Packed lunch police

[penneforyourthoughts]

DD’s school has changed their packed lunch policy and no longer allows them to have juice cartons of any description.

I know that there are bigger problems in the world but it’s made me pretty cross. DD is quite food avoidant and I do my best to pack a sensible lunch for her but I like the fact that I can give her fruit juice (flavour, texture and one of her five a day, I think).

I don’t want to make a fuss because it’s a great school but AIBU to raise it with them?

@logsonlogsoff

Parents who insist their kids will dehydrate and die of thirst if they don’t have juice really need to get a grip.

You completely missed those parents point. If a child won't drink water and are not the type of kid who will drink it if they have no other options, they can become dehydrated (example: the poster on the first page whose daughter passed out from dehydration). The people in this thread who are judging\shaming people for giving their kid(s) fruit juice must be lucky to have kids who are not picky\don't have food issues.

@DeepaBeesKit

all the schools where I live havent allowed juice for years. Its just sugar and you can get the same nutrients along with fibre by eating the actual piece of fruit. Drinking juice regularly contributes to poor teeth and obesity, because its sugary but doesnt fill you up so you overeat.

Can you give her juice before/after school? The school will not want to make an exception for her because other children who currently happily drink water will start whinging about it.

Totally agree.

The government (in its wisdom) has decided we have to teach about healthy eating and have a ‘healthy schools policy’. Childhood obesity is definitely on the rise and part of that is because children routinely eat too much rubbish.
I’m actually fully in support of the lunchbox police - and I work in a school supervising lunch so know what a total hassle it is! My DD is also very funny and fussy about food, so lunches are tricky.

Despite our schools policy, in my year group I have two boys that bring in cold chicken nuggets and chips every single day (I really wish I was kidding) and three others whose lunchbox is basically nothing but prepackaged rubbish - three different types of chocolate and a packet of crisps (so no sandwiches or protein at all). That’s 10% of children with deeply unhealthy meals every single day! It’s not ‘the odd horror story of cold chicken nuggets’.

At our school we aren’t allowed to take away unhealthy items - because we’ve nothing to give the kids in exchange - so our hands are tied, other than talking to the children’s and talking to all parents about healthy meals (because we can’t just talk to the parents who send their kids in with rubbish because that would be singling them out).

I appreciate that this puts stress onto parents whose children have decent lunches with the odd Kitkat on a Friday, but I don’t know what else we can do?

I really don't see the problem. You say your child likes to follow the rules. If the rules are you only bring water in then she'll follow them. I can guarantee that one of the soft rules will be to drink enough water, which from what you're saying about your daughter will mean that she'll drink her water if a teacher tells her to. It might take a week or two, as water intake is a habit that needs to be learnt but with encouragement from school and home, she'll do it.

Juice is bad for children's teeth, the act of sucking it through a straw means that as a person drinks from a straw they're bathing their teeth in whatever they're drinking.
One of the key changes in the new EYFS this year is a focus on oral health. If school are allowing children to drink juice during the day then Ofsted will want to see each child brushing their teeth at the end of lunch time. As a teacher, I don't want to have to waste learning time (or my lunch time) policing 36 children brushing their teeth. If you really feel strongly that a carton of juice is essential fir your child's diet you can give her one to suck on after school.

I get annoyed as school lunches aren't exactly healthy!!!!

@SelkieQualia
Schools don't even seem to make an exception for children with special needs. Not just my son's school but my friend's child's school too so they don't drink at all for the whole day.

@Farwest

Water only in schools should be the rule (and milk if the school provides it). Juice boxes are an environmental shame and inevitably some cause mess. Trust me that if you put juice into her water bottle, her friends will know and they will tattle.

She can have juice at home.

^ this! The amount of packaging waste that packed lunches leaves is quite awful. Drinks cartons are the worst offenders. They’re coated with plastic internally so aren’t recyclable, often come with plastic straws, often spill all over the place when the children try to get into them. Their environmental impact is closely followed by crisp packets, yoghurt pots and cheese dunker tubs. After 30 years working in schools, I have never known any child to suffer from dehydration but I have seem some awful cases of dental decay in very young children! Fruit juice is one of the worst culprits.

@Amortentia we've had this issue for years, repeated water infections and constipation. Sons also autistic and school won't back down and admit defeat as nothing has worked and not through lack of trying.

All these children that are collapsing from dehydration because they won’t drink water.

Why won’t they drink water? Why do they have such a large distinction between water and juice? Its because of the choices offered by parents.

If children knew that a “drink” meant water from the very earliest age, there wouldn’t be such a problem. Of course a child would prefer a sugary fruit juice than water, never mind when the parents make excuses for them to not drink water.

Those saying “you’re lucky that your kids drink water” there’s nothing lucky about bringing little children up to view water as the thing you have when you’re thirsty. It’s a way of thinking, and a fundamental belief in the importance of oral health.

Always with smug responses that their children only drink water, and eat everything. Happy for you.
Look, flavoured water, squash or cold tea is a reasonable compromise between sweet juice and plain water. No need for overreach.

My DGD school has had this policy for years. The pupils are provided with an official school water bottle . It has to be filled with plain tap water each day and brought into school . They can re-fill it in school , but this is the only thing that they are allowed to drink while there .
I said to DGD that it would be easy to put clear flavoured water in the bottle instead but she very big on rules and won't consider it

@CatsArePeople the fact that you think a child that drinks water is also some sort of mythical beast that also eats everything, says more about you than it does about me.

There’s nothing “smug” about teaching your children that water is a desirable and acceptable thing to drink. Again, says more about you than it does about me.

