To think that a vegan diet may be the cause?

[new2veganism]

As per my username I am pretty new to eating a vegan diet and so as still learning how to get all the things I need!

Just to clarify, I am not fully vegan and so don't call myself one but I eat a vegan diet 80+% of the time. Partly because I'm trying to lose weight and save money, partly due to ethical/environmental concerns.

I've been noticing in the last few months I'm getting a lot of mouth ulcers and cracks in my lips. Normally I only get these when I'm really stressed or run down and that isn't the case now so aibu to think that maybe my diet is missing something and that is causing the mouth ulcers? Has anyone else experienced a similar issue when switching to a vegan diet?

I don't eat a lot of junk food (of any type) as I genuinely don't like a lot of it and I'm a professional chef so I cook almost everything from scratch 😁

@showmethegin

The OP is blaming a vegan diet when she isn't vegan!

That's a common side effect of B12 or iron deficiency. Both of these are hard to get enough of with a vegan diet.

I would get both of these levels checked.

Marmite really does have loads of b12 so unlikely to be deficient in that.

This happened to my friend when she tried to go vegetarian. The doctor told her she wasn't getting enough nutrients and iron so now she eats very small amounts of meat but is mainly otherwise vegan.

Iron and b12 take a little while to deplete and considering the OP is newly cutting down on meat and dairy but still has some in her diet its very unlikely due to her diet.

@Christmas1988

My new toothpaste has given me mouth ulcers and the skins peeling away from my mouth, could be something like that instead of your semi vegan diet.

Yep, it’s the whitening ingredient which seems to be in most toothpaste now. It does this to me too, and lots of people from what I’ve read.

I had to switch away from whitening ones to get rid of it.

I think low B12 is also common in meat eating diets? The animals get injected with it don't they?

I've been vegan 8 years and haven't experienced that, but each person is different and we do eat quite a lot of whole foods.

I'd say stick with it generally, as after a sort of settling time I felt loads better. (And still do. Also my IBS and sinusitis both completely disappeared!)

My reluctant partner also went vegan a few years ago because he said he couldn't think of a good enough reason to keep eating things taken from animals and he also actually felt better eating vegan.

Good work so far and good luck!

@ItsAllAboutTheLighting

You have to be very nutrient aware when first turning vegan. Meat contains a lot of nutrients because the animals are pumped with them to make the meat more nutritious.

Do you?

No milk = no calcium.

That's ok, it's fortified in most alternative mills.

No meat = no protein.

That's ok, it's in plenty beans and pulses.

It's not as hard as people thing.
Cows milk isn't all it's cracked up to be.
In fact, lots of it can inhibit iron absorption.

OP get your iron and vitamin D checked.

If both or either of those are low, you won't be able to successfully increase them in food alone.

It’s not just calcium and protein though, we see time and again vegans and vegetarians can experience chronic health problems when turning to a poor diet (as can anyone).

Meat doesn’t just contain protein - it contains iron, B12, zinc, selenium, b6 etc.

Milk isn’t just calcium - it’s vitamin a, B12, magnesium, potassium, riboflavin etc.

Turning to alternatives for those nutrients is often where individuals following a plant based diet begin to struggle.

Often products being fortified simply isn’t enough. You need to be including nutrient dense food daily/weekly to ensure you’re getting the adequate amounts you need.

Now winters coming we need to start storing more foods - we crave stews and hearty meals in winter because they are traditionally very meat heavy and nutritious - we need excessive iron, vitamin c,d,e and b12 to combat the change in weather.

When we lose the traditional sources of those fuels yes you absolutely need to re-educate on what you must eat to keep yourself healthy.

Alternatively ensure you regularly take vitamins to keep your levels up. Mineral deficiency can make you very, very ill.

garlic twist, did that happen 30 years ago? I cant imagine that happening now!

@Greenrubber I'm not 'blaming' a vegan diet and I've not claimed to be vegan, just that I eat a mostly vegan diet. I have noticed several changes in my health since switching to mostly plant based foods and I was wondering if there could be a link and if anyone else has experienced similar issues, that's all! The mouth ulcers are just the most obvious (to me) symptom that something has changed, I'm almost getting them back to back now and they are large and painful. Makes eating anything at all quite difficult 😞

I don't intend to stop eating plant based either way, I just want to make sure I'm as healthy as I can be and getting everything my body needs. I'd rather not take supplements unless I have to 😊

Yes your symptoms are very common with converts to veganism. In many cases they will ease as your body gets used to the change in diet, at the moment its crying out for the nutrients its missing that it has been used to that can't be replaced in a vegan diet. If you get serious complications like yellowing skin or eyes consider going to the doctor.

