To bin the latest Sally Rooney?

[JumperandJacket]

Genuinely shocked by the news she has banned the translation of her book into Hebrew. I can see no reading of this that isn’t straightforward antisemitism. She may claim it’s a protest against the Israeli government but to equate Hebrew speakers with the government of Israel is in itself deeply racist. The only other writer I know of to have done this is Icke-fancier, Alice Walker.

Plus the book is boring as shit.

@sunshinesupermum

As long as she has also refused to have her work translated into Arabic so as to boycott the likes of the Iranian government, or Cantonese/Mandarin to boycott the CCP, or even Cyrillic/Russian or Hungarian as a stand against Putin and Orban respectively, then her actions cannot be regarded as antisemitic. If, on the other hand, she chooses to boycott Israel and only Israel, then yes; it is antisemitism.*

As has been pointed out repeatedly on this thread, she hasn't boycotted a language. Not to mention that the person you quote doesn't know what language is spoken in Iran.

But to extend your argument, if someone refused to have her book translated into Chinese or Hungarian, would you accuse them of Sinophobia or anti Magyarism? Would you demand that they also refuse to have their book translated into Hebrew? Or does the alleged 'double standard' only work one way?

The treatment of Palestinians is absolutely shocking. It is not being Semitic to say that. What do we do? Just pretend that Israel is not doing it, just not to appear Semitic? Good on Sally for taking a stand.

Full statement from Sally Rooney for those who haven’t seen it:

She definitely should not allow her book to be translated into Chinese, Arabic, or a number of other languages. Or allow it to be sold in the UK, the nation which oppressed hers for so long. Or yada yada. And anyway, she'd be doing them all a favor because her books are confusing and boring anyway.

@siucra

The treatment of Palestinians is absolutely shocking. It is not being Semitic to say that. What do we do? Just pretend that Israel is not doing it, just not to appear Semitic? Good on Sally for taking a stand.

I agree. Criticism of Israel is not anti-Semitic. No state is above criticism.

@NotLettingItSlide
Firstly, the IHRA explicitly states that criticism levelled at Israel of the same standard that is levelled at any other nation cannot be regarded as antisemitic. Your claim that anyone who criticises Israel legitimately is accused of antisemitism is factually incorrect.

That may be factually incorrect, but in practice it is exactly what happens, as you can see by this thread, too. After all, the IHRA’s very first line after their definition of antisemitism says: “Manifestations might include the targeting of the state of Israel, conceived as a Jewish collectivity.” In effect, saying: if you criticise Israel, it could be seen as being antisemitic.
Which is plain silly. No nation is beyond reproach.

@peruse, thank you for posting

[quote NatriumChloride]@NotLettingItSlide
Firstly, the IHRA explicitly states that criticism levelled at Israel of the same standard that is levelled at any other nation cannot be regarded as antisemitic. Your claim that anyone who criticises Israel legitimately is accused of antisemitism is factually incorrect.

That may be factually incorrect, but in practice it is exactly what happens, as you can see by this thread, too. After all, the IHRA’s very first line after their definition of antisemitism says: “Manifestations might include the targeting of the state of Israel, conceived as a Jewish collectivity.” In effect, saying: if you criticise Israel, it could be seen as being antisemitic.
Which is plain silly. No nation is beyond reproach.[/quote]
Yes, and as I asked before, without getting an answer, who gets to define what is 'legitimate' critcism? What criteria are used? Do those criteria apply to all nations equally? Surely they must, given the fixation here with alleged 'double standards'. I can't say I've ever heard anyone talk of 'legitimate' criticism of, say, China or Iran. These nations are fair game, as they should be. But so should all nations. No exceptions.

That's what people here want, isn't it? No double standards or "singling out"?

@NatriumChloride - she is denying work to any company based in Israel, based on them being based in Israel. That is not just criticising the government. It's a bit odd that people can't spot the difference.

@MRex yes that's what boycotting looks like. Like when (some) sports teams refused to play in South Africa during the 1980s. That didn't happen because people thought South African athletes were directly responsible for apartheid.

The sporting boycott of Apartheid South Africa was because of the operation of Apartheid in sport.

Would Sally Rooney mind if her book were translated into Arabic in Gaza under Hamas?

Yes, that's correct. Boycotting is not the same as "no nation is beyond reproach", which is the specific comment I was referring to when I replied to a specific poster. Boycotting is not just criticism of a government, but is holding other private citizens accountable for government.
South Africa had apartheid in sport enforced by politicians.
Modan Publishing Ltd has published ~3000 books in 50 years, it's a small company.

@MRex

Yes, that's correct. Boycotting is not the same as "no nation is beyond reproach", which is the specific comment I was referring to when I replied to a specific poster. Boycotting is not just criticism of a government, but is holding other private citizens accountable for government. South Africa had apartheid in sport enforced by politicians. Modan Publishing Ltd has published ~3000 books in 50 years, it's a small company.

