Need help suspect son is in wrong school

[Fateofthecookies]

Hi there, first time posting here so sorry for any mistakes & will try to include as much as possible in this post.

My DS (12) has an EHCP & has recently moved up. He is not diagnosed with anything except developmental delay. He needs a bit of help reading/writing though he can do both it just takes him a while. he’s a bit forgetful & has anxiety. He’s never had any difficulties behaviour wise & as always been described as eager to learn, well behaved & polite & teachers have always been pleased with his maths (one called him a maths wizard - this is relevant )

There were NO schools in our area that would take him so he’s travelling out of town to a sen school. We’ve only been for a look around once & this was after we started. The main thing I noticed was most children seem to be intellectually or behaviourally challenged. DS is not though his brother is & is in a school exactly like this which is why I could see the difference. DS has struggled to make friends because of this.

Today he has come home & said the teacher asked him what’s 100 - 35 & ds has answered 65. The teacher said ‘no, but close’ he then had to guess again even though he knew that was the answer so he said 75 & then 85 & was told no but she never told him the answer.
Yesterday he told me that *Archie had hit him around the head with a pencil case & punched him in the side. Told him to stop messing around -DS was reading a paper. He then called him a ‘little bastard’ & a ‘shithead’ & was told by this child that he was going to slit his throat. He said the other kids around him sat there laughing & one of the TA’s (there’s 3 in his class & only small class) looked at him & said nothing. The teacher didn’t even look up. He doesn’t lie, I believe him.
& then last week he told me that someone sat next to him suddenly (no reason or warning) took his work & screwed it up. At first the teacher saw & didn’t do anything then as he was about to screw it into a ball he just calmly said ‘no *freddy no’ ds said he kept doing it but eventually he stopped. I then got a message after school from the teacher telling me that another boy had taken ds work & screwed it up but that she was proud of ds for not reacting (fair enough). One of the first things DS told me was how one child had sworn at the headteacher & the headteacher said nothing, ds was shocked by this as he used to bring in mainstream school & still plays out after with his friends. If I didn’t tell you what I’ve written here you wouldn’t know he has problems ifswim.

Sorry this is so long, last bit…
Has I said his last school was a mainstream school & it came as a shock when we were told that the school we’d chosen couldn’t take him because they couldn’t take someone at ‘primary level’ we’d never been told/led to believe at any time he’d be going to a specialist school. I feel there is something wrong with his EHCP or whatever paperwork they passed on for him to be here & for no one in our own town to be able to provide provision for him. But alarm bells started ringing today when the teacher told him the answer was wrong, why would she lie? Do they get money for him? They told us they would help us & if he was in the wrong school they’d know. But all he is doing is painting everyday, he says the work is too easy & I know he’s capable of so much more. He now feels the teachers are singling him out & when they asked a question in class today 3 children held there hands up -DS & 2 others & the other 2 children gave there answers & DS was ignored.

Sorry for long thread but don’t know how to sort this out, just feel let down & like I’ve let ds down

One it is a lot harder to get a place in a special school and costs more per child than mainstream. But you are well within your rights to find a mainstream school that can support him and if that's what you feel is right for him if get looking asap.

I’m not sure wether or not a mainstream school would be suitable for him. But I don’t feel like this school is full filling his needs. The day we went to see him he looked like fish out of water iyswim but it’s mainly the fact they are now lying, telling him answers are wrong & ignoring him when he puts his hand up. Also all he’s doing is painting when he can read & write just sometimes needs a bit of help.

Maybe they misheard his original answer rather than lying. A special school is not going to be children sat at desks learning, that's mainstream. I'm sure he's not just painting, you've already said he's been doing maths. And he can't be chosen to answer the questions all the time, there'll be other children there who need boosting to answer questions.

Ask to meet with the school
Should have termly I e p meeting anyway
Maybe there are issues which can be ironed out it s only few weeks in

The maths answer was written, & it wasn’t questions they were asked, they where asked to read a sentence from a book, there were only 3 to put there hands up & the other 2 got it but not DS. He says they usually only count up to 20 but he can count a lot higher.

