To think the reason UK holidays can be shit is not the weather but the traffic?

[MrsBede]

....and it's much worse this year?

I went from the Midlands to North Wales a couple of weeks ago and it took twice as long as it should have both there and back. Just got back from London and it took about 90 minutes longer than it should have. For both these trips it wasn't just one delay, but several unrelated ones - for the former every step of the journey pretty much had long delays. For London it's just the M1 - that was slow going there for a long stretch and on the way back my SAtnav recommended a detour and that had delays too.

As well as this, my city is being dug up here there and everywhere - I can think of about 5 different local routes that all have roadworks on them and ensuing delays - one was the bloody slip road when I finally got off the motorway today!

It just spoils everything - we're going to Hampshire for a few days next week and the thought that the 3.5 hour trip is likely to be more like 6 is really putting me off and I half feel like cancelling, which is very unlike me indeed. I certainly expect some delays when going longish distances but AIBU to think this year has been worse than ever, and it's not fair! (Yes, I'm tired and very pissed off...)

And public transport in Wales is shit. You can tootle up and down the coast road on a bus, but if you want to go to Cheshire oaks (20 minutes by car), you have to take a bus to a different town (30 minutes plus), then change (another 30 minutes plus).

I think I worked out that if I had to get to work by public transport, it would take me 2 hours. Not including childminder drop off.

If I lived in London I wouldn't have a car.

But I can't think of anywhere else in the country with such good public transport.

Even places that you think "should", don't. Or the routes don't go where you need to get to.

Random piece of information.

I read somewhere yesterday there is an overnight sleeper train directly from London to the highlands of Scotland I believe near Courrand (others might be able to name the place).

A youth hostel not far away from the station. So travel whilst you sleep from London. Wake up in beautiful countryside, stay in the youth hostel (reasonably priced), when you are ready get back on the train. Wake up in London.

I think it's the attitude that "oh just get rid of your car" like it's an easy option. For the majority of the country having a car is worthwhile. Even if it's just for holidays or weekends away. Public transport needs to be better and cheaper before it will be widely used.

beigebrown holiday bits start at Talacre and go all the way round the coast one way. But those of us on the holiday route still get battered by traffic. Not anyone's going to want to holiday in my bit

The other bit starts around Ruthin and Bala and goes towards Snowdon.

www.scotrail.co.uk/plan-your-journey/travel-connections/caledonian-sleeper

I don't have a car and neither DH or I have a licence. In "normal" times before traffic light systems and astronomical charges for covid tests it was easier to fly to somewhere for our holidays than stay in the UK. I think most people in London think the same way.

HOWEVER we have gone on UK holidays (pre- and post covid) and with some planning and patience it's do-able but not exactly a cinch, iyswim.

We have been to the Isle of Wight for example, because the foot ferry is included in the ticket price of the train. If you go to Ryde there is still a railway down the east side of the island. Buses run from most island towns once an hour.

In Devon and Dorset, the buses are quite good and trains will take you over further distances quicker.

In East and West Sussex there are buses to all over the county. Coastal trains are ok too.

We were going to go to Matlock in Derbyshire in 2020 but bailed. However, there are lots of places reached by bus in the region, plus lots of walking routes to do.

I think because we don't have a car (in the capital you don't really need one) and travelling by public transport is our "normal" we don't have the cost of running a car in addition to PT costs so for us it costs about the same. We research deals on tickets online well in advance and take advantage of weekly or carnet-style tickets which work out cheaper. We also Google for accommodation which is close to public transport (up to a 20 minute walk) and near facilities like a shop and pub.

Obviously much of the UK is out of reach to us and at some point one of us will save up and get our licence but we have managed fine until our 40s so no rush. Also, I hate traffic jams. I hate crowded places and trying to find a place to park. I have tried to get my licence in the past and it stresses me out no end. On buses, I can read a book whilst someone else takes me to where I need to go. I can appreciate the scenery. I can eat my lunch. It's much easier on my mental health.

Finally, I equate the traffic jam with the train cancellation or the bus breaking down. It's a pain in the butt, I'm trying to get somewhere, but it's not the end of the world. There will be another train or bus coming or...ring for a taxi !!

The traffic in the UK is a joke. It's not just holiday time it's all the time.

DH has to drive a lot for work. Almost every day there is some sort of hold up.

It seems every time we go out there is a traffic jam. We had to drive 150 miles last week for family reasons and the traffic was terrible. Literally crawling along for miles and miles. Far too many lorries that slow everyone down when they try and overtake another one and it takes them 10 minutes or so. Drivers who don't ever use the slow lane.

There are just far too many people in the UK. One day, and it probably is not that far off, the roads will come to a total standstill

@lockhart and @lannistunut I agree with everything you’ve said and I’m in the I need my car category due to rural living and working in community nursing. How do we decide who does and doesn’t need their cars though? Will people be forced to give up their cars eventually if it’s deemed they don’t need them? How do we do that? I do think bigger cities should be the first approach for looking at car use and whether it is needed but I do think rural areas should be left alone.

@Lockheart

The article I linked above indicates that the average car is parked for 23 hours out of 24, and 58% of car journeys in the UK are 5 miles or less.