South Africa was also subject to academic and cultural boycotts for years. I'm sure many small publishers - though I'm not sure how the size of the company is relevant - lost business there too. That's how boycotts work.

And once again. A boycott is much more than "no nation beyond reproach". The specific comment that I had specifically replied to.

@MalagaNights

I've been a long time supporter of the Palestinians. Over 30 years as I have personal connections.

For years I have seen attempts to take any criticism of the Isreali Government and shut it down as anit semitism.

I thought the reported rise in anti semitism, and the Labour party in fighting, was probably just this, criticism of Isreal styled as anti semitism.

Then I started to pay closer attention to what is going on.

The focused hatred on Isreal and Jews is so disproportionate to other states you could criticise. Why?? the language used is diffrent. A diffrent standard is applied. Why?? Many people who won't speak up to criticise other states will do so loudly against Isreal. Why??

And the attacks on Jews in this country, the vile language and threats used, made me realise: anti seminitsm is on the rise again.

The fact people cannot see this desite the holocaust only happening 75 years ago is astounding.

Much more care needs to be taken to ensure this never happenes again.

Yes criticise the actions of Isreal. And I do.
But open your eyes to what is happening.

Sally Rooney is just the latest naive virue signaller to think this is the cause it's OK to join, without any reflection on why she suddenly now cares so much about this and not other things.

So many people sudeenly hate Isreal who were no where to be seen 20 years ago.
This is not an accident.

Something is happening.

Thank you so much for posting this. I think there is a very very worrying trend that is gaining pace at the moment. Conspiracy theories that deep down are anti-jewish. The founder of Momentum Jon Lansman is on record as stating that Labour has become very troubled by lots of members holding onto such theories. Demonisation of Kabbalah seems to be particularly widespread. Look up any theories about the Rothchilds. A three line whip amongst the woke to criticise Israel which as you say goes well beyond comparable criticism of much worse Governments.

It shouldn’t be forgotten that this is the Jews promised land that was taken off them through war and occupation. They’ve spent centuries being exiled, persecuted and subject to genocide. Some Jews did worry about the racist fall out that would occur
Through the creation of a Jewish state.

I’ve never heard of this author, but people really need to consider any situation which could be tied into the othering of Jews, to many criticism of Israel is criticism of Jews, it gives people a reason to start persecuting Jews. Life post Covid is going to throw the world into the same mentality as the 1920s and 30’s looking for scapegoats, it petrifies me that people have this almost unconscious demonisation of Jews it’s only a short walk from someone standing in front of a rally criticising a Jewish nation state to the gas chamber in the world that is surely coming as we hit worldwide recession and possibly depression. Just for once can we learn from history.

I would love to see as much coverage in the media about the low level anti-Jewish sentiments which run through society and have done through centuries as they currently have about BLM.

Sally Rooney is just the latest naive virue signaller to think this is the cause it's OK to join, without any reflection on why she suddenly now cares so much about this and not other things.

With respect, you have no idea why or how strongly SR personally feels about this issue. To dismiss anyone who has a problem with the Israeli government's behaviour is akin to saying it's invalid to have a problem with grave oppression and abuse of human rights. You don't further the point you're making by pretending you know the strength of her feeling or suggesting there isn't a place for outrage

South Africa was also subject to academic and cultural boycotts for years. I'm sure many small publishers - though I'm not sure how the size of the company is relevant - lost business there too. That's how boycotts work.

And lots of 'ground roots' boycotts, I wasn't allowed certain fruit growing up because it came from SA. You couldn't use Barclay's bank cheques in some shops because they did business in SA.

SA airlines could not fly over most of (possibly all) African airspace making their journeys longer and using more fuel.

Maggie Thatcher invited PW Botha to the UK, but hotel after hotel refused the bookings.

Weird thread. It would have taken you less than a minute to verify the story you'd heard, and then you seem to forget all about that and start criticising the books themselves. Do you work for a rival publishing house or something?

@HarlanPepper

Weird thread. It would have taken you less than a minute to verify the story you'd heard, and then you seem to forget all about that and start criticising the books themselves. Do you work for a rival publishing house or something?

yes there was a definite pivot in an attempt to avoid admitting she'd started a kneejerk thread that she'd spent 0.5 seconds looking into.

@Littleheart5 It made me really sad earlier to see some comments on a Jewish activist's Instagram page describing the rampant levels of antisemitism in Ireland. Shameful if this is the case.

As for Sally Rooney, she should be embarassed by her witless stance.

It made me really sad earlier to see some comments on a Jewish activist's Instagram page describing the rampant levels of antisemitism in Ireland. Shameful if this is the case.

It's not

hth

Speak for yourself @Queenie6655

describing the rampant levels of antisemitism in Ireland

IIRC that post described a small handful of examples from decades ago.

'Rampant' would be the most ridiculous exaggeration I've ever heard on here (and that's saying something)

My love for Sally Rooney’s work was a short affair. I am afraid that saying in interviews that she was Marxist did not make her any favours. I am not surprised by her position on Israel. Shame she seems to have some talent.