AIBU - plotting DC on Excel.

[HolidayByHour]

I have a feeling IANBU. But validation helps. NC as I've written a lot on here already.

I'm an armchair psychologist and convinced my exH (of 5 years - yay!) is a sociopath. He delights in game playing and confrontation from the safety of his keyboard (he would cry / wobble bottom lip if we ever had an actual face to face "argument" when married 🤦🏼‍♀️, alternatively he would sulk. Record was 23 days of not talking to me...) and whilst he himself is a result of childhood trauma (he's never got past the age of 6-8, even the DC complain about how childish he is) he cannot see that the cycle is continuing and that he has turned into his own bullying, intimidating, psychologically manipulative, emotionally sterile, cruel etc etc late father.

ExH50 had therapy when DC11 & DC10 were born - he had a bit of a breakdown as firstly, he was no longer my priority; and secondly, he was terrified of turning into his own father / history repeating itself with his own DC. So somewhere deep inside he's very conscious of his own behaviour.

Christmas 2021. He was supposed to have DC last year, but for Covid. We have a court order which states Christmas alternates, and holidays are shared. I've suggested he collects DC Christmas Eve, and returns NYE. It means we get the first week, and he gets Christmas / the second week. Then we get them home for NYE.

Apparently this is not an equal split because they don't return to school until Tuesday 4. In fact, he's sent me a spreadsheet. Outlining the split of hours. Down to the minute. To show how unequal it is. Obviously he hasn't come up with any alternative.

AIBU to think he's certifiable? Seriously? Are the DC some sort of shared commodity rather than actual little humans? Would a 2am handover be more appropriate?

Please tell me your negotiation nightmares regarding holiday split with exH! Or else make me see sense - how else could we split without DC being moved from pillar to post every second / third / fourth day?

Poor kids 😔. My dad sounds like your ex although he was the opposite and didnt want us. He just wanted my mum and said when they got divorced we go with her!

He is being ridiculously petty.

If he doesn't think its equal then swap? Yiu habe xmas eve to nye?!

Oh Pink. I showed a friend the SS and she said she just wished her exH would stop flitting in and out of her children's lives when it suits him. It must have been awful as a child to feel so abandoned, I am so sorry.

The irony is that before the court order it was EOW, and that's it. ExH couldn't be bothered / couldn't handle / couldn't manage more than that. It was court that gave him more than he even asked for 🤦🏼‍♀️

My ex has now decided that he will see only one of ours at any time (he sees them once a month for lunch roughly) as they apparently bicker and fight and he does not get any quality time when there's two of them together (surprise surprise!). So I don't even have any kids-free time now.

He's more concerned with getting "his fair share" than the kids here isn't he.... maybe he can go for the day on the inset day.... especially if you/he are working then!

@forinborin that's appalling - how old are your DC? How do they "manage" this set-up?

In first mediation session exH suggested alternating DC EOW - so alternate weekends with 1 x DC at a time (he has / had a golden and a scapegoat). Mediator looked at him in horror and said "that's not how this works".

Weirdly, if golden is poorly, he will take scapegoat alone, no qualms. If scapegoat is poorly, he kicks off massively. Scapegoat was in hospital one of exH weekends and he threatened to come and discharge him himself (wouldn't visit though...) because it was "his" weekend.

If he is calculating to the minute, and you are calculating in days, where a "day" is say 24 hours of holiday starting at 6pm, round down your days so he gets the same or more days, and definitely more hours/minutes. You don't case about fractions of a day and he does, so everyone is happy.

That's assuming he wants more time. If it's the opposite, round the other way. Either way, your giving him more than he thinks is right, so he can't complain.

OK I see I may not have understood the issue. There are two rules, he needs to get Christmas and half the holidays. Work out if Christmas is in the first or second half of the holidays, and give him that half. Round days as suggested above.

I'm assuming no agreement about when holidays start and end. I'd say 6pm (or whatever) on the day school breaks up to 6pm on the night before the first day of the new term. The night before the new term they need to be at home.

Assuming no disagreement, I should have said. Which I suppose is a bit optimistic.

@RandomLondoner

Assuming no disagreement, I should have said. Which I suppose is a bit optimistic.

Honestly I don't think separated parents who can agree on child contact end up in court 🤣

[quote HolidayByHour]@forinborin that's appalling - how old are your DC? How do they "manage" this set-up?

In first mediation session exH suggested alternating DC EOW - so alternate weekends with 1 x DC at a time (he has / had a golden and a scapegoat). Mediator looked at him in horror and said "that's not how this works".

Weirdly, if golden is poorly, he will take scapegoat alone, no qualms. If scapegoat is poorly, he kicks off massively. Scapegoat was in hospital one of exH weekends and he threatened to come and discharge him himself (wouldn't visit though...) because it was "his" weekend. [/quote]
6 and 7. Yes, same situation with a golden and a scapegoat here.
The scapegoat has a diagnosed SEN that he "doesn't believe in", apparently I was able to fool the school, the nursery, the NHS and the private therapists in order to get some sympathy.

