..that this IS a drinking problem

[Beelzebop]

Please help me. Would you agree that an individual has a drinking problem if they are upsetting their partner through their actions when drunk on a regular basis. Verbal abuse/Irresponsibility. I need to know if I am being reasonable. Everything I try to work through seems to be bounced back at me. He doesn't believe he is an alcoholic or a problem drinker. Sadly, he also seems to value beer over me as I have begged him to stop. So, Yabu - no problem
Yanbu - problem

Thank you. I genuinely don't know up from down anymore.

I voted YANBU but truth is, it's impossible to tell if he has a drink problem or an abuse problem. Either way though, it's a problem.

Thank you. I have always been trying to help. Hoping. But hope has got me into a very poor position.

What are they like with you when they've not been drinking?

I think that in general any time that alcohol negatively impacts on other areas of your life eg work or relationships, then it's a problem.

But in some ways it doesnt matter why. Whether its alcohol or he is just like that. He is choosing, somewhere along the line, to verbally abuse you. That doesn't come from no where.

I was thinking about this earlier, randomly. You cant get in the car and knock someone over and use 'but I was drunk' as an excuse. The law says we know what happens when we drink, so we shouldn't drink if we drive. Similarly we don't accept 'but I was drunk' as an excuse for fucking up at work, failing an exam etc. Why do some people accept the 'I was drunk' 'excuse' for abusive behaviour?

To be honest it doesn’t matter if he thinks it isn’t a problem it IS a problem to you. The question is will it change? Answer is probably not. So you need to decide on whether to stay and be unhappy or leave

If he doesn't have a problem with alcohol he'd stop drinking it surely. Fact is he thinks more of drinking and abusing you than he does of keeping you safe and happy. This won't ever change. I know this from experience. The sooner you get out the sooner you can rebuild your life and find someone who prioritises you.

My sisters ex was like this. When not drinking he was quiet, timid and unassuming. As soon as he got one drink down him he couldn’t stop and would end up either cheating or hurling a load of verbal abuse at my sister, punching walls, damaging the house - their relationship didn’t start like this, it got worse over time. She would try to talk to him about it when he was sober, he wouldn’t accept he had an issue with alcohol. He wasn’t drinking every day or even every weekend, but once he had one drink he couldn’t stop and that was the issue.
When the relationship got to the point where it was near the end, and they were still living together, I was absolutely terrified his behaviour would get even worse. I’ve never been so relieved when she finally left with the kids.

If your behaviour when you’re drinking is damaging your relationship with the people you claim to love, but you’re not willing to do anything about it, then you don’t love those people.
Don’t let someone put drink before you - if they do, they don’t love you. IMO.

I think this is too vague to have a definite opinion on.

If he's fine when sober but is routinely abusive when drunk then yes he has a drink problem. If he's abusive when sober but slightly worse when drunk, he's an abuser plain and simple.

The irresponsibility is a different thing. If he's drinking and doing stupid things regularly (like drink driving or breaking things, accidentally or otherwise) then that would also suggest he has a drink problem.

Doesn't really matter if he's a dick because that's his natural personality or because he has a drinking problem, the point is that he is treating you badly and abusing you. So he needs to stop. If stopping ALSO requires stopping alcohol, fine.

HOwever, at the end of the day, he doesn't seem to care how he treats you or how his behaviour impacts you so you have to decide if you can live with that. I'd argue you shouldn't.

A constant drinker. can put a blot on the landscape,of everyone around them, even though they don't think they have a problem. The drinking can be mind altering, so obviously they can't decipher things properly.
Verbal abuse can be added to this factor of being in denial about the alcohol. it can all get out of hand, but you get nowhere trying to help an alcoholic at all.

My experience of living with an alcoholic was bad to the extreme. he was abusive when trying to help him, throwing things around the place, not being able to communicate properly anymore, living just for booze,and wrecking his mind and body with not eating, and dying eventually.

Thank you for your replies. He is verbally abusive and very passive aggressive when he is drunk. He mutters a lot and will slam doors. His behaviour puts me on edge and I get a bad stomach. When he is sober he can be lovely. He does not seem to understand that saying sorry after is not good enough any more. I know ultimatums are incredibly dangerous but I have told him he needs to seek some sort of help ( and prove he's been) and he needs to stop drinking. I am awful at boundaries and do not know what is normal. This nasty drunk act has been going on for fifteen years now and it had only been recently that I have felt a bit more able to question it.

As for amount of alcohol consumed, I'm not sure but enough to get drunk a couple of times a week. He also takes antidepressants. I have spoken to him about this as well.

So sorry OP. Yes, this is a big problem. I think if you have given ultimatums and nothing has changed you need to start thinking about what you do next. Hope can be dangerous, especially when it leads you to a place where you feel you are not in control of your boundaries. I think you know what you need to do. It's time to talk about leaving, him or you. How would that work?

He will not change because he doesn’t want to. He’s nice and you’ve clung to that side of him for 15 years but he’s not really nice is he. He’s horrible to you and doesn’t give a fuck how you feel. That’s not love.

Decide if you are prepared to dump him. I would. I have done so myself. I have not regretted leaving a violent alcoholic. Not once. Right decision. Much happier.

If you decide to go, start looking into what your options are re housing etc. Quietly without any ‘I’m leaving you’ stuff. Say nothing. Get your ducks in a row first. And leave. Your ultimatums won’t work so why delay again by trying when you know what the outcome will be.

I know it’s easier said than done but you only get one life. Do you want to spend it like this? You deserve better.

My definition of problem drinking is when the drinking negatively impacts on the person's close friends and family, so YANBU.
People get hung up on the technical definition of alcoholism and how many units are consumed etc but for me if its enough of a problem to be a problem for those on whom it impacts it's irrelevant.

The behaviour you're describing is unacceptable and it's almost certainly the case that he has some depency on it, which is why he can't stop.

I've been through this and I'm afraid the only way to take control of the situation is to make plans to leave. You can't leave it with him to make this decision, he will always avoid it if there's an alternative. People with an alcohol dependency won't make changes because someone asks them to, begs them to, nags or cajoles them to. Alcohol is more important in their life than the other people for whom alcohol is a problem. If you want to remove the problem from your life, the agency has to be with you.

This may or may not be enough to bring him to realise he has to change but you can't count on this. I'm sorry if this is harsh, but you can't spend the rest of your life waiting for someone else to change this for you.