Am I utterly stupid and deluded to think I might ever live in London as an older person?

[figwine]

Just back from a trip there and as always I'm filled with a yearning to just stay there. I love travelling and love pretty much everywhere I go, but nowhere affects me like London does. I did live there for a couple of years in my 20s but then lived abroad for a while where I met exh, who persuaded me to move to the Midlands!

I would never uproot the dc (12 & 14), and certainly wouldn't be able to afford a family-sized home anywhere near anyway, but I have been wondering whether a small flat might be within reach in a few years. Obviously no one can give me an answer with regards affordability as we are talking about 10 years' time and if I can't afford it that will be the end of it. However, in theory, does it sound like a stupid idea?

As things stand I have no partner. I do have a career but it's one I could do anywhere and I would be coming to the end of it then anyway. I just feel the area we are in is so limited and dull, but obviously being alone and not massively well off in a big city might just be shit. I just wish I'd stayed when I had the chance, but that that ship has sailed. I have friends on FB who live there but I haven't seen them for years and couldn't assume I think that I'd be able to pick up where we left off.

Does anyone have any thoughts or relevant experiences? Perhaps I just need a shake!

concerning!

Just RTFT and MASSIBE eye roll at @Powertothepetal saying how unfriendly London is and then justifying that by saying her relatives live there!

I am from the countryside - grew up on a farm, to be specific - and London is the friendliest place I have ever lived. (I've also lived in Madrid, Edinburgh, and various English counties in rural spots).

Unfriendly is the last thing London is, as anyone who lived here knows. But it's always the first insult that non-Londoners throw at it.

A set of friends moved out when their children were young but couldn't wait to come back once they had gone to uni.

They have a place in South London zone 2 along the Thames. They absolutely enjoy the lifestyle it brings.

Another couple are 89 and 88 in v good health and always say how lucky they are to live in the capital.

So definitely a city for all ages.

@GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing

Perfectly good plan if you can afford it!

I’m thinking of doing the opposite - not Midlands but moving from London to somewhere more rural when I’m older. I suppose that’s the more standard route though.

Lots of people return to the city when older for good transport , nearer to hosp shops and the ease of getting carers n cleaners etc. More difficult in a rural location when mobility is reduced with age.

@BuffySummersReportingforSanity

One of my friends (also born & raised) has been in Manchester for about 18 yrs. Shes defo not seen as a Mancunian

That's precisely one of the things that's so wonderful about this place though. If you live here, you belong. You're a Londoner. A born Cockney is no more or less a Londoner than someone who moved here a year ago from Manchester or Ghana or Lithuania.

The welcoming and international spirit of London is a big part of what I love about it.

If everyone else in the UK is allowed a 'local' or 'regional' identity (local, as in born and bred), so too should Londoners (as in born and bred).

These past few days the media has been banging on about 'outsiders' pricing out Cornish 'locals' and (I quote) 'tearing apart local communities'. It's been happening to London locals for years. Either it's ok and nowhere is 'local' and if you move somewhere, you immediately are a local just by living there. Or its not. It's can't work one one only - because London too has London born locals and local communities.

Yes, unlike some other more insular parts of the UK, London is welcoming and tolerant. But that doesn't erase the fact of the existence of Londoners, as in London born locals, and London local communities.

If Sadiq Khan moved to Cornwall or the Lakes he'd be seem by born and bred 'locals' there as a Londoner, rather than as a local. Therefore if someone from Cornwall or the Lakes moves to London, they wouldn't be a Londoner - but instead someone from Cornwall or the Lakes who is living in London.

Re the OP. I wouldn't say that London is particularly elderly friendly. Ever since Tony Blair's fetishism of the young and healthy, coupled with his focus on London as a playground for the rich (at the expense of locals), London has increasingly become a difficult environment for the elderly (and the poor and the disabled).

There's even a mayoral scheme aimed at shipping out London's elderly social housing tenants to the coast and countryside.

I am one of those hankering after a barbican retiral.

I already live in zone 1 but I love that area and the architecture. It's full of old people who have retired in.

I LOVE living in London. I moved here aged 23. I've tried to leave twice and keep coming back. I don't sleep well away from the hustle and bustle. The need to use public transport keeps you fit too although I might upgrade to an electric bike!

If Sadiq Khan moved to Cornwall or the Lakes he'd be seem by born and bred 'locals' there as a Londoner, rather than as a local. Therefore if someone from Cornwall or the Lakes moves to London, they wouldn't be a Londoner - but instead someone from Cornwall or the Lakes who is living in London.

...No, to the vast majority of people they'd just be a Londoner. They can be Cornish or from Pembrokeshire or whatever too if they want. You can be a Londoner who just moved here or a Londoner who was born within spit of Bow Bells, and obviously in the latter case you will have specific ties and relationships and your history as. Londoner will go back longer, but not having that doesn't make you not a Londoner. Even born and bred Londoners have often moved 10-20 miles from where they were born without ever leaving the city. Living in an international and constantly changing world city means accepting that life is flux. "Local communities" in London have never been stable in the way that rural ones may have been. An area may have been an "Irish" area, then a Turkish one, then an Afro-Carribbean one.