I don't think they understand the details of what is going on, so it is not too bad.
He wants to have only one of them for 3 weeks this Christmas (guess which one), I have a strong urge to refuse as this is bizarre, but then I don't know what the court position would be and I really really dread spending thousands on the legal advice (it is officially "his" Christmas under the child arrangement order, so I cannot just refuse like that).

@RandomLondoner - I wish you were my exH. Because in all honesty, all this needs is a civil telephone conversation, and the arrangements would be made. DC have never spent more than 6 overnights with him and court has increased contact in a "stepped" manner - so for example next summer they will spend a fortnight with him. Going by your suggestion, DC would go to exH on Friday 17 and return Boxing Day (9 overnights). That's quite a lot for them to manage - he's not just an arsehole to me. 😳

@forinborin - you have every right (I've done a lot of court stuff - my own case as well as many many others) to say no, the children come as a pair. And he doesn't have the right to have one for the entire Christmas period....

The denial of SEN sounds so familiar. I over exaggerate the DC (rare) health condition, and of course because they inherited it from him, he had it far far worse than they ever did.... I've also manipulated school, therapists, and various medical professionals to diagnose high ACES results, (adverse childhood experiences, including attachment disorder and trauma) and anxiety. Also, despite the DC having the notoriously awful nationwide "Covid cold" for weeks, "they showed no symptoms when with [exH] this weekend" hence why he neglected to give them any prescribed medication.

He's right though isn't he? You get nine days, he gets six, writing off the two days where you are exchanging them.

Usually here the problem is that the Dad doesn't want contact, not that he does.

What would the children like to do?

@HarrietsChariot

He's right though isn't he? You get nine days, he gets six, writing off the two days where you are exchanging them.

Usually here the problem is that the Dad doesn't want contact, not that he does.

Hello. Yes you are right - absolutely. Here's the spreadsheet. The thing is, he doesn't then offer a suggestion as to how we could split it more fairly - he simply tells me I'm inflexible and that it isn't fair. He also counts the last day of the holidays as 24 hours when clearly, they need to be with the RP on that "overnight".

It's just the usual BS associated with trying to negotiate with him. Court order specified actual dates and times up until now, so no room for issues. The minute it's up to the parents who are divorced for a reason, it all goes pear shaped.

@HollowTalk

What would the children like to do?

They would like to be here at home for the first week, in the run up to Christmas. They would also like some time at home before they go back to school - it takes them a few days to readjust when they return after spending more than a weekend with their father, so generally they like a "sandwich" - home, dad's house, home - after longer periods spent with him.

I would like to have New Year as we aren't having Christmas. It's hard to know how else to split.

@forinborin

My ex has now decided that he will see only one of ours at any time (he sees them once a month for lunch roughly) as they apparently bicker and fight and he does not get any quality time when there's two of them together (surprise surprise!). So I don't even have any kids-free time now.

Your ex is a cunt.

I would apply some sort of formulae to the spreadsheet that gives Xmas Eve - Boxing Day a higher weighting as they are "prime" days. He's actually getting the best of the quality time and you are getting the end of term tiredness and back to school admin / drudge.

Also legally the inset days are not school holidays. So you don't have to share those with him to be in compliance with court order.

@Auntycorruption

I would apply some sort of formulae to the spreadsheet that gives Xmas Eve - Boxing Day a higher weighting as they are "prime" days. He's actually getting the best of the quality time and you are getting the end of term tiredness and back to school admin / drudge.

I really appreciate this - I guess this is exactly how I feel. Order states simply "Christmas Day to be alternated." New sibling too, so baby's first Christmas and I'm still handing DC over on a plate decorated with all things Christmas-y, but it still isn't good enough. If he were to respond and make considered suggestions as to how we might resolve this, fine, but every which way I present a split he uses it as a stick to beat me with and to be honest? It says "the father to give notice of all school holiday dates". I'm bored of carrying him.

Why not just let the children go to his a couple of days earlier so it’s half and half?

@BasementIdeas - probably because we consider Christmas Eve, Christmas Day and Boxing Day to be the "special days", and ideally would like these to be shared in some way?

Send back your own spreadsheet- he can have them when they’re asleep (12 hours a day), you can have their waking hours, apart from Christmas when he can have the full 24 hours. Seriously though your kids are old enough to express a preference, just keep making your suggestion and saying this is what the kids want and I consider it to be fair. It sounds more than reasonable to me especially given the kids’ own views. If he’s stupid enough to try to take this to court then I very much doubt he’d get anywhere.

Thank you @Heronwatcher - that's a great idea! He can also have them just after they break up when they're exhausted, and just before they go back when they need haircuts and dentist appointments, and suddenly find PE kit hidden at the bottom of their school bags, and boots which haven't had the mud removed intertwined with history projects and maths homework...