Some people find a "5:2" diet helpful, having five vegan days and then two days eating plenty of meat and animal-derived products, that way the body still gets what it needs and is able to cope with the period of abstinence.

If you arent eating vegan then vegan diet isnt the cause. Plenty of people eating processed shit all day every day. If you think thet are symptoms rather than inconveniences then visot your gp. Sorry this sounds rude, it is neant kindly anf to reassure you.

I had this, it went away when I started supplementing zinc. It is a sign of low vitamins or minerals, but which one is anyone's guess really! Your best bet would be a multivitamin and mineral tablet, regardless of whether you are vegan or not.

If you can find a vegan collagen supplement, collagen should help you heal quicker too.

new2veganism I think your diet sounds great and very healthy. You know what you need and if you do the maths you can see if you are missing anything & add in what you might be missing, its usually b12 so the yeast addition is great, but your on that with marmite anyway. Its very simple stuff and your doing well.

That 5.2 diet sounds abit bonkers, whats the point in that. Makes no sense to me sorry.

@Yourstupidityexhaustsme

I agree that everyone should think about what they eat. But the traditional diet you mention is not a magic formula, in fact, it's far from it. Look at rates of obesity, stroke and heart attack in our culture.

Check out Cancer Research U.K. website where it shows fact sheets saying processed red meat, e.g. sausages and bacon is classed as a carcinogen. (WHO classified it as this a while ago). I mean, that's not great. I agree with processed, fortified foods not being great, but that's the case in any diet.

If you can replace meat with beans, lentils, pulses and vegetables, mostly Wholefoods, they contain loads of other essential nutrients and vitamins too.

I've been vegan quite a long time, done a LOT of research over the years and consult a dietician, so I'm pretty sure this is all correct.

Being vegan is surprisingly enjoyable and easy, after the initial transition.

No need to go to the GP they are pretty busy, just adjust your diet to include all you need if worried about missing one thing or add a supplement.

[quote new2veganism]@Greenrubber I'm not 'blaming' a vegan diet and I've not claimed to be vegan, just that I eat a mostly vegan diet. I have noticed several changes in my health since switching to mostly plant based foods and I was wondering if there could be a link and if anyone else has experienced similar issues, that's all! The mouth ulcers are just the most obvious (to me) symptom that something has changed, I'm almost getting them back to back now and they are large and painful. Makes eating anything at all quite difficult 😞

I don't intend to stop eating plant based either way, I just want to make sure I'm as healthy as I can be and getting everything my body needs. I'd rather not take supplements unless I have to 😊 [/quote]
Really commend your dedication OP, your health is so important so please make sure to get tested for deficiencies!

This is a great website for learning how to change your diet healthily.

www.forksoverknives.com/how-tos/plant-based-primer-beginners-guide-starting-plant-based-diet/

Hope you feel better soon!

Unless you have a medical condition that prevents B12 absorption it's extremely unlikely to be that. Yes all vegans need to supplement for B12 but a) you are already doing that because marmite is extremely high in B12 and b) B12 deficiency most commonly takes years to develop, not weeks or even months unless you are extremely low to begin with. Just by eating a few slices of marmite toast each day you will be getting most of your B12 needs, and if you're eating fortified foods like vegan margerine or plant milk then you are probably at your B12 target already. By all means take a supplement as well if you want to be sure but I would be amazed if this had anything to do with B12. As for iron, everybody is different of course but I have never personally been deficient and like I said before I was vegetarian for almost 20 years and never supplemented for anything (I was tested for anaemia during both my pregnancies and in normal range both times). Yes you need to be mindful of your diet as a vegan/mostly plant based but even if you ate terribly a serious deficiency is unlikely to have developed within what sounds like a very short time frame unless your previous non vegan diet was also extremely poor.

@HarrietsChariot

Erm. Where are you getting your information from? It is well documented that a planned vegan diet can be healthy at every stage of life...? Check the NHS for a start, World Heath Organisation say the same, what's your source please?

