free private flu vaccines at work - fair?

[Orangejuicemarathoner]

We are being offered free private flu vaccines at work, although I am aware of neighbours who cannot get their NHS vaccine at the moment because of shortages and delivery problems.

I'm in two minds about the fairness of this. Its a school - yes we want to keep it running, I am entitled to a free NHS one, if and when it becomes available-

I am not sure whether to take them up on their offer. I am not sure whether they should be offering at all. I am not sure whether they will be able to deliver on their offer

YABU - its fine for private companies to buy and pay for flu jabs for their employees

YANBU - all flu jabs should be made available to the NHS to decide on priorities

If the system was correctly organised, you wouldn't need a private jab. But as we live in the messy UK, there is no point you not taking that private jab - it won't go to anyone more worthy.

By taking it you may block a chain of transmission from you to a child with a vulnerable parent - so you are doing the right thing taking it.

DD and Dh get them throughtheir jobs I think it's totally fine to take them,why wouldn't you take it. Nobody wants flu going rife through a school.

My employer will refund the cost to us, so I've booked mine at Boots for tomorrow, I haven't taken up the offer previously, I've only had it the year I happened to be pregnant over winter. Take the jab!

We're getting vouchers to have it done at Boots.I work in an primary academy

I live in Canada. Flu shots are free to older adults and vulnerable people (asthma etc).

For literally more than a decade my employer has had a flu vaccine clinic at my place of work. It is free for everyone and on site.

Employers do this because it is good practice to lower the incidence and spread of influenza in the workplace and the resulting absenteeism etc.

It does not create flu vaccine shortages.

I guess you might think it was unfair if you work for an employer who doesn't do this, but in my experience I have never seen anyone turned away. The criteria are very broad and I think many gps give it free anyway. I copied the list below from the government website.

Flu is nasty. I have had it a few times and ended up having to go to emergency for asthma flares. Also, both my parents caught it and sadly could not fight it off. They both died, albeit mid 80s.

We take it pretty seriously in our family.

The full list of those eligible for the free flu shot includes:
Children six months to less than five years of age.
Pregnant women at any stage of pregnancy during the influenza season.
Seniors 65 years and older.
Residents of any age living in residential care, assisted living or other group facilities.
Aboriginal people.
Children and teenagers required to take Aspirin® or ASA for long periods of time due to a medical condition.
Children and adults with certain medical conditions, including: ◦Heart or lung disorders that require regular medical care (e.g., asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, cystic fibrosis).
Kidney disease and chronic liver disease (e.g., hepatitis, diabetes, cancer, anemia, weakened immune system).
Those with health conditions that cause difficulty breathing, swallowing, or a risk of choking on food or fluids (e.g., people with severe brain damage, spinal cord injury, seizures or neuromuscular disorders).
Those who are very obese.
Household contacts of people at high risk.
Household contacts, caregivers and daycare staff of children under five years of age.
Doctors, nurses and other health care providers.
People who live or work in confined settings (e.g., correctional facilities).
Those who provide care or service to people at high risk in potential outbreak settings (e.g., cruise ships).
People who provide essential community services (e.g., police officers, firefighters, paramedics).
Farmers and other people who work with live poultry.

@SpamIAm

I'm not aware of any shortages this year? There have been some delays but supplies are plentiful I think. I'm nhs, not frontline, and it's the first time in years they've allowed us to get flu jabs right from the start of the campaign rather than reserving them for frontline staff due to concerns about supply.

Our GP phoned me the other day and told us to get our vaccine wherever we can as they were having supply problems.

We got it done in Tesco, who seem to have a plentiful supply.

Last year my ECV husband had his jab 2 months later than me because there was a shortage of the right vaccine for people his age. The supplies had gone to places where people pay for it rather than to the GPs.

The flu vaccine is not in short supply. Therefore it’s fine for it to be paid for by companies or whoever wants. It doesn’t need to be rationed according to need.

When I got my private vaccine today, the nurse told me it’s an inferior one to the one you would get through the NHS, as the NHS buys the good cell cultured vaccine and they get the less effective egg cultured vaccine. Can’t promise it’s true, but that is what the nurse said. So I don’t feel bad for taking the inferior vaccine. My DH already got his flu vaccine - presumably the better one - with his covid booster.

@MissConductUS

There's plenty in the US. My local pharmacy was doing them in mid-August, no appointment was required.

The OP isn’t in America, she is in the UK.

I always get a private one and use my work expenses card to pay for it. I'm not eligible for a free one, it saves me being ill and costing work lots of money, I've never thought it was unfair just sensible.

@ATieLikeRichardGere

When I got my private vaccine today, the nurse told me it’s an inferior one to the one you would get through the NHS, as the NHS buys the good cell cultured vaccine and they get the less effective egg cultured vaccine. Can’t promise it’s true, but that is what the nurse said. So I don’t feel bad for taking the inferior vaccine. My DH already got his flu vaccine - presumably the better one - with his covid booster.

