Any dog behaviourists/trainers around?

[SweetMaryHell]

AIBU to think that taking a very reactive dog on an organised dog walk (organised by working breed dog trainer) is likely to make the dogs issues worse?

His argument is that the dog needs to be exposed to walking around with other dogs present. My argument is that the dog is clearly uncomfortable being around other dogs so why force it?

I'm not a professional dog trainer but I train our working dogs. I wouldn't do a big walk like that. Needs to be uch smaller scale.

Maybe speak to the organiser and see their thoughts. They may walk with you or offer tips

Also not a trainer, but I would say that's like trying to 'cure' someone of severe arachnophobia by locking them in a room full of spiders.

If a dog is mildly uncomfortable in a certain situation, then positive exposure can help. If the dog is terrified, it will make things worse because the dog will only become more and more stressed, and will remember that feeling.

Not necessarily.
If your on an organised walk with other owners who are fully in control of their dogs. All in a lead. Then actually it's probably the best way of reintroducing being around other dogs if they can cope with it. You can then be at a distance that your dog is comfortable with and move closer as time goes on.
I guess it depends on what your dog is reacting to. My reactive dog can't cope with other dogs bounding up and being in her space or them running around. So controlled dog walks with other on lead dogs is hugely beneficial because not only does she learn that not all other dogs are going to be in her face but also being in a big group does tend to deter other peoples dogs from bounding over too.

I agree with @Dobbyafreeelf that the key issue is whether your dog feels comfortable. If the trainer is talking about forcing exposure even though the dog is unhappy, then that's a big no.

Not a trainer, but have raised 3 dogs from puppyhood and dealt with all sorts of issues.

Imo, a highly reactive dog should be gradually exposed to other dogs, to avoid making the problem worse. This is a situation where I would want to start off with a very calm "stooge dog" to get them used to the idea that not all dogs are something to fear or get excited by, and gradually increase exposure to more dogs.

@JesusInTheCabbageVan

Also not a trainer, but I would say that's like trying to 'cure' someone of severe arachnophobia by locking them in a room full of spiders.

If a dog is mildly uncomfortable in a certain situation, then positive exposure can help. If the dog is terrified, it will make things worse because the dog will only become more and more stressed, and will remember that feeling.

But what you describe is a recognised therapeutic technique - flooding - and it works!

I remember a cat was put into a crate, and the dog who hated cats was walked past the crate several times. Dog was on a lead, and was not taken close to the cat. After 5 exposures walking by the crate. Dog became calm, and started to show no interest in the crate or cat. I think it worked well. Might work for a dog in a crate as well

Depends on the dogs personality, breed etc.

Desensitisation isn’t a bad thing per say, normally works better if it’s fear or nerves rather than actual aggression. If all dogs are on a lead your dog will soon learn that the other dogs aren’t reacting and will settle, likely every time you do, your dog will calm quicker and eventually get used to it.

@ThereIsNoSuchThingAsRoadTax as I understand it, flooding can work if the person agrees to it and feels in control of the situation. If I pushed an arachnophobe into the spider room while shouting 'SURPRISE!' () or dragged them in there against their wishes, it would be different. So it does come down to whether the dog feels in control and is comfortable.

I should probably clarify that I'm basing my comments on my own experience of dealing with ddog's reactivity! I initially tried exposing her to friendly dogs and found that she got quite noticeably worse. What worked for me was distracting her with treats when passing another dog. She is now fat but calm

Some dogs are reactive towards dogs coming towards them, yet are fine walking side by side with strange dogs.

Maybe you could go with the expectation that you leave if dog is not coping. You will never know how they will be unless you try.

Again, not a trainer, or a behaviourist, but I do have a reactive dog.

This will make things worse, and more ingrained. It is a very, very bad idea.

Occasionally these things do appear to "work", but in reality what's actually happening is that the dog is so utterly overwhelmed it's shutting down emotionally. It's essentially a form of learned helplessness. It's in no way healthy, and just stores up more problems for the future.

I would recommend the owner sees a behaviourist accredited by one of these two organisations
apbc.org.uk/find-an-apbc-member/
asab.org/ccab-register
If you have pet insurance, many policies cover behaviour issues.

Great strides can be made with reactive dogs, but this isn't the way to go about it.

YANBU, this is asking for trouble. What works for reactive dogs is a very slow process of desensitisation, exposing them to other dogs at a far enough distance that it won't react, rewarding to create a positive association and slowly decreasing the distancing and increasing exposure over time. At worst if it's put in the situation you describe it will kick off massively, at best it might be so overwhelmed (flooding) that it shuts down and temporarily appears to be cured, but they'll do more harm than good in the long run. I have some sympathy with them, desensitisation can be a frustratingly slow process, but it does have good outcomes if you persevere.