To not put the house back to what it was?

[QuantumDog2]

I've rented the house I live in currently for nearly 9 years. When I moved in it was a new build and we were the first to live here, so obviously a buy to let. The walls were all trade paint magnolia and the carpets were cheap, exactly the way new builds are presented as standard.
Over the years I've decorated it and made some improvements like extending the patio and I spend £1400 on new flooring for the lounge because the carpet was worn out by that stage and looked grotty.
Now I'm leaving as I've bought somewhere with my partner, but contractually apparently I have to return the property the way I found it. I'm 6 months pregnant now and don't fancy donning my overalls and climbing ladders to paint. What would you do? I feel like after 9 years here and the time and money I've spent on the place (although my choice totally) I shouldn't really be penalised, but I expect I will lose my deposit?

@billy1966

So he rented it with a watery undercoat?

He's now including your improvements in his pitch for reselling?

I think he is a CF.

Definitely take lots of pictures and I would be looking to see if you can reuse that flooring in your new home and similarly with the patio.

That colour in your hall is lovely too.

Thank you! I'm feeling a bit like the LL is a CF too.

@m00rfarm

I am a landlord. I would probably ask you to pay to get the kids bedrooms repainted UNLESS one of the viewers has requested they remain the same colour. But I would probably only ask you to pay 50% towards the cost. Have you sent pictures of everything to the landlord? If my tenants asked to repaint the house, I would ALWAYS ask that they return the house to the original colour. However, it I LIKED what the tenant had done, then I would ask it remains the same.

Communication is key.

But surely only if you'd freshly decorated, not after 9 years?

If I were your LL (and I'm not a LL!) I'd think the improvements you made at your expense e.g flooring, patio could be offset against any painting required. I suppose the problem is ongoing if they want it to be neutral for the next tenant - at what point does it get returned to magnolia? If the next tenant likes your colour choices do they then have to paint it cream before they leave?

BTW whenever I've used professional decorators they use quality paints not watery stuff so I don't equate 'trade paint' with naff. If you get someone in to do it expect to pay min £150 a day and it may take a few days/coats covering darker colours.

@leakymcleakleak

OP if it was unpainted do you have any pictures of that? And when were you given permission to repaint, with the agreement you would return it?

I think pictures and copies of messages will be key here. If I were you, I'd gather everything you have historically, then see how the check out goes. (But first make sure you take time stamped photos of the whole place the day you move out in lots of detail, especially any changes you made)

If they send you a message charging you for repainting, I'd reply detailing the reasons you don't think you should - not that you're pregnant and can't be bothered!

But - all changes were improvements

• when you first moved in, the house wasn't painted but only had undercoat (it would be great if you had an exchange to show they agreed this at the time)
• when you agreed to repaint it was X years ago, but maintenance has not been done on the property since then when you would have expected it to have been repainted in that time frame

Also, my memory is they can't just get an arbitrary sum, they need to provide receipts of work they've done.

We rented a house that was in terrible shape: landlord had been letting to students and wanted to switch to professionals without making any improvements. We were ok with it as it was cheap and short-term, got them to remove a load of broken down furniture they'd left there. Took extensive photos moving in (when it was so disgusting I had to hire a cleaning team of three because I could not face it). When we moved out I literally mopped us out of there, however it was a rainy muddy day and there were some footprints in the porch from where we collected the last suitcase which there was literally nothing we could do about.

They tried to suggest they were keeping 300 quid off the deposit for cleaning. I sent a calm (seething) email showing them my before and after photos, outlining in slightly official language why I thought they were full of it, and saying I was very happy to take it to the deposit scheme. They put all the money back in my account in a week. (Well, they notified the deposit scheme to release it). The main thing you need is evidence, if you'd been there longer I'd think differently, but honestly, its your HOME. You aren't borrowing a house. That's not legally how its viewed at all. You've paid above and beyond a mortgage interest repayment for more than just use of the house: landlords are required to do safety checks and a basic level of maintenance. They clearly didn't do the maintenance.

