To think that nothing is going to change for women while girls are still targeted with this bullshit?

[WinterTrees]

In Sainsburys this morning. In the boys' clothes aisle I noticed tops with the words UNLIMITED and UNSTOPPABLE printed on them. Took a quick detour down the girls aisle to see what similarly empowering messages were being directed at them...

Oh the typos!

Sparkles and butterflies
Where is the Princess thing come from?

I watched a program about how Lego used to be neutral in the 70s and 80s. Then someone had the bright idea that they could make Lego for girls and it should all be pink. Lego friends range was born. I think the same probably happened for clothing. It’s a marketing opportunity. But doesnt help stereotyping.

They wouldn't sell it if people didn't buy it 🤷 The only way there'll be change is if consumers are more discerning in what they consume.

Personally I'm not a fan of words / slogans on clothes regardless.

@Sofiegiraffe

The label on those first two grey tops says "TU kids", not "TU Boys". If people feel strongly, why not stop assigning these gender labels themselves and just put the clothes on your kids that you feel are most suitable and appropriate?

Many of us do.

But it's still there - the stuff which is in the aisle which from the colours and styles kids above the age of about 3 have absorbed, whether we like it or not, is 'supposed' to be for girls. It's on the clothes of their girl friends but not their boy friends. It's the insidious drip-drip of stereotypes which should be outdated.

The sexualised clothes take it to a whole other level of course. Is just not buying them for your own kids really good enough?

Agreed .... there are too many parents that actively want this kind of gendered clothing. Maybe because they know no different; maybe because they actively encourage this stereotyping still.

When I had young DC I never bought clothes with slogans on - because I would never presume that that slogan reflected the child's viewpoint. But others just see it as cute or whatever.

But friends just happily bought into all this stuff and absolutely would not put their girls in anything but pretty tops and dresses in pink or 'lilac' and their boys in rufty tufty navy, khaki, grey etc.

Our DD4 currently loves everything with Batman and Spiderman on. Predicably, any clothes of that type in Tesco are labelled as "boys' clothes, not only through their location in the boys aisle, but with a big label on saying BOYS.

DD, having asked what the label.says, was a bit bewildered. I decided to send an email to customer service. I kept it light and not entirely serious, pointing out that there had been a regrettable mistake when labeling this t-shirt. A friendly customer service women called, wasn't entirely sure why I was complaining but promised to feed it back to head office. No apparent effect yet, but I may keep doing it.

We were kids in the 70s. My sister loved action man, robots, mecano... so our parents bough it for her. No drama, no biology denial, no fuss...

There is a campaign group- Let Clothes be Clothes. On Facebook. Campaigns on exactly what you have highlighted OP.

It's the short shorts for girls (and no pockets) that REALLY pisses me off. I refuse to buy them. We just buy from the boys range. Luckily DD likes camo.

The Clothes buyers -ie the companies that comission and sell the clothes- are at fault here. They just do not care and they should.

If you are that bothered (and fwiw i hate pink and sparkly) then campaign. Or don't, but the system will only change when people stop buying jt.

And isn't it likely that the boys' AND girls' clothes are made in sweatshops by workers (including children) are horrifically exploited? Perhaps try to tackle that first.

but the system will only change when people stop buying jt.
That's the actual issue, some people don't buy it just because there's no alternative; they actively seek it out.

And while there's a market for it, they'll keep selling it 🤷🏻‍♀️

And isn't it likely that the boys' AND girls' clothes are made in sweatshops by workers (including children) are horrifically exploited?

That's a good point - but in the context of this thread it's whataboutery. 'Perhaps try to tackle that first.' - people can think about more than one thing at once, and it's fine to deal with things nearer home that you can have an effect on even if they're not the most important issue.

As to campaigning - I'm not sure about the history of Let Clothes be Clothes, I would guess it's related to Let Toys be Toys. That started as a direct consequence of a Mumsnet thread a few years ago. So actually I'd say this sort of thread is a form of campaigning. Makes more people aware of the issues, and that there are means of countering them.

I guess this is one area where all the trans stuff might actually help...more round the cut of clothes though. The next step will be clothes cut to reflect different body shapes from puberty.

I buy most of my clothes from the mens section although small tends to still be big unless they do a xs size. I use Cotton Traders as well as they do unisex. I don't like clingy clothes, jumpers that stop at my ribs, and necklines that are over my shoulders.

I bought from Adams when my kids were little as they did plain coloured clothes ..I hated slogans back then...as a kid I lived in t shirts, sweatshirts, jeans and track suits..jumpers were hand knitted by my mother. My favourite was blue with red and white hoops on the arms.