[quote headspin10]@Yourstupidityexhaustsme

I agree that everyone should think about what they eat. But the traditional diet you mention is not a magic formula, in fact, it's far from it. Look at rates of obesity, stroke and heart attack in our culture.

Check out Cancer Research U.K. website where it shows fact sheets saying processed red meat, e.g. sausages and bacon is classed as a carcinogen. (WHO classified it as this a while ago). I mean, that's not great. I agree with processed, fortified foods not being great, but that's the case in any diet.

If you can replace meat with beans, lentils, pulses and vegetables, mostly Wholefoods, they contain loads of other essential nutrients and vitamins too.

I've been vegan quite a long time, done a LOT of research over the years and consult a dietician, so I'm pretty sure this is all correct.

Being vegan is surprisingly enjoyable and easy, after the initial transition.
[/quote]
Sorry I realise I have seemed very 'pro-omnivore' - not the case at all!

Eating animal products is terrible for your health in the long term, however due to how wide spread consumption is the foods have been fortified with health benefits for a very long time and when first turning to plant based diets people underestimate the need for nutrients and minerals as they have always felt 'fine'.

Once you understand the benefits of plant based food it's incredibly simple, I've been vegan/veggie for the best part of ten years and I can rhyme off foods and there nutrients as easily as I can tell their colour.

It's all about education and awareness for what we're consuming :)

@HarrietsChariot

Yes your symptoms are very common with converts to veganism. In many cases they will ease as your body gets used to the change in diet, at the moment its crying out for the nutrients its missing that it has been used to that can't be replaced in a vegan diet. If you get serious complications like yellowing skin or eyes consider going to the doctor.

Some people find a "5:2" diet helpful, having five vegan days and then two days eating plenty of meat and animal-derived products, that way the body still gets what it needs and is able to cope with the period of abstinence.

This advice is insane. Are you suggesting that the OP is experiencing liver failure from going mostly plant based?! With the exception of B12 there are no nutrients found in animal products which can't be got through a vegan diet so I honestly can't imagine what you're talking about (and as I've said above it's really unlikely the OP isn't getting enough B12 already).

Possibly Orafacial granulomatosis OFG for short. Causes ulcers of the mouth, swelling of the lips (and possible cracking).

An autoimmune disease (sometimes goes hand in hand with crohns disease but can stand alone).

The body reacts to natural preservatives, food containing Benzoates, and cinnamon. There is a food diet, the cinnamon and Benzoates free diet.

Foods issues among others, spinach, berry fruits, stone fruit, tomatoes, all the healthy stuff.

Lots of sufferers also react to SLS in toothpaste. Benzoates found in cleaning products, toiletries, makeup, hand sanitizer.

There’s an excellent FB group and if you live in the UK the FoodMaestro app is very helpful.

Lots of foods can cause ulcers like nuts and citrus fruit

I am vegan and have been for a few years now! I've suffered from mouth ulcers for as long as I can remember when I'm run down like yourself
I have noticed if I get an ulcer it takes forever for them to clear up when I'm eating things like nuts which I love so don't stop eating them
But that's nothing to do with the diet

It's very unlikely to be a vitamin deficiency unless you were already deficient

I always know what causes mine of I didn't I would probably get checked out by a GP to make sure it was nothing sinister

You’ve not changed toothpaste have you. Colgate does this to me it’s the sls in it apparently.

To be honest my diet was fairly good before but I've just switched out the meat items for veg/pulses instead. I've always bulked out mince meals with lentils and beans etc so I'm just now using only lentils/pulses and replaced the chicken in curries/stews/soups/stir fries with more veg. I hardly ate any dairy anyway (except yogurt 😍), I've been drinking oat milk for years. The only things that are totally new to my diet really are the vegan butter, cheese, yogurt and tofu. Plus obviously the sheer amount of extra veg/pulses I'm eating 😂 I used to hate tofu but it was more the texture I didn't like and I've now found the right way to prepare it I really love it! Same with aubergines, my curry the other day had them in and I really liked them despite being a steadfast aubergine-hater 😂

I'm actually finding I'm a lot more excited and inspired by food again since switching, I'm interested to try out new recipes and having fun recreating old favourites without meat. I'm really enjoying it 😁

I don't think I'll fully go over to veganism - partly because my job as a chef makes it really difficult to avoid meat and dairy. I do however choose plant based meals whenever I can.