I have worked both NHS and private giving flu vaccines. The vast majority of flu vaccines are cultured on fertilised hens eggs. They do also have a flu vaccine cultured on cells- specifically for those allergic to eggs. I have never been told that one is inferior to the other at all!

When I gave vaccines via a private companies (BUPA and Nuffield), we'd go to peoples work places to give the vaccines and the only ones we carried were the egg based ones. IF people had an egg allergy, we advised them to see their GP and didn't give them the egg based vaccine.

When I worked within an NHS setting, we had access to both cell and egg based vaccines.

OP- the vaccines are not free! Your work place is paying a significant amount to have them given privately on site at your office!

@MrzClaus

Not all flu vaccines are the same - the NHS vaccines / private vaccines / vaccines in pharmacies are often for different strains. They also use different supply chains 😊 If there's a local shortage it might be because they're prioritising covid boosters / third primary doses, locally to me they're running clinics alongside each other but the covid ones are getting priority.

Also - if you refuse a free dose, it won't be given to one of your neighbours so I'd take it if you want it!

No, this is also not 100% true! The WHO advise which strains are within the flu vaccines for each year and in each hemisphere. The vaccine you get in Canada/US for example, should be the exact same strains as in the UK in the same season.

For general private companies- nuffield/bupa- they also provide the exact same flu vaccine strains as the WHO advise. Same as you'd get at your GP/Boots/Superdrug etc.

The only time I have seen this being different, is where people have worked in a specific viral laboratory/virology setting and specifically requested paying for an extra strain of virus being in their vaccine. I only saw this once in many years in this sector, and this was 8yrs ago, where the regular flu vaccine had 3 strains and this company asked about one with 4 strains- the extra strain being the one they researched.

I thought the supply issues had mostly been resolved now?

Had mine at Boots two weeks ago and there were lots of appointments to choose from for the private one. For those saying the private ones are less effective, I got the Flucelvax Tetra which is not egg based and from what I read should be one of the most effective. I know that will depend on the strains included each year and it's sometimes hard to predict though.

@Hairyfriend

I looked at the NICE guidance and I don’t think it’s correct that the only reason for using the cell cultured vaccines is due to egg allergy. The cell cultured on is the first line option for the vulnerable 18-65s - there must be a reason for that.

bnf.nice.org.uk/treatment-summary/influenza-vaccine-2.html

This goes some way to explaining why the egg cultured one is likely to be a bit less effective

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7036483/

And here is a list of the vaccines available this year
www.gov.uk/government/publications/influenza-vaccine-ovalbumin-content/influenza-vaccines-2020-to-2021-flu-season

I get a free vaccine through work but when you book it you have to declare why (eg over 50, underlying condition, corporate scheme) and the chemist prioritise the high risk people first and the corporate last. Seems fair

Hospitals, NHS GPs and NHS pharmacies order their own stock from manufacturers and wholesalers. If you are eligible you can get a NHS vaccine free. This means there is a varied and highly distributed model of delivery. Supply problems are often specific to a manufacturer or wholesaler. That’s why the GP can stock whilst the nearby pharmacy doesn’t. Or vice versa.

The NHS also holds a national stock of flu vaccines which can be released stock and supply issues arise.

The NHS has advised that people should get the flu vaccine as soon as possible and not wait this year.

So your answer to help NHS shortages would be to refuse a private one offered to you for free, and then put more pressure on the NHS to jab you as well as all others waiting for one?

And in the meantime, you are working in a school where outbreaks spread like wildfire...

The more people who get vaccinated the better, if its free and convenient to you then that's great. I think its brilliant when employers take this initiative.

Tell your neighbours to just book a vaccine online. They can go to Boots, Tesco, Lloyd's, anywhere. If they're entitled to a free vaccine they won't have to pay, you just tick the relevant box, you don't need any sort of a voucher either.

I'd bet your neighbours haven't even tried to get a vaccine, they're probably just sitting back waiting for someone to come to them.

Our GP did them a few weeks ago and all the pharmacies seem to have them, so it must be a local delivery issue and I doubt your neighbours will be waiting too long.

Personally I think flu jabs should be offered for everyone via the NHS or pharmacies and just particularly encouraged for the current flu groups. When employers are willing to pay and encourage vaccination that's great, take them up on it.

@msbevvy I'm surprised by that. There were issues last year (not sure if it was an actual supply issue or just supply not meeting increased demand during a pandemic) - I wanted to pay for one, I normally get it free in work but was on mat leave, but I couldn't find anywhere willing to sell me one, all pharmacies here were reserving them for those eligible for them on the nhs.

There are 3 different vaccines. Over 65s have a different vaccine; 3 strains instead of 4 for younger adults, and nasal vaccine for kids. There was a shortage last year of the over 65s vaccine for a period of time; younger adults having a vaccine or children having the nasal vaccine wouldn't have any effect on supply, because it was a different vaccine.

@BluebellsGreenbells

I've mine booked in Boots tomorrow (London) even though I'm entitled to a flu vaccine I'd rather pay to get it done now rather than wait

Boots offer the free jab to those eligible

How do you prove it?