to find the day the her tenancy started and the day the supply switched.

Then they need to pay the old company for the usage from the day their tenancy started up until the supply switching over.

If the new company have taken money for a period before the supply switched, she needs to get it back from them.

Your daughter is responsible for the bill from the date she moved in. She should have taken meter readings on moving in to make sure she wasn't charged for someone else's electricity.

It doesn't matter who is named on the bill, it matters what the tenancy agreement says and who used the electricity. If she doesn't pay the bill ot will be a breach of tenancy terms (a basic one is covering utility bills)

I'd suggest a conversation with the Landlord to confirm they'll cover the bill from moving in date and ask that they provide a bill for that breakdown...or if that company is no longer trading to do some maths on the standing charge and average expected use of kWh.

Well did they get permission from the landlord to switch energy supplier and who ended the contract with the previous supplier? Who read the meters on the day they moved in?

does she have dated photos of the meter at the start of her tennancy?

does that match with her new contract or with the one the ll sent them?

could the ll bill be the closure bill of the account for the previous period?

She may be liable for some of it.... ie from the date they moved in until the new supplier took over but she should have a Meyer reading which can be compared to the landlords bill and an appropriate amount calculated if ay

Thanks. Okay I'll get dd to get that information.
One of the others signed up with the new supplier (they each took responsibility for a utility) so I'll get dd to ask her to see that account and confirm when it started.
I didn't realise there might be such a delay.
Really helpful, thanks.

Yes the company will chase the person who's name it's in, but the landlord can just tell them their names and then it'll be their debt. I don't actually understand how two companies can think they've been supplying the property because I thought they normally communicate with each other. It's normally in your tenancy agreement that you can't change supplier without your landlords permission, unless things have changed from my days of renting, so they've possibly fucked up there but even so. Sounds like there's been a fuck up by one of the electricity companies.

Tell her not to panic. And not to pay anything! It'll all get worked out - they've got proof of the date their tenancy started and proof they've been paying another supplier from that date. So it'll be fine even if it does end up being a bit of a faff. In the first instance I'd just send a copy of the bill for the same period from the supplier they've been paying to the landlord and explain that they've already been paying for the supply.

Unfortunately the bill is for the period of their tenancy so not for the time before their contract started at the property.
I may be totally confused here but are you saying their tenancy had started but they didn't live there yet? If so not liable. They are liable from when they lived there as they were using the electricity so if th eff y lived there they are liable

I assume dd has a meter reading that was submitted to the new supplier when they moved in?

It doesn't matter what date they started their contract with their new supplier. They were using and liable for electricity from the date their tenancy started (September you said).
They must check that the disputed bill only covers the period from the date their tenancy started to the date their new supplier took over, then pay it. That's how it works.

It's normally in your tenancy agreement that you can't change supplier without your landlords permission

unless the landlord pays the utilities then the tennant can change utility suppliers.

No your dd is not fully responsible if she has agreed a new contract with a different supplier. .

She may need to speak to current supplier and ask why they didn't terminate the previous supplier for the property when they agreed contracts.

She may be liable for any days from the day they got the keys until the day they switched supplier. She should have the meter readings taken when they first got the keys as well as the meter readings provided to the new supplier.

Any time before then the landlord is responsible if the property was empty. Also the landlord should have told the old supplier they had a new tenant and given meter readings to receive a final bill.

You mentioned the letter was addressed to the landlord but there should be 2 addresses- one being the landlords postal address and the second being the property address.

I think they need to prove that they have already paid their supplier for that period.
If two suppliers are charging for the same period then the fault is with one of them, probably the old one. No way the tenants should be paying twice!

@stayathomer

Unfortunately the bill is for the period of their tenancy so not for the time before their contract started at the property. I may be totally confused here but are you saying their tenancy had started but they didn't live there yet? If so not liable. They are liable from when they lived there as they were using the electricity so if th eff y lived there they are liable

Sorry I'm confusing things and not explaining clearly. Their contract started on 1st September, they moved in a couple of days later. They know they are liable for costs from 1st Sept. This bill the landlord has received is for the period ending beginning of November.

As far as I know they started paying their supplier from 1st Sept but I need dd to double check this with the flatmates who set it all up.

Ah okay! It's too early in the morning, that makes sense, hopefully she gets it sorted!!

@Michellebops

No your dd is not fully responsible if she has agreed a new contract with a different supplier. .

She may need to speak to current supplier and ask why they didn't terminate the previous supplier for the property when they agreed contracts.

She may be liable for any days from the day they got the keys until the day they switched supplier. She should have the meter readings taken when they first got the keys as well as the meter readings provided to the new supplier.

Any time before then the landlord is responsible if the property was empty. Also the landlord should have told the old supplier they had a new tenant and given meter readings to receive a final bill.

You mentioned the letter was addressed to the landlord but there should be 2 addresses- one being the landlords postal address and the second being the property address.

Thank you. Yes they have meter readings and yes the letter did also state the flat's address for the supply to that property.

You can't have two suppliers billing for the same meter. You need to see the actual bills and check the meter numbers and billing dates

Doe your dd have the photo of the meter when they moved in, take another one now as well

It might just be a mistake, no one pays twice for the same time period

There's a possibility whoever set it up didn't understand. So say the supply was taken over on 25th September and first payment came out on October 15th.

The person who set it up may have assumed that payment was from the day they moved in. Where actually it only covered from 25th September. So the person thinks it's paid and ita not. These dates are just examples.

If the old bill is for up to November I am guessing the new company took over on that date. Or the new company has charged for a period they shouldn't have done.

They should have taken a meter reading the day that they moved in and phoned that through to the ‘old’ supplier. Although they may have ‘switched’ to the new supplier as soon as they moved in, it will have taken a few weeks for their new supplier to take over the connection, during which time they will still have been supplied by the ‘old’ supplier. They will need to pay the bill to the ‘old’ supplier for the weeks between moving in and the new supplier actually taking on the connection.

Obviously if they didn’t take a meter reading the day that they moved in, that places them in a bit of a awkward position however if the dates on the bill correspond to the time between them moving in and the new supplier taking over, then they need to pay it. I would imagine that the landlord probably did take a reading - it would usually be part of inventory paperwork so she’s not doing anything wrong by giving them the bill.

Obviously if nobody took a meter reading and the bill also covers time before they moved in, then they are going to need to negotiate paying a percentage with the landlord.

Lesson learned; always read the meter as soon as you move into a new property.

They can't have been paying new supplier from 1/9 if this was a change of supplier.
If this supplier was already supplying the house then there cannot be two supplies to the same house so something has gone wrong, but if they changed supplier then there will have been a delay during which period they will have accrued a debt with the previous supplier.

So many posts referring to the period or the start date of the tenancy...

It's the meter reading taken on the day they moved in which is the relevant piece of information.

They are liable for the electricity consumed from that point, irrespective of which company supplied it.

I’d hand over the baton to your daughter and her flat mates and let them sort this out- great life skills!