Many, many people could easily get rid of their cars right now, without any changes to public infrastructure or major changes to their lives (yes, some won't be able to before hordes of posters turn up telling me they absolutely must have a car because because because).

But they won't though because it's convenient.

Most of my car journeys are under five miles.

But I'm a self employed dog walker. Walking between jobs would mean cutting my income in half (or more). It wouldn't be practical so I'd need to close my business.

The roads between the towns I cover don't have pavements, and I don't fancy walking for 4-5 miles along a 60mph road with no safe space for pedestrians. Cycling isn't an option because I do group walks and need to be able transport the dogs safely.

A journey that takes me 4-5 minutes by car would take me over an hour to walk - probably closer to 90 minutes as it's pretty hilly here.

I'm all for walking or cycling when it's a safe alternative but for many people it's not. Many many thousands of people live in areas with no public transport, as well poor cycle routes and pedestrian access.

@Hercisback

I think it's the attitude that "oh just get rid of your car" like it's an easy option. For the majority of the country having a car is worthwhile. Even if it's just for holidays or weekends away. Public transport needs to be better and cheaper before it will be widely used.

I expect a large percentage of urban population could get rid of their car.

@icedcoffees I’ve just read an article on bbc about how the government are making greener travel a priority. More cycling lanes, more safe spaces for pedestrians to walk, better public transport running 7 days a week etc which all sounds fine and doable in towns and cities but not rural areas. No one asks the questions about those of us in rural areas. The village I live in has fairly good bus service, fairly regular buses running early till late 7 days a week but they only run to 3 places which is no good if you don’t work in one of those 3 places etc and it takes a long time to get there due to the number of stops as it’s rural roads

@icedcoffees I refer you to the part of my post where I acknowledge that some people do actually need a car.

If you're comfortable with your choices you don't need to justify them to me.

What do you think is "urban" though?

Bar London, most cities have crap transport links more than 2-3 miles out of the city centre. Most people don't live in a 2-3 mile bubble.

One of the problems is effing smart motorways. How long can it take to set them up? The M4 has been operating great long stretches of average speed restrictions for at least two years and it looks like they've still got a long way to go.

Another thing that annoys me is the roadworks. My experience in France is they often work through the night so by the next morning it's gone. Here they seem to pick the busiest day to close it off & then not even start the work.

Agree. If it's week or more I can stomach a long journey but when you just go somewhere nearby-ish for a long weekend and you spend two of your three days stuck in the car for hours, it's not exactly relaxing. I recently drove 100miles from north London to Dorset which Google told me would take under three hours but it actually took 4.5hours in both directions - just not worth it when you only have one day there.

See this is what worries me though especially living with her majesty queen Nicola as minister will she enforce cutting car journeys to point I can no longer work? Take my children to school/doctors/days out etc. I’m sorry but I also hate the idea of sharing a car with others as well and how would that even work? Especially in my line of work I can’t guarantee I’d be finished and home in time for the next person wanting to use it

@Hercisback

I think it's the attitude that "oh just get rid of your car" like it's an easy option. For the majority of the country having a car is worthwhile. Even if it's just for holidays or weekends away. Public transport needs to be better and cheaper before it will be widely used.

If you're only using your car for holidays and weekends away then no, it is not worthwhile. Financially or environmentally.

I've holidayed in the UK in lots of places without my car.

For the majority of the country, having a car is not worthwhile, it's a convenience which they're unwilling to give up. One which pollutes our air, chokes up our streets with traffic, and turns beautiful roads into ugly car parks.

Our trip to Devon last weekend took almost twice as long as it should. We left this morning at 6.30am and this is the M5 southbound at Bristol now!!

Varying school termtimes isn't the answer because it buggers up people with children in different schools. Even if you arrange it by counties, it won't help people living near the borders with some children in neighbouring counties.

I won't own a car so we get trains to holidays. Factor the cost into the holiday budget. Had a lovely recent trip to Scotland, booked train well in advance with railcard discount. Journey was so easy and I could even order wine to my table!!

I've done UK holidays on the train with the kids for years. Love it.

Travel at off times. That's what we do.
So we leave between 10pm and 4am depending on where the traffic is likely to be bad etc.

That way you almost always go straight through, the dc think it's exciting, and you can eat breakfast on the way.

It's better than leaving at 2am for your flight which includes 2hrs sitting around in the airport....

I have been put off Uk holidays after our trip that should of took 5 hours was 8.5 hours, never again!

[quote AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii]**@lockhart* and @lannistunut* I agree with everything you’ve said and I’m in the I need my car category due to rural living and working in community nursing. How do we decide who does and doesn’t need their cars though? Will people be forced to give up their cars eventually if it’s deemed they don’t need them? How do we do that? I do think bigger cities should be the first approach for looking at car use and whether it is needed but I do think rural areas should be left alone.[/quote]
Yes cities should be the priority for investment as that is where most people live.

Rural areas shouldn't be 'left alone' as car tax should be about £5m for a chelsea tractor and 5p for a small electric car. There will always be exemptions for those who genuinely work in rural industries. But let's be honest, the city solicitor who chooses to live rurally is not the same as the farmer dragging sheep out of ditches.

We could do lots for rural areas, they need a different approach, not nothing at all. So a car club in a small town could be subsidised, that is just offering a choice.

But travel between conurbations/areas is a big priority too.