To not want the front door to be double locked?

[Keke94LND]

So I live in London on the ground floor of a terraced house, there are two other flats in the building and there is a sturdy front door to the building, and then obviously we all have our own front doors for our individual flats.

My boyfriend and I never bother double locking the front door, but the neighbours always do, even if they just pop our for five minutes. I find it annoying, that the door is always double locked when I get in from work, especially as it is getting darker now, mainly because having to unlock the door twice adds an extra 10-15 seconds onto opening the door and, especially as you have to bend down to unlock the second lock, I'm paranoid about getting mugged or attacked from behind. I'd like to be able to get into the building as quickly as possible without faffing about. My boyfriend also has an expensive bike that could easily be stolen whilst he's faffing about unlocking the door.

On one hand I understand that the neighbours do it for extra protection to stop burglaries, but on the the other hand I think the risk of being mugged/attacked is actually higher, especially as the front door is very sturdy anyway and would be pretty hard to break into, plus we all have extra front doors as well.. so AIBU?

I don't live in an unsafe area, but it's a big city where anything could happen at any time 🤷🏼‍♀️

Geezo
Anything could happen anywhere at any time!

I always double lock my front door. My husband can easily get into our front door if it’s not double locked. He’s gotten several neighbours into their houses when they’ve been locked out as he’s fitted a lot of doors. When the door shut behind me once when putting out the rubbish, it took him less than 10 seconds to get the door open for me.

I don't get it? If the area I'd so bad that you might get mugged or you bike stolen whilst you've opening your own door...surely you'd want the front door to be secure?

How does it take you 15 seconds to turn the second key? Come on @Keke94LND you've made a bit of a mountain out of locking a door?

@GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing

You need a different sort of lock. It’s important for insurance often to have either a double lock or a more advanced main lock but I agree you need one that’s a. Not involving you standing outside for ages in the dark and b. Not a fire hazard. One that needs a separate key from the inside to get out is a fire hazard.

YANBU OP. I agree with @GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing that this should be a different type of lock that, if double locked, can be unlocked using one key, i.e. by turning it twice in the lock.

The traditional "Yale" ype nightlatch is ridiculously easy to open by various simple burglary techniques.

But you can buy a British Standard Nightlatch to BS 3621 which is a "thief resistant lock" costing between about £50 and £150

Most BS locks are 5-lever mortice deadlocks, which cost less. It is hard to find a better lock.

@NigellasCookalong

Also I rent and have contents insurance for what I own. When you take out insurance it goes into extreme detail when it asks what locks are on the door/what kind of windows there is on the property. If there was a break in and it was found that one of the locks on the door wasn’t used it would void my entire insurance.

This. ^

Also, I am gobsmacked to see that a number of people don't have contents insurance. You don't have to own your home to have it, and you don't have to be a privileged princess who thinks £100K a year salary is low, and £800 is cheap for a handbag (as a pp said.) It's also rubbish that it costs £30 a month.

We pay £12 a month for home contents cover, (to cover up to £20,000 worth of items.) It would only be £30 a month if you want to cover £50,000 or more worth of goods. If you have THAT much value of goods in your home, then you can probably afford the £30 a month for insurance. Also, many people clutching their pearls at the thought of £30 a month for contents insurance, will think nothing whatsoever of paying £40 for a monthly phone contract, or spending £50 on a night out.

Batshit.

Also, many mortgage lenders and landlords insist on contents insurance as part of the tenancy agreement. So I'm baffled as to how and why some people haven't got contents insurance.

What do people mean when they say "double lock?"

Two locks?

Deadlocking a nightlatch?

Locking the handle of a nightlatch?

Longer throw of a bolt?

Our front door has a double lock but we never turn the mortice from the inside. Surely this would be a huge risk in a fire, scrambling around for a key?

Maybe your neighbours are fed up with you NOT double locking the door. There are two locks for a reason. If you’re that worried about being mugged, why not move?

YABU. I live in London and don't think I'm going to be attacked from behind every time I unlock my front door! Such crimes are vanishingly rare - I've never heard of it happening round here in 25 years.

And then idea that your boyfriend's bike is going to be kicked in the two seconds it takes to unlock your door - where on earth do you live?! It sounds awful.

Burglary, OTOH, is very common, so I always double lock our front door.