The suggestion of cold tea is so beyond reason, that there’s really nothing I could say about it. Although, I have seen a 6 year old drinking a Monster energy drink, and it’s in the same vein

People who are lucky enough to have kids who don't have food aversions or other food-related SEN should be really careful about shaming people who are trying to do their best. Don't you think trying to meet their needs is hard enough?

School can't stop you if it's a legitimate SEN need though, which it sounds like it is. And then she won't need to worry about rules being broken because she'll have it recorded.

Juice isn’t food?

[quote Derbee]@CatsArePeople the fact that you think a child that drinks water is also some sort of mythical beast that also eats everything, says more about you than it does about me.

There’s nothing “smug” about teaching your children that water is a desirable and acceptable thing to drink. Again, says more about you than it does about me.

The suggestion of cold tea is so beyond reason, that there’s really nothing I could say about it. Although, I have seen a 6 year old drinking a Monster energy drink, and it’s in the same vein[/quote]
Cold tea and monster energy drinks are in the same vein?

@Poptasmagorical

People who are lucky enough to have kids who don't have food aversions or other food-related SEN should be really careful about shaming people who are trying to do their best. Don't you think trying to meet their needs is hard enough? School can't stop you if it's a legitimate SEN need though, which it sounds like it is. And then she won't need to worry about rules being broken because she'll have it recorded.

Genuine question. How do SEN children know that there are multiple other options than water, if it’s not from being offered other options?

What would happen if ALL children were brought up with water as the only option from as young as they can remember?

Of course some children REFUSE to drink water, but they only know there are other options such as juice and squash because they are given it as an alternative. And of course most children will opt for the sweet sugary drink. People who have children who won’t drink water (for whatever reason) will never acknowledge this fact though. It’s always like it’s completely out of their hands.

@Poptasmagorical cold tea is a reasonable drink to send to school for a child to drink?

This has been a major annoyance for me in the past as 2/4 of my kids just won't drink water....which was all that was allowed at my youngest's school.
No cake, no biscuits, no sweets & only water
I can understand all except the drinks... no parents (without exception) have ever supported drink rules that I've talked to.
Yet they're often hypocritical... every other week kids come home with mini smarties, cake or other banned things after teachers treat them.
We snuck ours clear looking flavoured water in a sports bottle.... but littleuns struggle with telling teachers / friends / anybody what they have (often more so when you say don't mention it 🙄🙄🙄).

Wish you well..... if you get a petition to the governors it might help... hopefully

All the best

@Derbee my kids only had water till they went to school, then they had sugar free vimto for special occasions and trips out. My oldest SEN child still will happily drink water, my youngest will only drink water at home no idea why. Although probably doesn't help when he was rushed into hospital due to a stomach bug, he'd been ill 10 days didn't keep anything down, and got to the point couldn't even keep fluids down, they gave him some Gaviscon as turned out it had set off his reflux, doctors orders were high-calorie fatty foods that he could manage to get his calories back up and juice has always been doctors orders during stomach bugs to keep their blood sugar up. So when he went back he had 2 weeks of chicken nuggets in his packed lunch, can't remember what else and juice. I do partly wonder if this could be part of the reason why. It's very difficult to work out the reason why as it's difficult to work out what's going on in their mind when they can't communicate what they are thinking properly.

I can completely understand the no juice carton things, they're just sugar. Kids don't need squash or juice they shouldn't even know it's an option, of course they'd rather that to plain water!

• I'm not talking about SEN kids.

I work in a dental hospital where we see thousands of children having teeth out because they won't drink water and won't eat anything other than sugary stuff, and then refuse to brush their teeth. Some of these kids are 2. They've literally only just got their teeth.

I was a strict 'water only' mum with my first, then along came my second who would not drink water at all. Then when he was ill he refused milk too, ended up even iller. I ended up taking him to the GP, who then sent me to the children's A&E where they prescribed... Apple juice. I felt like the biggest dick ever. Since then I always offer water, milk and squash with meals. And after years of this, he will usually choose water. Dentist says his teeth are perfect. I don't think rules like this help anybody. They are too rigid.

My other DC with ASD and sensory issues could not find a packed lunch they could eat that filled them up on the packed lunch rules, so switched to school dinners. Every lunch they just have chips, roast potatoes, or a plain baked potato and come home starving. I'm not sure what to do about it really. I mean I could just turn up at the school gates with a McDonald's every day and deal with the hate

Obviously the biggest problem with water drinking is not whether they have a little juice carton now or then, but whether they ever see grown ups drinking water. Growing up I never saw my parents or any other adults drinking water. I am trying to change my thinking around that as an adult and how I talk about water and whether my DC see me drink it. I try to see it as giving my body a gift not depriving myself of something tastier, and teach my DC the same. But it's a hard message to undo.

I’m convinced the diet of dc of MN consists of raw vegetables, but only the low carb variety. A small carton of 100% fruit juice isn’t going to kill anyone. Just brush your teeth well in the morning and at night.

[quote Derbee]@Poptasmagorical cold tea is a reasonable drink to send to school for a child to drink? [/quote]
That's not what I said at all

Schools need to back the fk off. Fruit juice is not poison FFS. I'd give my child whatever it needed to get through the day away from home. In an ideal world we would all just drink water but not everyone likes it. And how boring would that be! Sugar free shit poisoned with sweeteners is actually the devil's work. I grew up in 70s/80s.. drank lots of water but also juice; fresh orange, apple juice, Kia-Ora with full sugar, tea, fizzy juice at weekend or beach days or just out at shops when you couldn't buy bottled water! Didn't have a filling until I was 32, no weight issues.. healthy as fuck just like most other kids I grew up with. I do drink mostly water these days but still enjoy juice.. full sugar or fresh fruit juice.. artificial sweeteners are banned in my house.. utter chemical rubbish.. feel ill if I have anything with sweeteners. Still am a reasonable weight for my age and still only have 2 fillings!!