You need to talk to the school .

Go with attitude of how can this be resolved?
What are the options?
Don't go all angry
Arrange meeting
Listen to them and make your suggestions

I also just want to pint out that we have to DS’s. DS2 has developmental delay & learning difficulties & also goes to a specialist school. He was born early, starved of oxygen & we is doing incredibly well to say we nearly lost him. This school would be well suited to DS2 but DS1 is capable of so much more.

Thankyou, we are making a diary of things & just taking them one step at a time. We would never go in angry - it solves nothing. It’s just myself & dp feel a little lost at the moment not sure where to turn to get it solved & as I said feel like we’re letting DS down. It worries me for both DS’s for there futures. (We also have a dd - she’s doing absolutely fine).

We are planning to arrange a meeting with school but can’t do until probably the end of next week, in the meantime we’re just keeping a diary & trying to encourage DS. Thankyou everyone who as replied.

As he's already in an SEN school he is already costing the LEA £££ which means you will have an easier time if you identify a better option for him, compared to the fight you would have if he was currently in a mainstream school.

Look at the private schools near you. Is there one which isn't massively academically selective and which is noted for being nurturing for SEN but also stretching for those with the ability to thrive in some subjects. If you can share your approximate location MNers may be able to help.

The EHCP is the key here. It currently states things that mainstream state schools can't provide. Is it correct? The SEN school may be providing some of what the mainstream schools can't, but they are simultaneously failing to provide an adequate education so the EHCP needs to be edited to reflect his need for intellectual challenge and learning in the subjects he thrives with (ie maths).

My friend's son who is very bright and has autism had a very well worded EHCP after starting a mainstream secondary school in y7 and finding it utterly overwhelming and he was out of school for a while. But the EHCP made it obvious that the only school that could adequately meet his needs was a small and nuturing local private school that isn't specifically SEN but is SEN friendly. The LEA paid his fees and he has just finished y11 with a stack of very respectable GCSE grades. But getting to that point was a huge fight as the LEA did everything they could to avoid the expense. In your case it should be easier, if the right school exists, because it could even be a saving for them!

Doesn't sound like this is the right school for him. Ask to speak to the Head and question whether they can provide the right level if education and challenge for him. Ask him what his understanding (or the ds's teacher's understanding of his ability/diagnosis is?
Where I am, you can insist on mainstream. From what you've said he would be vastly better off in a mainstream with good SEN provision. It's a case of finding it in your area. Phone local schools and ask if necessary?
(I'm an ex high school teacher, ex-SEN teacher in a behavioural unit, now a primary teacher)

Sorry have used "him" above but obviously either Head or teacher could be female too!

@Fateofthecookies

Thankyou, we are making a diary of things & just taking them one step at a time. We would never go in angry - it solves nothing. It’s just myself & dp feel a little lost at the moment not sure where to turn to get it solved & as I said feel like we’re letting DS down. It worries me for both DS’s for there futures. (We also have a dd - she’s doing absolutely fine).

You have plenty of time A term at the wrong school won't ruin his life If he only does painting for a term while you look elsewhere it s ok He can read and do math eg bitesize at home You need time to talk to current school and to Look at other options

I think there must be many children like your son, the one of your two whom you are worried about, in mainstream. If he can do mathematics such as you describe, I don't think he would meet the criteria for learning disabilities: learning difficulties, perhaps. Many large state secondary schools have special provision, taking the form of a centre for those with speech and language difficulties, and another for autism , etc, etc.

Yes, I think SEN schools are usually for those complex needs, autism and challenging behaviour and more marked learning difficulties.

He sounds quite socially able too, aware of the injustice of being told his answer was wrong when it wasn't.

I would go back to LA and explain and earmark a school you like.