I bet you drive your neighbours mad leaving it unlocked

A friend gave me a set of lock picks last Christmas. With no practice at all I managed to open a Yale lock in about 3 seconds..

I would echo this, I have a set of picks and can easily unlock a standard cylinder lock in seconds. More complex locks take longer but take a look at this video, this guy can pick a Banham lock in less time than it takes you to unlock with a key. Fortunately few burglars bother with the effort of acquiring picking skills or this level of finesse but it is frightening that even the best lock can't keep a determined burglar out, it simply slows them down which is a deterrent in itself.

@MyPatronusIsACat

You only need contents insurance if you have valuable contents. How is that baffling to you?

If you live in a furnished rental, and have some H&M clothes, as OP said she has, plus a few other household bits and bobs, it makes no sense at all to spend £400 a year on insurance when the whole lot can be replaced for a grand

Burglars only want high value things like laptops and consoles.
Water leaks and fires are vanishingly rare

3 years worth of saved premiums gives you more cash than a payout from the insurance would if you lost everything, and a fire or flood is not a once every 2 years event

Yes, once you start owning your own furniture, jewellery, electricals etc, it starts making more sense to have contents insurance

But in 20+ years of owning, renting and renting out property, I’ve never seen a mortgage or tenancy that stipulates contents insurances is required so am surprised you think it’s a common ask

@ItsSnowJokes

Can you open both locks from inside without keys? If not your freeholder may he on breech of fire regulations. All locks in communal fire exits (like in flats) need to have a keyless exit. That could be the way to get them to change the locks.

Hi, you need to be aware of this. Actually what you’re talking about is serious from a safety point of view but not what everyone is fixed on. Your building should be managed by someone and they’re required by law to have a fire risk assessment done every five years. This FRA will almost certainly require any locks that require keys for unlocking the door from the inside to be removed or disabled. This is because, in the event of a fire, the hallway will likely be so thick with smoke that residents will not be able to see the lock to get out and may not be thinking straight either. You can ask a local fire officer to take a look at the communal areas and advise on whether they’re safe. You can upgrade the main lock to be a heavy duty security lock but you should have no additional locks that require a key from inside or any bolts.

Grenfell was a distasteful that is still be talked about and investigated today. Residents of blocks of flats need to be aware that the cladding was not the only thing wrong with that building which caused the fire to spread the way it did. Internal defects such as lack of fire doors, too much ‘stuff’ in communal hallways etc all contributed massively. Residents of blocks of flats can take measures to reduce risk of fire and smoke…
Removing locks that require fiddling with to get out of the building is one of them.

This applies to residential properties too, which is why most locks have a thumb turn on the inside, but as it’s a single household the evacuation is considered simpler and quicker.

To protect yourself from burglaries consider cameras, security lights etc. Sounds like this lock is fixing one problem but making another potentially much worse.

*DISASTER! Not distasteful.. distasteful doesn’t even begin to sum up the complete failure of any responsible persons dealing with that building!

I lived in a very similar set up Op. If there had been a burglary and the front door was found not to have been double locked, our contents insurance for our flat wouldn't have been valid.

It really annoyed me when the other flat dwellers didn't double lock the front door.

I get that you are really nervous about this though.

@Darkchocolateandcoffee

YABU. I live in London and don't think I'm going to be attacked from behind every time I unlock my front door! Such crimes are vanishingly rare - I've never heard of it happening round here in 25 years.

And then idea that your boyfriend's bike is going to be kicked in the two seconds it takes to unlock your door - where on earth do you live?! It sounds awful.

Burglary, OTOH, is very common, so I always double lock our front door.

I bet you drive your neighbours mad leaving it unlocked

In London... the bike theft capital of the country, and specifically south west London which has the highest rates of bike theft in London.... bike theft stats have also gone up over covid. That's not just stealing a bike that's locked to a lamppost either btw, includes bike muggings too. Also, this stuff happens in even the nicest parts of London, my uncle lives in Notting Hill and has been mugged on his doorstep... obviously I do understand that burglaries are also a big risk so I've taken on board what everyone's said and double locked the doors last night! But if someone said to you they were worried about burglaries, would your response be 'where the hell do you live!?' .. no, because you understand that you can be burgled living anywhere.. same thing for other crimes.

