To think that wages have gone down A LOT in the past 20 years or so

[Poetrypatty]

I'm looking at some roles where the amount offered is probably what would have been offered for that job, or possibly even less, than what you'd have got paid in about 1999. And that's often for graduates where you wouldn't have needed a degree back then and you do now. That's not even taking into account inflation or house prices.

I'm talking started and mid level office roles in particular rather than NMW jobs. I do think at the higher end wages have gone up, managers etc. For those who are old enough to remember, AIBU?

[AlphabetAerobics]

It’s not all unicorns and rainbows in the EU either - and I know this because I was there when the euro was introduced and during 2008.

When the euro came into play literally everything doubled overnight - except wages natch.

My salary went up a few thousand over 15 years and my spending power went from “buying anything I fancied” to scraping around for pennies.

My pension was decimated with the double whammy of having our contributions increase to cover current liabilities AND our own expectations were greatly lowered.

My holidays were cut 25%.

[phlebasconsidered]

@motherrunner me too- an nqt will soon catch me up and i have almost 20 years in the job. Experience counts for nothing. Still, at least it means I won't be seen as comparatively expensive for long! And there might soon be jobs that are not just advertised for nqt's.

[Dbank]

YANBU, but it's really not that unexpected, we've had 20 years of increased supply in the labour market, with a growing population driven by immigration.

There might be some short term adjustment post Brexit / covid, but I fear this will be swamped by the impact of automation and AI.

Tax 'n' spend won't fix it either...

[moimichme]

This article seems relevant to the topic, albeit not entirely happy reading for those who aren't already at the top income wise:

bylinetimes.com/2021/10/18/taking-jobs-or-creating-jobs-the-impact-of-brexit-on-wages/?fbclid=IwAR2uPPFRh_nuocUnA_30ZHjzPWqh2vrJk82uVDa6fKeIkuDsV0MW0S9UtL8

[Poetrypatty]

It all makes for depressing reading doesn't it. I despair for our kids and wouldn't want mine to have to move to Australia, even though that sounds better. HGV driving, plumbing, roofing, and other trades seem to be a good move at the moment, and University education an expensive thing but also seemingly necessary for the most basic office jobs. There's no answer in sight for any of this either is there?

[thismumismad]

Nmw has meant that people don't get what they deserve to be paid and it's been a race to the bottom. Gone are the unions to negotiate a real wage, nmw is an excuse to pay the least they can get away with.

[Nat6999]

I left the Civil Service in 2011, my salary for full time was 18785, the pay for the same grade & increment level now is 20400, I sold my 3 bed ex council house for £64000 in 2011, that house has just sold for £115000, wages aren't keeping up with house prices & when you consider how much utilities, petrol & food etc have gone up over the last year due to the pandemic, in real terms wages have gone down.

[Gettingthereslowly2020]

What do we tell our children? "Work hard at school, college, and university and you'll be able to just about manage" - it's not very encouraging, is it?

[PickUpAPepper]

I was brought up in the days when you were told "work hard at school, college and university and there will be rewards". Then the house prices went up. It was a total lie.

[PickUpAPepper]

[quote phlebasconsidered]@motherrunner me too- an nqt will soon catch me up and i have almost 20 years in the job. Experience counts for nothing. Still, at least it means I won't be seen as comparatively expensive for long! And there might soon be jobs that are not just advertised for nqt's.[/quote]
The only trouble with this is that the NQT is expected to do the same job as a senior teacher, and are held to the same standards. Why shouldn't they have the same wage, especially after a few years? If you want a better wage then you need to take on extra responsibilities, the same as in every other sector.

[rigkiuowbskjs]

I have no idea what I am going to tell my kids, especially as things have changed so much since I let uni twenty years ago. At the time, there were hardly any IT jobs and public sector jobs were very attractive. We never assumed that we'd make real money but they were seen as professional career jobs. Who knows what will be the right thing to do when they make that decision in 15 years time. Perhaps everything will be automated and only certain jobs will remain.

I find that it's not just the change but also the lack of foresight. My parents keep telling me that I could have become a lawyer or a banker if I wanted to make money, which is all true. But I decided to become a civil servant instead precisely because I wanted to contribute to society. I wasnt to know that 2008 plus a decade of Tory government was going to hit us. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

[Jmaho]

@Ibelieveinghosts

Mod level professional service role c £50k in 2007, c£50k 2021.

There seems to have been a narrative since the 2008 crash that professionals should be glad to have a job. So coupled with a 15 year pay freeze they are being worked into the ground expected to work 24/7and be grateful -covid has been a wake up call to many and now everyone is leaving and forms struggling to fill vacancies.

My company take this stance too, that we should be grateful to have a job. I work for a bank. Most of the people I work with have years of experience and our roles are constantly changing and we are expected to take on more and more. Learning new policies and supporting other areas. We either don't get payrises or get a very small one as a token gesture. Haven't had any sort of bonus for 10 years. No shares, no preferential rates. Crap pension. No paid overtime. No healthcare etc. You bank hours but are never able to take them as its always so busy. They made loads of compulsory redundancies a while ago. Lost 2000 staff across the business and the rest of us are stretched even thinner. We see the annual profit figures. They are making millions. When they do have to recruit they offer a low amount and no one applies so they have to offer more so often new starters are being paid more than people who have been here for years and we're training them and more often than not they can't do the job and end up having to leave as don't pass the performance reviews. Problem is every other bank seems to be the same. I see job adverts for my role but they want someone senior so with qualifications and years of experience in certain areas. They are offering around 30k a year which is ludicrous.
The only way to increase salary is to apply for a management role and I'm done it before. The pressure and long hours just aren't worth the extra 10k a year.

[comingintomyown]

YANBU OP I was shocked when I was job hunting 4 years ago for a fairly basic admin/customer service role thinking £24k ( suburb of London) would be achievable. Almost all were around £21k or less and any higher paid roles required a huge list of skills and experience. I remember when I contacted one of the agencies I was registered with for an update them telling me nothing had come in “ for the kind of salary you are looking for “