Nhs wasting moneyv

[passionflower50]

My husband has farrowwrap leg stocking and wrap for ulcers on his legs .he has large size so last lot came and they sent small .dont fit and can't be sent back so district nurse ordered some more in correct size .they have sent one lot large 2 lots small as in there wisdom they thought they would try small even though they know they don't fit these wraps cost 148 pounds a time what a waste of money .

Yeah couldn't stomach working as a band 3 in the NHS, running round doing the legwork in a minor allied health department. There were more band 7s than us, sitting in their offices doing 'research' that achieved the square root of fuck all, paid £42k plus.

A lot of what you term inefficiency is due to lack of funding or rules from government that are imposed on the NHS. But carry on bashing the people who are working their arses off to try and give you good care.

@RainingYetAgain

Honestly that makes me cross. 15 years or more ago lots of PCTs set up schemes where DN held a stock of tissue viability items, which they used to start treatment, find the correct product and then got the GP to prescribe or prescribed themselves. I suppose that went, when PCTs and prescribing advisors were scrapped. That's progress for you. Still, I got early retirement out of it

It still happens exactly the same.

Medication can’t legally be used for anyone else once it’s left the medical facility because it can’t be guaranteed it’s been stored correctly never mind intentionally tampered with.

The NHS pays far below RRP for so many things because of the buying power. What is it that people think they are being fleeced on?

It’s unclear from the post exactly what has happened. Did these dressings come from a pharmacy? If they stated size large the pharmacy can’t supply small and get paid for it.

3* clinics

30 would have given me full heart failure

@BoredZelda

yeah so delivery is next week and you can dispose of them then

Presumably you just refused the delivery?

Well as she was dead her sheltered accommodation was reallocated the warden was warned and she was going to refuse the delivery they left them outside of the complex last I heard someone else was using them in the complex it seemed like the best solution

Our trust does offer all unused products to third world countries, we issue a charities number to the patients and the charity comes and picks them up from your house. However I believe the charity did pause this during COVID but may be back up and running now. Have you asked the DNs if they have links like this?
Or a pharmacy may have a link?

Please don’t offer them up on Facebook etc as someone advised, as they are prescribed once someone’s Doppler has been done and could be detrimental to someone who doesn’t have the correct ABPI.

Given the amount of money being plowed into the nhs I do think they should be subject to regular audits and accountable for their actions.

@Pixxie7

Given the amount of money being plowed into the nhs I do think they should be subject to regular audits and accountable for their actions.

Er the NHS is subject to regular audits

Yes the NHS needs more money, but the management of current money they have is atrocious and inefficient

By whose measure? Your own narrow experience of the NHS? Millions of people pass through its doors.

By everybody's. I can give example after example after example, and I'm just one person. So many other posters are saying the same.

But carry on bashing the people who are working their arses off to try and give you good care.

Overwhelmingly, people aren't doing that. People are saying there are such systematic failures, simply 'giving more money' is like pouring water into a container with a hole in it.

So, a couple of examples:

1. Our local hospital - massive place, major trauma centre, some highly regarded departments doing tremendous groundbreaking work as well as giving superb care was built in the last 12 years. Remember - a NEW BUILD - However, it seemed it didn't occur to them to zone the heating system, so the out patients department - which you arrive at in your Winter clothes / outdoor clothes - is absolutely sweltering as apparently they have to keep it at a temperature to suit a patient lying still in their nightclothes. Staff have to open windows to let out the heat, and patients faint as it is so hot. Think of the £££ being wasted on heating (even before the discomfort of all the staff and also patients). They also built so many departments without any input from anyone who was going to work in them, so all the really, really obvious things (for clinicians) were wrong and unworkable, and had to be rebuilt.
2. Then the whole ridiculous system for making follow up appointments...... Patient, in hospital told they need to come back in 3 weeks. Goes to desk, with diary, to make appt. Told they can't do that - they will send one. So NHS then have to post a letter (printing, person's time, stationery, and postage), offering an appointment that the patient can't make. Patient then calls the number. Tells them they can't make that appt (with diary ready), but no, whole farce repeated on a loop.
3. Patient injured in sports fixture and taken to the local hospital (was an away fixture so not local to patient's home). Asked if possible for follow up appt to be at local hospital (same Trust) - was told the only way that could be done would be if she went and presented herself at A&E AGAIN, at the other hospital

I also have several examples similar to those above, about not being able to stop the NHS machine delivering supplies that are not needed, or to only supply them in the quantities needed.

Oh, and why do the NHS insist on their admin staff (not even seen by the public) wearing uniforms - again, paid for by the NHS ???

Just So much waste.

NHS is underfunded when you look at per capita hospital beds, doctors, nurses, etc compared to EU countries. It’s easy to be efficient when different trusts don’t have to fight for a piece of too small pie.

People are saying there are such systematic failures, simply 'giving more money' is like pouring water into a container with a hole in it.

