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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Staff absence due to childcare

60 replies

HelpIHaveNoStaff · 20/10/2021 11:02

NC for this .

I'm a manager of a small business. I'm struggling because several employees are off a lot with poorly children. Covid related obviously - wasnt a problem before.

I understand this happens and I'm happy for them to be on paid sick leave. However, they all have spouses who do not do their share of the childcare when children have to be off.

I really, really don't want to be an arse, but I'm letting down clients due to staff shortages, we are hanging by a thread, and I feel it would be avoidable if these employees parental responsibilities were shared more evenly with spouses.

I dont even know how I can possibly raise this with staff. But if the business collapses we'll all lose our jobs.

AIBU to expect parents to go 50/50 on childcare duties where possible in these situations?

How can I communicate this?

OP posts:

KylieKoKo · 20/10/2021 11:19

I don't think that you can dictate what the spouses of your employees should do.

What you can do is have a policy that you can afford and that is within the confines of the law and apply it equally to everyone.

HugeAckmansWife · 20/10/2021 11:20

It's not an unreasonable expectation from your perspective at all. However, how many of your (I'm guessing female) employees are not full time or not the main wage earner. If most of them are mums who were on mat leave while the dad carried on his career regardless they will be used o the dynamic that his job is more important and employers of dads are no great at appreciating the fairness of a 50/50 split.
As to communication, if possible I'd suggest a very open, cards on the table approach. You are being v fair already by allowing it as paid leave. In the end, if they want a company to work for they need to appreciate the bottom line.

sqirrelfriends · 20/10/2021 11:21

How do you know their partners aren't doing their fair share?

When I need to be off for my DC, I let my manager and team know but I don't if DH has him as I'm not affected.

Could they WFH?

Sally872 · 20/10/2021 11:22

We get 5 dependant care days per year. Expected to use these, AL or unpaid leave for childcare. Might motivate them to split it more evenly.

Paddingtonsmarmlade · 20/10/2021 11:24

I think all you can do is adjust your paid part of the situation. I don’t expect that many employees will pay for child care leave therefore it’s a no brainier for the parents to decide between one parent taking the day off paid and one that won’t be paid. In our situation it would always be me taking the leave as I work much sorter part time job and dh is the main earner.

zealouslemur · 20/10/2021 11:24

You sound extremely nice and understanding. Unfortunately I think you might be shooting yourself in the foot a bit offering paid sick leave for childcare. I don't think many employers are doing this so it makes your employees the obvious choice as main carer - not much incentive for their partner to do the childcare if they'd have to sacrifice pay or make up hours! I'm sorry I don't have a good solution to offer! 😳

Lulu2021 · 20/10/2021 11:26

How do you know their partners aren't doing their fair share?

I was about to ask the same. Would you necessarily communicate to your boss that DH is off today with the kids? I wouldn't. It doesn't affect my work so why mention it, unless it came up in conversation

Emilizz34 · 20/10/2021 11:27

Surely paid sick leave is for when the employee is sick rather than their child .
It is very generous of you to allow sick leave for this as I doubt many . This is probably why their partners aren’t taking time off

Stompythedinosaur · 20/10/2021 11:27

I agree that it is shit and unfair when parents don't split the sick days. But there is no legal way to force them.

Work out what is affordable - paid leave is all at a managers discretion at my workplace and not commonly granted for more than 2 days a year. Leave is unpaid after that.

Do bear in mind that it may not be your employee's choice and they may have no choice about their partner's lack of stepping up when needed.

RaininSummer · 20/10/2021 11:28

I agree that it's very unusual to get paid sick time when not sick yourself. You are not being unreasonable to expect the childcare to be shared.

Fetarabbit · 20/10/2021 11:28

Paid sick leave for a poorly child sounds odd, as a PP has said, no wonder their other half's (if they have one) might not be doing their share; there's every chance they won't be paid! You can be a supportive and caring employer whilst looking after your own needs too, I'm not sure how it would work now you've set a precedent but I'd look at your policies- most places have x days a year or to use annual leave. It is hard with children, but similarly you have a business to run. Can any be done from home?

Original poster

HelpIHaveNoStaff · 20/10/2021 11:30

How do you know their partners aren't doing their fair share?

We have a chatty and open working environment and lots of comments made, sometimed whinging that their partner is useless and won't help, sometimes apologetic "I wish DH could cover,I know it's a pain, but his boss would go mental" etc.

I feel like if we can't sort it I'll have to actually strictly apply our formal policy which is that days off caring for dependents is unpaid. I hate having to do this as I have some (a minority) of staff who are pretty reasonable in taking turns, and because I would have to apply policy evenly on everyone they would be hurt by the change.

Aaaaaaargh. It's not a job you can do wfh, have to be there in person. I know theres often a dynamic post kids that the DHs job matters more (I'm female and my career took a bit of a backseat too) but DH and I manage to split this stuff even though he's on double the wage I am.