@Tealightsandd

Re the OP. I wouldn't say that London is particularly elderly friendly. Ever since Tony Blair's fetishism of the young and healthy, coupled with his focus on London as a playground for the rich (at the expense of locals), London has increasingly become a difficult environment for the elderly (and the poor and the disabled).

There's even a mayoral scheme aimed at shipping out London's elderly social housing tenants to the coast and countryside.

What is this mayoral scheme of shipping out all elderly people and where can we see it.

Does it really exist?

Come on then @LarryTheLurker, don't be shy: explain to us who qualifies as "actual Londoners"

I'll answer for her. The same as what qualifies someone as 'actual Cornish' or a 'actual local' from any other part of the UK.

The media articles and MN threads about 'locals' in Cornwall and the Lakes and other parts of the UK. What qualifies someone as 'actual Cornish'? Or 'actual Lakes local'?

Born and bred locals. Sadiq Khan is an example of a born and bred Londoner.

I have a retirement fantasy of a flat in the Barbican. But I'll probably have a gardening fetish by then, it hits all the women in our family post-menopause.

Local communities" in London have never been stable

Rubbish. Until Tony Blair, there were plenty of stable local London communities. There has always been some transience in London - but it used to coexist with (stable) local communities.

I want to retire to London too. DH won't hear of it. This is a problem for me. I REALLY want to live there not just come up twice a year to see a show.

My parents retired to London. They loved it but in their eighties they were basically told 'move out, We have zero provision for the elderly' by Islington council. So they did. They had fun for twenty years first though!

@Cosmos123 when I inquired of Islington council what provision they had for the elderly - any residential homes or assisted living or care plans for staying in your own home with visits, I got a letter back that basically said 'the council recommends you move away from Islington to somewhere more suitable for the elderly' !

I'll join in the dreaming ... where would be the best place for me to buy my two bed flat?
Primrose Hill ?

What is this mayoral scheme of shipping out all elderly people and where can we see it.

www.london.gov.uk/what-we-do/housing-and-land/council-and-social-housing/seaside-and-country-homes

Younger Londoners (the poor and disabled and vulnerable) get shipped out too. In a much worse way than the seaside and country home scheme, which is at least a choice. Homeless Londoners (of which there are many - 165,000 in total) are often shipped out of London, away from their families and support networks. It's been going on for years but the media seems largely unbothered. Quite a contrast to the recent media articles bemoaning Cornish and other seaside locals starting to be priced out of their home areas.

No, to the vast majority of people they'd just be a Londoner. They can be Cornish or from Pembrokeshire or whatever

Only if it works both ways. No double standards. If Sadiq Khan moves to Pembrokeshire, would the so-called locals accept him as a Pembrokeshire local? Or would they see him as a Londoner who moved to Pembrokeshire? London born people have the same right to a local identity as anyone else.

Either it's defined by where you move to and currently live, or it's defined by where you're born and grew up - but that has to be applied equally across the country.

To strike a discordant note, speaking as a born Londoner who has lived here almost all my life the place has been steadily turning in to a shithole for the last twenty or so years. Shockingly expensive, unbelievably overcrowded (pop'n 1991: 6m. Now: 9m), run by idiots at both city and borough level, and where actual Londoners are fast becoming a minority (though this being Mumsnet that last point might not bother you).

Totally a good idea if it’s what you want.

Look around Brockley in SE London- still some cheap flats in Lewisham more widely, lots to do and fab connections to central London on the train. Though if your DC stay in the Midlands you might want to be nearer St Pancras/Euston, so north London would be a better bet.

London can be lonely at first, so make sure you’ve got plans to join book clubs, walking groups or a sports team etc to meet people. But it can be a great place for older people as there’s so much to do that’s free, and you’re always near a health care provider.

Despite what people say and think, London is incredibly welcoming and there is a strong community spirit.

This. Far more so than I’ve ever found elsewhere.

I thought about London then went for Brighton. I got a buy to let mortgage and plan to retire in 10 years when I'm 60.

Property prices are cheaper, the flat is in a good area, direct train to London, share of freehold and v low service charges and a large garden. Can't wait to move.

@Mercurial123 you’ve got a buy to let mortgage but you’re moving into the property yourself?

You are never alone in London. I have lived in many places. By far the best and the worst but really the best.

London is a great city to retire too. Every thing on your door step, free public transport, tons to do and get involved in

There's quite a few retirees where I am (south London zone 5) and they have a better social life than any young person I know. They go to the Kent seaside, central london restaurants, local country parks and there are all sorts of social groups or hobbies (it's London, so nothing is too quirky). There's red buses and fast trains in. Ethnic food choices. Best of all worlds really.

The wonderful thing about London is diversity - not just race or class, but I find people generally more accepting of different viewpoints than other parts of UK. You don't need to fit into a certain mould, or have a samey town or village tribal mentality. You can participate as much as you like in your community or just pass through politely, it's fine. Unlike many European cities London feels like a real melting pot.

This is a great thread and has certainly not cured me, or OP I suspect, of a desire to be in London. It's only made it worse in fact!