But it’s not at all like that. Such an analogy is too simplistic. It’s more like a leaky old ship. Spending a bit more money means you can fix the hole and improve the entire ship, not spending more money means more holes will appear and the ship will eventually sink. There is no option to not spend more money AND fix the hole because you can’t magic away holes.

Remember - a NEW BUILD - However, it seemed it didn't occur to them to zone the heating

Or maybe it did occur to them but they could not afford to zone the heating due to lack of adequate construction funds? After all zoned heating is much more expensive than no zoned heating. But if you need a new hospital, and only have 90% of funds you need to do it properly what are you going to cut back on? The ICU or fancy zoned heating?

@BoredZelda

should surely be possible to prescribe smaller quantities?

“That’s the size it comes in” is what we were told when we complained to a pharmacist. As a baby my daughter was on a daily iron supplement for her first 6 months. 1ml per day. We were given a 500ml bottle that had to be discarded 30 days after opening. Every month we threw away 470ml of this stuff. The supplier only does 500ml bottles, they are about 20 quid per bottle. So we threw away about 18 quids worth of this stuff every month. In 6 months, that’s over 100. There are 6000 premature babies born every year in Scotland and all of them are given this supplement for 6 months. That’s £36,000 of waste in this one medication alone.

I was part of a clinical network that dealt with the transfer of babies between each unit. Before a baby was transferred, they would be prepped with tubes and wires. The transfer ambulance would turn up and the baby would be re-prepped because the tubes and wires had different connectors. They would arrive at the new unit and have to be retubed and wired because the connectors didn’t fit. They looked in to the possibility of using the same supply chain across different health boards for uniformity but the NHS rules actually forbade that because experience showed when one supplier had multiple contracts, they weren’t competitive. Allowing units to source their own equipment allowed for better competition. In the end they had to apply for a waiver of that rule, not because they were concerned about cost but because of trauma to these tiny babies having to be intubated multiple times. It did work out cheaper when you factored in the wastage, but I expect ten years on, they are being gouged on price for these things by the company they chose.

Not sure where the £20 came from but iron is more like £6. If the pharmacy had a part opened bottle what would you expect them to do with it? They more than likely wouldn’t use it, and it’s still 30 day expiry so if they did the next patient would get a short dated bottle. If people are given less than 28 days and have to keep going back for supplies they’re generally not very happy. It also adds to the cost In addition if you’re given the bottle it’s 30 days from when you open it. If it’s packed down it’s 30 days from when the pharmacy opened it. Many people don’t collect their repeat prescription on the same day, most people put in for a repeat before they actually need it. So by the time you collect it has less than a 30 day expiry. You then have to put in for the next supply earlier and the same thing happens so the NHS Is needlessly paying a dispensing fee and GP time to issue it more often than every 28 days. The thick glass bottles that it would need to be decanted into are also expensive (not to mention wasteful). So perhaps sometimes things seem wasteful from the outside when they are actually the cheapest and best option.

Medicine waste is actually disgusting, I work in pharmacy and you wouldn’t believe how much waste we deal with weekly. I once disposed of 42k worth of HIV drugs after a patient changed their medications. £42,000 in the bin, that’s more than I paid for my first house!
We use a specialist disposal company and we get 6 22L bins every month and they are always full.

In our pharmacy if a patient tells us they have too much of something at home we just knock it off their script and don’t deliver it and we still end up with loads of waste and returns and it all ends up in the bin.

BungleandGeorge I presume the PP is referring to Sytron syrup, it’s £14.95 a bottle.

@Yubaba

BungleandGeorge I presume the PP is referring to Sytron syrup, it’s £14.95 a bottle.

Sytron has a 3 month expiry

Not sure where the £20 came from but iron is more like £6. If the pharmacy had a part opened bottle what would you expect them to do with it? They more than likely wouldn’t use it, and it’s still 30 day expiry so if they did the next patient would get a short dated bottle. If people are given less than 28 days and have to keep going back for supplies they’re generally not very happy

Paediatric iron Sytron, it is not £6, it is (or was in 2009) £20 per bottle. The staff in NNICU referred to it as liquid gold because of the cost.

I understand why the pharmacy can’t decant, I’m not an idiot. But why won’t the manufacturer produce smaller bottles? They manage it for other medications, why not that one? Could it be because they are profiteering? Any other customer in any other industry would be making sure the supply chain was meeting their needs. Can you imagine if Calpol only came in 500ml bottles? People having to pay those costs would soon make their feeling known, but when it comes to the NHS you can just set your price, set your terms and nobody challenges that.

Sytron has a 3 month expiry

If it does now, it didn’t in 2009. It was right there printed on the bottle.

We have just spent a couple of weeks with a patient in intensive care (about 15 beds in total I believe). The bins in each bay had broken lids (apparently a common problem) and banged shut instead of a slow close. Every time a shift changed (2 to 3 times a day) the nurse would fold up a new continence pad up to prop under the bin lid to stop it banging! Every bay 2/3 times a day, 15 bays. How much is that costing?