Universal Credit - ‘Not gainfully self-employed’

[Greyrootszerohoots]

After a covid redundancy I went self employed. We received UC (thank god!) as DH unable to work. I’ve since gone self employed and don’t often receive UC, though occasionally get a little when my income drops.

I had to go to the job centre to prove I was ‘gainfully self employed’, ie not working an hour a week making cakes while not looking for work.

They are perfectly happy with everything, but officially I’m classed as ‘not gainfully self employed’ as I have a child under three.

In reality this means there’s no minimum hours and therefore no minimum income I’m expected to make, which is great - I appreciate new mothers have that.

My AIBU is the wording. I’ve worked so hard and do 60+ hours a week to support my family. I feel the terminology undermines women in business and our hard work. Couldn’t the just say exempt?

I know it’s not a big thing, but why do I feel irked? Why do we systematically minimise working mothers’ contributions?

In this context “gainfully” is meant in the financial sense i.e. to increase weath/funds.

Just take it literally to avoid offended. Obviously you caring for the child/the house is saving money rather than paying someone to do it, but take it literally.

I hated being self employed on universal credit. Sometimes we earn too much (when invoices were paid) and sometimes too little (work done pre invoice). Maddening as if it was averaged out we would have received an equal amount per month. There is no evening up at the end of the year. Also hated the gainfully employed thing.

So glad I’m still on tax credits as my income is so variable that I would be all over the place with UC. It’s a shitty system and not fit for purpose.

I feel like this system is so open to abuse the other way too - you could earn £10k in one month, £0 the next and still receive tax credits for the £0 month!

@HummingBeeBox

I hated being self employed on universal credit. Sometimes we earn too much (when invoices were paid) and sometimes too little (work done pre invoice). Maddening as if it was averaged out we would have received an equal amount per month. There is no evening up at the end of the year. Also hated the gainfully employed thing.

It is possible to manage this to a certain extent by spreading out invoicing and delaying banking income, although I realise the latter is hard to do if people pay online.

@lurker101 that’s a good point, I was probably so irritated by the whole experience I didn’t see it that way!

@LakieLady I did think that but couldn't work out how as they were dated invoices to customers (handyman) and small online payments for handmade goods (PayPal). I was so afraid of being audited

@Greyrootszerohoots

I feel like this system is so open to abuse the other way too - you could earn £10k in one month, £0 the next and still receive tax credits for the £0 month!

You can't. There's a "surplus earnings" rule that says if your income is more than a certain amount* above your UC allowances, the remainder is rolled forward and treated as income in subsequent months.

And there's also a "minimum income floor", which means that they can treat you as earning more than you've reported as income if your earnings are below that level.

*I think it's £2.5k, but I'd need to look it up to be sure

[quote HummingBeeBox]@LakieLady I did think that but couldn't work out how as they were dated invoices to customers (handyman) and small online payments for handmade goods (PayPal). I was so afraid of being audited [/quote]
When you have a particularly busy month, you can delaying invoicing some customers so that when they pay, their money comes in the next assessment period.

With those that pay by cheque (if anyone still does !) or in cash, just don't bank it or report it until after the end date of the assessment period, then it will fall into the next one.

You can even out the income a bit by doing that.

It would apply to a father looking after a child equally to a mother.
Increasingly more families since covid where a mother is in employment and the father is self-employed.

Sorry, had an afterthought, @HummingBeeBox.

You could also manage peaks in income by buying tools, materials etc in assessment periods when income is high. That would offset some of the income, so net income for UC purposes would be lower.

Minimum income floor is minimum wage for your age multiplied by the number of hours you are expected to work.

I know it’s not a big thing, but why do I feel irked?
Because you're taking something personal that isn't at all? It's a term used that applies in many circumstances. It doesn't to you, so what! The outcome is in your favour, that's all that matter.

No need for turning everything into an outrage!

@Greyrootszerohoots

I feel like this system is so open to abuse the other way too - you could earn £10k in one month, £0 the next and still receive tax credits for the £0 month!

No you couldn't because that £10 would likely push you into the allowed savings threshold wouldn't it?

That term is applied across the board to anyone who meets the criteria for not being gainfully self-employed. It would apply to anyone looking after a child under 3 plus numerous other scenarios. It is not targeted at women at all. It's not one definition for women and one for men.

YABU. It’s just a word.

YANBU the UC system can’t cope with the self employed.

Just be grateful that title for now takes pressure off your income and hours. I’m Disabled and can’t work I’m considered to be “economic inactive” it’s just system it’s not designed to up your ego in fact if you don’t feel mildly depressed about it the whole time they are doing something wrong