Sorry but it's really weird to me that you're so worried about being mugged on your doorstep but not about someone being able to get into your building hallway and mug or attack you there (or burgle the flats).

You are being totally unreasonable and actually quite selfish - I'd be so annoyed if a neighbour were putting my security at risk by not locking the door properly.

[quote SW1amp]@MyPatronusIsACat

You only need contents insurance if you have valuable contents. How is that baffling to you?

If you live in a furnished rental, and have some H&M clothes, as OP said she has, plus a few other household bits and bobs, it makes no sense at all to spend £400 a year on insurance when the whole lot can be replaced for a grand

Burglars only want high value things like laptops and consoles.
Water leaks and fires are vanishingly rare

3 years worth of saved premiums gives you more cash than a payout from the insurance would if you lost everything, and a fire or flood is not a once every 2 years event

Yes, once you start owning your own furniture, jewellery, electricals etc, it starts making more sense to have contents insurance

But in 20+ years of owning, renting and renting out property, I’ve never seen a mortgage or tenancy that stipulates contents insurances is required so am surprised you think it’s a common ask[/quote]
My tenancy contract stipulates contents insurance and I was pretty annoyed about it. I don't think it's a reasonable ask and I'm not even sure it's legally enforceable.

@Rozziie

Sorry but it's really weird to me that you're so worried about being mugged on your doorstep but not about someone being able to get into your building hallway and mug or attack you there (or burgle the flats).

You are being totally unreasonable and actually quite selfish - I'd be so annoyed if a neighbour were putting my security at risk by not locking the door properly.

It's probably a matter of perspective, because I've had things happen to me and my friends/family outside of the house, I worry about it more, whereas I don't worry about burglary so much because it's never happened/I don't know anyone who's been burgled. I don't think it's unreasonable of me to worry about being attacked, but I get your point re burglaries and will start double locking from now on

I think it’s sensible to be careful and aware when at your door but think this reasonable care has just fit a bit out of proportion. I’d make sure the front is as safe as you can make it - eg any hedge trimmed so not obscuring door from street, motion light so you can actually see to put keys in etc, gate (if any) shut behind you so you’d hear if anyone were approaching (whether innocent or not), keys ready (I always do this) and standing so you can see a bit behind you.

A locksmith once informed me it was always better to double lock

[quote SW1amp]@MyPatronusIsACat

You only need contents insurance if you have valuable contents. How is that baffling to you?

If you live in a furnished rental, and have some H&M clothes, as OP said she has, plus a few other household bits and bobs, it makes no sense at all to spend £400 a year on insurance when the whole lot can be replaced for a grand

Burglars only want high value things like laptops and consoles.
Water leaks and fires are vanishingly rare

3 years worth of saved premiums gives you more cash than a payout from the insurance would if you lost everything, and a fire or flood is not a once every 2 years event

Yes, once you start owning your own furniture, jewellery, electricals etc, it starts making more sense to have contents insurance

But in 20+ years of owning, renting and renting out property, I’ve never seen a mortgage or tenancy that stipulates contents insurances is required so am surprised you think it’s a common ask[/quote]
This!!!! People on here seem to thinking “renting” always means a 3 bedroom house which you have fully furnished yourself, with tv, computers, purchased furniture, full wardrobe of jewellery, rugs, expensive kitchen items, loads of electronics. When for a lot of London rentals you’re talking a flat where you don’t own any furniture or kitchen items, just some clothes and a laptop—in which case the price of insurance is so out of whack you might as well just put a few quid a month into savings.

When I was renting in London, had all (literally all) my stuff been stolen I would have just bought a new laptop on CC and some clothes from charity shop, would have cost me less than 2 years of insurance. But the chances of being burgled for laptop weren’t super high, let alone chances of someone stealing all my clothes!

if your home is easy to break into, a few small, easily saleable items are well worth four minutes work.

A dazed teen crack-head may not even have the sense to perform a cost/benefit analysis before kicking in your door and throwing all the drawers on the floor.

Double locked to ,e is when my front door needs both keys to unlock it. One lock just needs the door pulled to lock, the other needs me to actively put the key in and turn it.

You are being utterly ridiculous.

Double lock the door and stop being daft. If I were one of your neighbours I would be rather irritated by you not doing so.