OP posts:

Twillow · 20/10/2021 11:32

Paid leave for childcare issues? I think that's the issue. It's very good of you but you know it's not mandatory?

I work for a national company where we do not get sick pay until the 4th day of absence. We also have return to work interviews after even 1 day sick/absent. For situations like a sick child leave is unpaid.

I think they're getting a bit too comfortable with the paid sick leave, rather than anything to do with their other halves not pulling their weight. And you would be on very dodgy ground trying to raise it in that way, I suspect.

Rethink your sick policy. Have a straight-up talk/ write a letter to staff setting out how much it is costing the business and what the effects on your ability to survive are. Change your policy to unpaid or annual leave for childcare issues. I suspect you'll see a massive difference.

Original poster

HelpIHaveNoStaff · 20/10/2021 11:32

Paid sick leave for a poorly child sounds odd

I know, it's more that pre-covid it wasnt happening lots, I didnt mind turning a blind eye here and there as it didnt impact on clients as it was infrequent, I know it's a pain when your kid is off school sick so I tried to be decent about it.

I feel like its backfired now, people are constantly off with kids having to be PCR tested, the work isnt being caught up.

OP posts:

Original poster

HelpIHaveNoStaff · 20/10/2021 11:33

Tbh though even if I make it unpaid sick it's not going to solve for my reliability issue and letting down clients :(

OP posts:

WhenISnappedAndFarted · 20/10/2021 11:35

No but it might make them consider some other childcare option sometimes such as the father. They aren't going to consider another option when they can take a paid day off

Fallagain · 20/10/2021 11:36

@HelpIHaveNoStaff

Tbh though even if I make it unpaid sick it's not going to solve for my reliability issue and letting down clients :(

You can’t make it unpaid sick leave, it’s not sick leave. You need to make it unpaid parental leave.

It may change the culture though especially if their partners get paid parental leave.

8dpwoah · 20/10/2021 11:37

Most places I've worked (schools though) have allowed five days paid for dependents and then any more unpaid, although there is also a special leave policy that covers more exceptional stuff.

Maybe that's the half way approach- the ones that try to split it should be ok with five days, and the ones that don't might be more inclined to consider it? It doesn't work so well for those that have no other option but to do it themselves but I don't know what else you can do about that really.

I also don't know the specifics of including/excluding covid absence from that but at least this might help even things out for the more usual stuff.

userchange987 · 20/10/2021 11:38

YANBU at all. The total disregard for employers when posters on here say "but my husband earns more" well I'm not bloody surprised with that attitude.

8dpwoah · 20/10/2021 11:38

Five days in 12 months, that should say. Obviously bearing in mind that's only really 10 working months with the holidays etc.

2020isnotbehaving · 20/10/2021 11:38

If one employee is offering unlimited fully paid no problem time off for childcare then of course they become the default parent to be off its a no brainier.

You as a business have taken the hit over the last 18m or so now it’s fully acceptable to offer paid for set number of days a year or like most people unpaid unless you are the person who is sick. It’s hard for parents but even harder if your business goes under because you don’t have staff to complete the jobs and bring money in.

Hardbackwriter · 20/10/2021 11:39

@HelpIHaveNoStaff

Tbh though even if I make it unpaid sick it's not going to solve for my reliability issue and letting down clients :(

It will if it drastically reduces how much time your staff take off! As people have said if one parent will get paid if they have the day off and the other won't the vast majority of people would choose that the one that gets paid stays off.

As a compromise you could continue to pay but only for X days per year, as that avoids penalising the people who are already sharing.

Clymene · 20/10/2021 11:39

@HelpIHaveNoStaff

Paid sick leave for a poorly child sounds odd

I feel like its backfired now, people are constantly off with kids having to be PCR tested, the work isnt being caught up.

Well it's backfired on you. Of course they'll take the time off if you keep paying them! There's bugger all incentive for you to find an alternative solution.

You're running a business. You're not their mate, you're their boss. You need to enforce your own rules.

Apart from the impact on clients, have you worked out how much it's costing you to fund their days off?

BrilliantBetty · 20/10/2021 11:41

I get 5 days per year UNPAID for childcare / dependancy leave.

If you're a small company, can you discuss it with them? Find a way around it.. maybe WFH if looking after a DC. Coming in to make hours up if they don't want it to be unpaid. You're in a tricky situation.

Original poster

HelpIHaveNoStaff · 20/10/2021 11:42

8dpwoah I like this idea, thanks it's a good option.

So allow a fixed number of days parental/dependents leave paid, then beyond that unpaid. Might go for a day per quarter as that may help spread it through the year, eg if a kid is sick for two days in a row, the first is paid but theres more incentive for other options to be used on second (unpaid day).

Thanks everyone.

OP posts:

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