You may be unlucky, and it is possible they may try and get more money than the deposit out of you, but if you're buying Iwoudln't be so concerned about a reference and I think in reality they're not going to spend any money repainting, or at least not above what they should have spent over 9 years, even if it is twice as hard/expensive to paint over darker paints they should have painted twice in 9 years, particularly considering it wasn't properly painted in the first place.

I'd chance my arm OP, but I'd get all my documents ready.

Great advice, thank you.

@ManifestDestinee
It's not a legally binding contractual agreement. Not least because they asked for an impossibility.

What is the impossibility ?

Just to clarify...last night when I was laid in bed I read back through the entire message thread with my landlord. Although my memory isn't great, over the years I did indeed ask for permission before doing any work, and sent photos once completed. All were met with 'looks lovely' etc.
I know this doesn't change the fact I agreed to put the walls back to magnolia. If just annoys me slightly that they want to pick and choose which aspects of the improvements they keep.

Do you have a good relationship with your landlord?

This is where it might help you to talk to them directly if you can.

The statement 'everything must be returned to original state' - is a standard tenancy clause in virtually every tenancy contract.

We had a great relationship with our landlord. We also made improvements to the property through decoration.

The letting agents tried to charge us due to the above clause, however, the landlord stepped in and said we had been excellent tenants, we had added value and not to charge us.

Have you sent current photos to the LL? I appreciate that the agent has now stepped into the discussion and will have a chat with LL as well - in all honesty, if it looks lovely as it is, I can't see the need to repaint it magnolia (I am a LL too) especially as not everyone likes ice cream tub décor!

I suspect the LL's issue is that they don't want the next tenant to make them pay for a repaint job, if they don't like the colour. But that can be sorted with the contract - if the new tenants want to repaint, as you did, then they should also be allowed to. If they do a shit job, then they will have to stump up for a redecoration whenever they leave.

You may lose your deposit to pay for a re-paint if the LL insists on it going back to magnolia - but if prospective tenants are happy with the way it looks now, then it seems utterly pointless to change back to vanilla.

We have always had to do this in rented houses, even housing association here ask for the property to be returned to how it was. My grandad lived in the same council house for 50 years and when he died my poor dad had to return it to how it was before including the garden, he had to fill in the pond, paint the whole house and take carpets out.

I thought it was pretty much the norm unless landlord/lady agrees otherwise.

What is the impossibility

I've already stated it, but for clarity: they asked for it to be returned as it was when OP moved in. In respect to the walls, OP would have to scrape off every bit of actual paint and put on very watered down paint to provide the builders finish that was there when she moved in. Thats not possible.
Painting everything cream would not be putting it back to how it was. Plus 9 years of rental means the landlord would be expected by the deposit scheme to have to repaint throughout, so he can't claim any losses if he wants to do so.

The landlord will be able to claim extra for having to have multiple costs of paint over dark/bright colours to return them to neutral though @ManifestDestinee. But the sums involved wont necessarily be huge.

I remember seeing a rental place advertised which looked absolutely lovely in the photographs, it was a period property and it was painted sympathetically in heritage style colours, feature cast iron fireplaces etc, it looked beautiful.

Went to view it and the whole lot had been painted magnolia. I remember standing in the lounge and staring at it, saying to the agent ‘what have they done…??” in an astonished tone.

Didn’t rent it.

First thing I did when I bought my current house, which had been painted magnolia for the market, was paint it from top to bottom. Having rented for 20 years, I HATE magnolia with a passion.

@Porcupineintherough

The landlord will be able to claim extra for having to have multiple costs of paint over dark/bright colours to return them to neutral though *@ManifestDestinee*. But the sums involved wont necessarily be huge.

They really won't.

I know this doesn't change the fact I agreed to put the walls back to magnolia. If just annoys me slightly that they want to pick and choose which aspects of the improvements they keep.

