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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask about joining Civil Service after school or university

50 replies

DupontsLark · 20/08/2021 13:33

DD(17) has announced she's not going to uni after A levels but is joining the Civil Service. DH is not happy as he is very keen for her to do a degree (it was never an option for him as he had to leave school at 16 and contribute to the family finances).

I know nothing about working for the Civil Service; is it a good idea to join after A levels or is it better to join their graduate scheme?

And yes I know it's DD's decision but I think she's influenced by her boyfriend ...

OP posts:
BarbaraofSeville · 20/08/2021 15:23

The civil service pension isn't as good as it used to be, but it's probably better than most private sector schemes.

skippy67 · 20/08/2021 15:26

That's great. My point is that the pension you sign up for at 20 might look very different a few years later. The government were actually found to have discriminated on age grounds regarding pensions. prospect.org.uk/article/what-is-the-mccloud-judgement/

Belledan1 · 20/08/2021 15:26

Yes I know it's not as good as it was as they stopped final salary pension but still good compared to private sector

skippy67 · 20/08/2021 15:27

That was in reply to @Belledan1

Bunnycat101 · 20/08/2021 15:28

In contrast to the others I wouldn’t if she wants to aim high. The civil service is very diverse with a ton of opportunities but there is a world of difference between some of the lower grade operational roles and policy wonk roles. Competition is high for the most interesting roles .

I’d be more interested in why she’s dropped the idea of law and french after meeting the boyfriend.

Rannva · 20/08/2021 15:29

Imagine a world where mums worry about boyfriends influence their daughters to... join the civil service.

A degree in French is a waste of £50,000+. The beauty of languages is you can learn them for free.

Getawaywithit · 20/08/2021 15:48

A degree in French is a waste of £50,000

Depends what she intends to do with it. Linguists are a dying breed and there is no reduction in our need for good linguists for both diplomacy and business purposes.

Original poster
DupontsLark · 20/08/2021 15:56

Imagine a world where mums worry about boyfriends influence their daughters to... join the civil service

Grin that has actually made me lol!

I don't think he wants her to join the CS (that's her idea), I worry that he doesn't want her to spread her wings.

OP posts:
Bunnycat101 · 20/08/2021 16:35

‘A degree in French is a waste of £50,000+. The beauty of languages is you can learn them for free.’

Says someone who i imagine hasn’t done a language degree. Language degrees are much more than the language itself and opens pathways to many grad schemes.

JammyGem · 20/08/2021 16:49

I'm currently doing an apprenticeship in the civil service, and I thoroughly recommend it.

You don't need a degree to start the apprenticeship, but by chance all of the apprenticeship on our team have degrees but for various reasons our chosen careers didn't work out, and I think we're all grateful for the opportunity. The benefits and focus on staff wellbeing are great, and I'm treated much better than at any of my previous jobs.

alwayslearning789 · 20/08/2021 16:58

I'm going to go against the grain here and say I'm not sure I would recommend at 18.

There's a whole lot of growing up to do till 21 and being in the civil service I would worry the younger ones might be taken advantage of and then end up in dead end jobs.

The pension is good definitely, but is a long time coming and maxes out at a certain amount of years service - I agree with her Dad - 18 is young.

DontCallMeBaby · 20/08/2021 18:03

I don’t think dead end jobs are much of a worry if she goes for an apprenticeship. Ours tend to progress pretty quickly, and if they don’t they can always leave with good transferable skills.

Current pension scheme doesn’t max out after any amount of years, as years are irrelevant. Plus the older ones only maxed out after 45 years, not much of a problem!

Bigoldhag · 20/08/2021 18:07

civil servant here - my degree means zilch. I didn’t even have it when i joined.

She sounds really switched on and will so well. Ive got a few in my department who are SEOs/G7s in their mid to late twenties after joining at 18-21.

Bookridden · 20/08/2021 18:15

Choose the department carefully. Big service depts aren't easy options.

Original poster
DupontsLark · 20/08/2021 20:44

Thanks for the replies. My feeling is she has her whole life to work, why not spending 3 or 4 years at university before knuckling down?