Is he quite quiet, OP? I think sometimes quieter children really can be underestimated. Also mainstream schooling is heavily reliant on reading and writing, so if you struggle a little with that, your strengths in other areas can be overshadowed.

What does your DS like to do at home? Is there anything he does - lego construction etc - that you could show the teachers to help them see that he's functioning at a higher level?

You were misled about your rights in terms of a mainstream school placement. If a parent prefers mainstream, by law their wishes must be met unless taking the child is incompatible with the efficient education of other pupils and there are no reasonable steps that can be taken to overcome the incompatibility. If your child was in mainstream primary school without difficulty, I don't see how a secondary can conceivably claim that admitting him will be incompatible with efficient education.

You need to get advice, ideally from an independent educational psychologist with experience of tribunal appeals , as to what form of education is most suitable for your child, and then make your decision based on that. You can ask for an early annual review to discuss this, and if the council doesn't agree you will have a right of appeal.

I teach in a secondary and have a bottom set year 7. I have one boy with a reading age of year old and another who cannot write. While this is not ideal as it is hard to give them the support they need it is an indicator of the kid of ability of children we get in mainstream.

Sorry that was terribly written ,
Should say reading age of 6
And the kind of ability

I would do as your doing and have a meeting with the school.
If his EHCP isn’t a proper reflection of his abilities then ask for a reassessment so your Das has be reassessed and the whole thing rewritten. You could also commission private reports such as Ed Psych as they will be more in-depth than LA reports. Also start looking at independent schools both specialist and mainstream as you might find a better for for your DS.

@Smileyaxolotl1

Sorry that was terribly written , Should say reading age of 6 And the kind of ability

And what happens to that child in their other subjects? How do they access the curriculum? In my (albeit fairly limited ) experience, children who cant read and write at least at upper primary level pretty much drown in secondary school.

Bottom set children do not 'drown' in secondary. That is your elitism speaking.

I've taught 1000s of children, always in mainstream secondary, who often start with big problems with place value 2+3 =23, 4 + 9 = 103.

Really, this site! People have no idea. What do you think people mean when they say they hate maths? There are lots and lots of jobs that do not need GCSE English and Maths. I would almost go so far as to say more than 50% of all employment in UK. I'd list them but people are easily offended.

4 is the pass rate at GCSE. 56% get that annually and its a big deal to them. It hurts me that the MC scoff about this, with their lists of 9s.
The other 44% get 3s, 2s and 1s which are valued grades to 100000s of people.
There are plenty of courses sub GCSE level - entry level.

Secondary schools cater for everyone.

@Embroidery how does a child who cannot read access the vast majority of the curriculum? Our local seondaries dont set except in maths so they arent "bottom set" children they are illiterate children put in with everyone else and expected to cope. The ones Ive known didnt.

Why wouldn't the schools take DS? Unless it is wholly independent the LA must name your preferred school unless they can prove one of the following:

• The setting is unsuitable for the age, ability, aptitude or special educational needs (“SEN”) of the child or young person; or
• The attendance of the child or young person would be incompatible with the provision of efficient education for others; or
• The attendance of the child or young person would be incompatible with the efficient use of resources.

The bar is relatively high. The LA can, and must, name the school regardless of the school's objections unless they can prove one of the above.

Parents have a right to a mainstream education if they want that. The LA can only refuse if it would be incompatible with the efficient education of others, and their are no reasonable steps that could overcome that. However, the right is to a mainstream education, not a particular school.

If you want a SS did you look at others, including independents?

What support is specified and quantified in section F? That must be provided.

Hi guys I just want to say a massive thank you for all the replies. I genuinely came on here half expecting to be flamed & people thinking I was being precious or fussy but I genuinely can’t thank you enough for all the information you’ve given me, I feel like I now know which direction to take. I will update & reply & offer more info when I can as I’ve just got DC’s to bed, DS2 took a while to settle off as he usually has melatonin but has not had it for the past few days (another story in itself but I feel tonight may be a long night). I do strongly feel that his EHCP was not updated correctly!.