To think the NHS’ dietary advice is wrong?

[Breakingmad]

Specifically this part? Surely we shouldn’t be basing our meals on starch?

Here’s the link to the full article. I really disagree with the ‘fat is the enemy’ message too re full fat milk, fatty cuts of meat etc.

www.nhs.uk/live-well/eat-well/

What should we be basing our meals on? Carbs aren't the enemy. Fat, I agree, is also not the enemy as such, although saturated fat is.

Sugar is the enemy. That's what we all need to be aware of.

The high fibre starch part is fine.
Low fat is evil stuff though.

What should we be basing our meals on? Carbs aren't the enemy. Fat, I agree, is also not the enemy as such, although saturated fat is.

On protein, fat, and yes, some complex carbs. It shouldn’t be based on starch with the other elements as an afterthought.

Sugar is the enemy. That's what we all need to be aware of.

Carbs are sugar more or less.

I really disagree with the ‘fat is the enemy’ message too re full fat milk, fatty cuts of meat etc.
Are you a professional dietician, nutrition researcher etc? With a professional qualification recognised by the HCPC?
Because if not, it is irrelevant what you happen to think.

Totally agree…..sugar (and, even worse, fake sugar substitutes) are the main thing to avoid. Sticking to water to drink instead of sweetened drinks is the easiest way to make a big difference.
Low fat is often full of grim additives, and you also lose vitamins that way too.

This sounds like a good approach to a balanced diet to me!

Basing a meal on a high fibre starchy food makes sense because it's slow-releasing energy and keeps us feeling full for longer without big crashes that cause cravings. I think for a long time these foods have been seen as the enemy but when you look at Mediterranean diets they eat these foods as staples.

Unsaturated fats are obviously better for you e.g. Extra Virgin Olive Oil instead of butter, but if you're not eating a lot of butter then they're saying it's ok. If you're having a normal amount of full-fat milk then that's also not a problem according to this.

None of the things on this list are independent of each other - you have to look at it as a whole and they're saying:

High fibre starchy foods/carbs
Lots of fruit and veg
Proteins

Healthy fats

Basically a balanced diet with not too much unhealthy fat or sugar!

I can't agree with "all carbs = sugar" beliefs.

tbh, I kind of think that if you resort to following NHS advice then you are probably starting from a place of truly not understanding the nutritional value difference between KFC & a raw tomato.

I'd be happier if the advice was heavily based around eating more vegetables -- but realistically, most people won't do that. It's expensive for a start. From starting point for most people, NHS eatwell plate is not bad advice at all.

Do you have any sort of recognised qualification in nutrition OP or are you more a kind of ‘I’ve done my own research’ person?

It’s important because if it’s the latter it would be reasonable to put your two pence worth in the bin if we are meant to weigh it against the qualified senior HCPs who contributed to writing the information on the NHS website.

Michael Mosley has a really interesting take on this. If you read any of his books, he sites a lot of research and explains that the NHS guidelines are based on VERY outdated research which has been proved wrong in many trials since. He's a doctor and a qualified nutritionist so knows what he's talking about.

Don't think MM is a "qualified nutritionist".
MM qualified as a psychiatrist after working as a banker.
I can't even find MM on the GMC register, he relinquished that long ago.
He stopped practising medicine in 1985 says Wikipedia, or maybe 1996 (other sources).

Better to change advice as per every fad diet going than listen to the qualified professionals who studied at least a four year dietetics degree. Not listening to the experts has been going so well for us these past few years!

That reads like dietary advice from the eighties. I didn't realise that people still believed saturated fat is unhealthy.

I think the advice is quite good. I disagree with the low fat emphasis. I would put more emphasis on avoiding highly processed food and reducing sugar.
High fibre carbs are needed for gut health, providing a substrate for healthy gut microbes, and are a good energy source. Veg is great but isn't going to provide enough calories for active people. Meat fish etc is also great but in excess quantities isn't good for gut health. So there needs to be the balance as they say.

I do believe that if you eat unprocessed and minimally processed foods only (e.g. cheese, good quality bread) and avoid sugar, your body will tell you what proportion of protein and carb it needs. It's highly processed food that confuses the body and causes cravings at the same time lacking micronutrients, that can lead to obesity and malnutrition at the same time.

I think the low fat and unsaturated fat thing has been thoroughly debunked now, and artificial sweeteners are just as bad as sugar.

The idea that there is a single way to eat that creates optimum health in all human beings is what is outdated and getting debunked!

YANBU

This is the advice given to people who are overweight and those with diabetes. This is why so many continue to be overweight and don't overcome diabetes.

Until this is updated nothing will change. Sugar is the problem. If you choose low fat milk you are increasing sugar, if you choose white rice, pasta, potatoes you are causing an insulin spike.

No I'm not a dietician but someone with some common sense.

@lljkk as a T1 diabetic, I can categorically confirm that all carbs = sugar. 10g of carb will raise my blood sugar by exactly the same amount, be it high fibre low sugar whole grain or pure granulated sugar. There is a tiny variation in the speed at which it does so (but nothing like the slow-release claimed for certain whole grain manufactured items).

When I ate a 'recommended' low fat high carb diet, my diabetes was poorly controlled and I was 3 stone fatter than on a well controlled low carb diet.

Given that I inject insulin in a pattern that is as close as possible to a functioning pancreas, I don't think this is just because I'm a diabetic, just that I have cause to measure my blood sugars regularly and so notice the effects of carbs

There is a tiny variation in the speed at which it does so (but nothing like the slow-release claimed for certain whole grain manufactured items).
My DH also has T1 and notices huge variations. I suspect you are just lucky. He can work out how much white flour there is in a mixed flour bread and gets into difficulties with curry, pizza etc. depending on how much fat is in it vs how much he thought.

Of course yabu. Do you think they pull these things out of thin air? They’re not saying eat chips and sweets, it’s things like brown rice, wholemeal bread and potatoes in their skins. Low carb diets are not recommended for the majority of people. Your brain runs on glucose and you need fibre for a healthy digestive system - most people don’t get enough.

In contrast, most people eat too much protein and fat. Did you know that too much protein is actually bad for you? It can cause issues for your kidneys and liver.

@mumof1or2

Michael Mosley has a really interesting take on this. If you read any of his books, he sites a lot of research and explains that the NHS guidelines are based on VERY outdated research which has been proved wrong in many trials since. He's a doctor and a qualified nutritionist so knows what he's talking about.

Anyone can call themselves a qualified nutritionist, it’s not regulated. Dieticians are the regulated source of nutritional info.

I agree. Some of the advice is very old fashioned and needs an overhaul.

Also, thinking that starch = sugar is just completely wrong. For starters you don’t even digest resistant starch! It feeds your gut bacteria instead.

I think it is out of date and I hate the NHS swaps advice that encourages artificial sweeteners etc but I fully expect the high fat low carb diet to be out dated too before long.

I know I'm at my best physically and mentally when I eat plenty of fruit and veg and protein and carbs in sensible portions at every meal. I'm an age group athlete and my performance really deteriorates if I don't have my carbs. Now I realise not everyone is doing as much exercise, but if not having them affects my performance how can they be bad?

Everything in moderation just has to be the best way IMO.

I probable eat like this and I am slim.
Porridge and fruit for breakfast
Bread and soup or salad for lunch
Dinner would be poatatoes/pasta/rice with some protein and veg provable all in a tasty sauce with a bit too much salt.
Small portion of pudding.

@HalloHello

What should we be basing our meals on? Carbs aren't the enemy. Fat, I agree, is also not the enemy as such, although saturated fat is.

Sugar is the enemy. That's what we all need to be aware of.

PLANTS