OP posts:
LIZS · 20/08/2021 20:55

She can always go to uni later, if needs be.

PumpkinPie2016 · 20/08/2021 21:00

If she is genuinely interested in a civil service career then I would definitely support her choice. I am not in the CS but know people who are and they all have decent jobs with decent conditions.

I went to Uni and on the one hand, I don't regret it because I couldn't teach without it and I do love my job now.

However, I remember at 17/18 feeling very unsure whether it was the right thing. The 6th form college I attended really pushed uni and there was little info on anything else. I wish there had been!

RealBecca · 20/08/2021 21:27

Why not knuckle down now and be on 30k in 3 or 4 years rather than debt and starting from the bottom? What do you think she will be doing at uni if not knuckling down? Why are you so against it?

Wtfdidwedo · 20/08/2021 21:34

My only concern would be a lack of experience outside the civil service can lead to quite a skewed view of the world of work. The 'career' civil servants I know do like to talk a lot about how awful a place it is to work these days, not realising that the majority of other jobs would give them nowhere near as much flexibility or as good a pension. If some of them were performance managed as they would be in the private sector I think they'd be in for a shock.

If she's currently working part time in hospitality though, she's probably already been exposed to a shitty enough industry to not take it for granted!

VestaTilley · 20/08/2021 21:37

I think they do an apprenticeships scheme (my midwife’s DS did it with DIT) so that could be a route in.

Otherwise a general degree at a good university is never a bad idea- gives her more to fall back on if she doesn’t get in to the CS - it is competitive and hard to get many roles within CS without a degree.

If she’s very bright she should look in to the CS Fast Stream, and their entry requirements.

nonevernotever · 20/08/2021 21:53

Whereabouts in the country are you? My department takes on modern apprentices and new graduates. Both cadres get experience in a range of policy jobs, and several years in tend to be similar grades. But I work for a devolved administration, so the opportunities are different and we tend to have more exposure to ministers at every grade than many departments can manage.

TractorAndHeadphones · 20/08/2021 22:32

Do you know that driving examiners and census takers are also technically part of the ‘Civil Service’? Or at least the jobs are on the same site.

This is a non-issue because
a) Neither of you know what you mean by ‘working for the Civil Service’

b) You don’t get a Civil Service job just by passing minimum standards ; it’s not the Army. What if she doesn’t get any offers? The good roles will be very competitive.

Do your research and if she gets a role with good prospects go for it. Otherwise uni. An apprenticeship is a good idea

TractorAndHeadphones · 20/08/2021 22:36

Also to add - I’m assuming she doesn’t have a job yet based on everyone else’s posts your responses.
Your OP looks like she’s already got a job and is taking it.
She can apply to uni and take a gap year while job hunting but a job isn’t guaranteed

AwkwardPaws27 · 20/08/2021 22:38

You don't have to have a degree to get on the Fast Stream (graduate scheme); existing civil servants are able to circumvent the degree requirement.
I'm a current fast streamer (finance track; went to uni as a mature student in the evenings) but have met a number of people on the scheme who applied via the existing CS route.

Doorhandleghost · 20/08/2021 22:51

A degree doesn’t get you anywhere faster in the CS really unless you want to be a specialist like an analyst when they will want you to have an economy type degree. There are lots of general entry roles and I personally think you can have a better and richer career like this than on the fast stream. I’ve hired lots of people with MAs into entry level roles recently - going to uni has not given them any edge over school leavers unless they did meaningful extra curriculars/had a job (and most haven’t).

For generalist entry level roles (ie you look at CS jobs and apply for roles) everyone is treated equally. What I would say is that as a very young person your DD might not have the work experience behind her to have decent behaviour examples to talk about - but this is also true of many graduates taking the same route. If so, she can remedy that easily by doing volunteer work maybe.

In the department I currently work in there are loads of people who joined straight from school and built their career over the years. This dept also offers a “from school” technical qualification route that builds into a very lucrative and respectable career. There are many options.

I’m a long standing civil servant and I can’t speak highly enough of the range of opportunities I’ve had in my career so far - happy to help your DD out with advice, send me a PM if she’d like.

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