It's their property, of course they can decide which of your improvements they want to keep and which they don't. Even if you do believe that your taste is superior, if they want it magnolia and that's what you've already agreed to, that's what you do. If they allowed you to paint on the understanding that it would be put back to magnolia before you left and you don't do that, you're being the unreasonable one, not them.

They really won't.
Why do you keep insisting this?!

@QuantumDog2

Just to clarify...last night when I was laid in bed I read back through the entire message thread with my landlord. Although my memory isn't great, over the years I did indeed ask for permission before doing any work, and sent photos once completed. All were met with 'looks lovely' etc. I know this doesn't change the fact I agreed to put the walls back to magnolia. If just annoys me slightly that they want to pick and choose which aspects of the improvements they keep.

so you would be happy if they wanted you to take out the patio, and flooring?

@ManifestDestinee how strange because I did it just last year with the full approval of both tenant and deposit protection scheme.

What is the point of this thread? The OP is not interested in whether she is being unreasonable or not, and has made up her mind and won't be swayed.

@QuantumDog2

To add, I've contacted my landlord directly after the managing agents reminded me about repainting when I handed in my notice to leave. The landlord said everything back to plain cream walls please. At that point I told them I probably will not be doing this as I think they have a right to know. I tried to explain about being pregnant and not having time, but the bottom line is really that I can't be bothered. 🙈

Well you've probably ensured that the next tenants will be refused permission if they want to paint the walls themselves.

@Garriet

I remember seeing a rental place advertised which looked absolutely lovely in the photographs, it was a period property and it was painted sympathetically in heritage style colours, feature cast iron fireplaces etc, it looked beautiful.

Went to view it and the whole lot had been painted magnolia. I remember standing in the lounge and staring at it, saying to the agent ‘what have they done…??” in an astonished tone.

Didn’t rent it.

First thing I did when I bought my current house, which had been painted magnolia for the market, was paint it from top to bottom. Having rented for 20 years, I HATE magnolia with a passion.

I think certainly a lot of the more discerning tenants would probably very much appreciate being able to live in a house that’s actually done up nicely and feels like a proper home rather than having to live with boring and uninteresting interiors in the cheapest crappiest finishes...

I've already stated it, but for clarity: they asked for it to be returned as it was when OP moved in. In respect to the walls, OP would have to scrape off every bit of actual paint and put on very watered down paint to provide the builders finish that was there when she moved in. Thats not possible

This is nonsense. You clearly know nothing about decorating. One coat of undercoat and two coats of magnolia is all thats needed.

[quote Porcupineintherough]@ManifestDestinee how strange because I did it just last year with the full approval of both tenant and deposit protection scheme.[/quote]
If the tenant agreed to it the deposit scheme would rubber stamp it. If the tenant didn't agree (and they should not), the deposit scheme would not.

Did you rent for 9 years, do nothing at all, give your tenant permission to paint and then charge them for the paint to make it bland for the next people?
If yes, you should be ashamed of yourself. If no, you're commenting on a situation which is not the same.

OP your home looks immaculate and beautiful. 100% friendly to the renting/selling market. Your LL sounds like the type of person who likes to make difficulties out of nothing. It's horrible when you encounter such people who just crap on others "because they can". You've improved the property at no cost to him. He's won ££££ and still he wants to fuck about. Some people are just never satisfied.

This is nonsense. You clearly know nothing about decorating. One coat of undercoat and two coats of magnolia is all thats needed.

No, you don't understand. How would that be bringing it back to what was there before, which was NOT a coat of undercoat and two of magnolia? Do you not get it?

I think certainly a lot of the more discerning tenants would probably very much appreciate being able to live in a house that’s actually done up nicely

To THEIR taste though. Not everyone wants blue, green and pink in their homes. That's why OP should be putting it back to how it was. You wanted to paint, you then put it back.