Op I agree with you, the shit slogans are awful.
No wonder the boys clothes sections are a quarter of the size of girls for choice as the girls are full of this shit.
I have a son who loves bright colours, all the boys stuff is blue, grey or black. It is so depressing. He used to have some red hoodies, which were hard to find but the older he gets, the less choice there is

Yet girls, and women, have endless choice of unicorn, rainbow, pink shit.
Not that my boy wants to wear rainbows but where are the colours for the boys????
Their choice is boring and dull.

MrsTerryPratchett

It’s self fulfilling though. DD loved dinosaurs and space but as soon as she could read ‘boys’ she said, ‘I don’t want to wear boy’s clothes’. Why couldn’t the girl’s section have space and dinosaurs? And bigger bloody shorts.

I agree, I had the same thing happen with my eldest DS.

I have a son who loves bright colours, all the boys stuff is blue, grey or black.

H & M used to be good for colour - and 100% cotton - though I agree both got harder to find older he got then he hit his teens and now all he wants is blue, grey or black coloured clothes.

We did do fruit of the loom and patches for a while as well - now he quite likes the qwertee. slogan/design ones but they are still printed on dark materials.

The girls themselves are sick of this shit now. The retailers will feel it in their pockets

Oh and it's the short shorts that annoy me the most even an extra inch or two would help

If people didn't buy them, they wouldn't keep producing them, but yes it is sad that there is a still a market out there for this shit.

If people didn't buy them, they wouldn't keep producing them.
There isn't a lot of choice available and many people are limited to supermarket clothing, what is the alternative? Naked DC? Charity shops have a very limited number of DC clothes, they usually overcharge on many items using ebay as a guide.
You'll be hard pushed to find a good selection of plain clothes, the plain multi top buy usually has 2 plains 3 flowery.
They're marketing at people on a budget taking away choice.
I've bought DD boys longer shorts and tops for years.

I just don't accept that it's ok to blame the customers. These massive companies have a responsibility. Their influence in society is HUGE and they have to be held to high standards about how they use that.

It's like having sweets at the checkouts. Presumably that was an easy cash generator for supermarkets and loads of people (parents especially) succumbed to the pressure and temptation to buy them just because they were there. Supermarkets didn't remove them because customers stopped buying them, they removed them because of pressure from Public Health England who did studies into the harm caused by obesity and poor nutrition, in which impulse purchases of sweets played a small but significant part.

Wouldn't it be nice to see the same interest and the same commitment to change applied to the harm caused to women and girls by misogyny and sexist stereotypes?

YANBU, it’s just so rubbish. Also what is it with the leopard print clothing and shoes in Sainsburys and H&M for girls - just hideous, but presumably it sells as I've seen plenty of girls wearing it.

I never buy slogan clothing for DS(6), and get equally fed up with the sludge colours for boys.

Even for women the cutsie-pie slogan or Disney pajamas and t-shirts in places like Sainsburys are nauseating and shite. How many men’s Pj’s and t-shirts feature Disney characters and cutsie-pie slogans? None!

They're marketing at people on a budget taking away choice.

I've bought DD boys longer shorts and tops for years.

But lots of us have deliberately bought from the boys section. That is a valid choice, but not everyone does it because some people actually do seek out the pink, sloganed shite.
Not everybody hates it, and whether we like it or not that's what's keeping it on the shelves.

YANBU

I think it seems to be the High St retailers who are producing this crap as it will be easy and cheap to produce, and has a ready consumer market. The specialist children’s retailers like Scandi brands etc know they can corner the market with well-made styles and a wide range of colours, and their target market won’t want their clothes to mimic the cheaper High St clothes with tacky and/or inappropriate slogans.

Buyers have tight budgets to follow regardless of the industry, and they have to analyse what sells year on year. The clothing Buyers for supermarket & High Street retailers are no different and will produce whatever sells to the mass market.

I used to work in the toy industry and the absolute shit and/or poor value toys that was produced because kids go mad for it was astounding. However, adults love to indulge children and crap sells.

And isn't it likely that the boys' AND girls' clothes are made in sweatshops by workers (including children) are horrifically exploited? Perhaps try to tackle that first.

I agree with Errol - this is a separate issue entirely, and a distraction from the point of this thread, which is how marketing messages channel children into regressive sexist stereotypes from an incredibly young age. But, my point above goes for how the clothes are produced too. Sainsbury's are a multi-billion pound business (28.6 billion pounds turnover from January 20 to Jan 21 apparently) They have an incredible amount of power and all the responsibility that goes with it. As a customer I expect to be able to assume that they abide by best practice codes of conduct, as they claim to. If they were found to be in breach of any of those codes, such as employing and 'horrifically exploiting' children, I would hope the impact on their business - both in financial and reputational terms - would be severe.

tuclothing.sainsburys.co.uk/features/sustainability/production

I want them to source clothing ethically and sustainably, in line with industry codes of practice and manage to avoid plastering those clothes with sexist messaging. It's not rocket science.