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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To.ask if any solicitors on here could help me with understanding wording of a will ? I did ring the solicitors but they are now closed for good .

96 replies

Tiddleandplonk · 19/08/2021 13:55

My dear dad made a will which says he gives all his money to my step mum
And if she dies within 30 days of the will ... Which she hasnt...he gives the below to so and so..
My df stated as part of this that when my dc get to 21 years of age they should be given 10k each. .
Does this mean it was his wishws anyway.. or only if my step mum died in 30 days of the will.? Is it a way of saying he wanted them to have the money at 21.
?
As the solicitor in question is closed down
am not sure who to ask to clarify . Thank you.

OP posts:

NeverTalkToStrangers · 19/08/2021 19:59

Not worth spending money on a solicitor- I’m afraid that’s very clear and perfectly normal - everything goes to his wife.

There are lots of reasons why you wouldn’t want to leave money to someone who was just about to die themselves: tax, admin costs, the desire to give it to someone of your choice and so pretty much all professionally written wills will contain clauses like that.

Viviennemary · 19/08/2021 20:02

I dont think a solicitor would be involved in that kind of ambiguous wording.

NoSquirrels · 19/08/2021 20:04

@Viviennemary

I dont think a solicitor would be involved in that kind of ambiguous wording.

It’s not ambiguous, though?

GU24Mum · 19/08/2021 20:07

It's very clear now you've posted the photo as well. His wife gets everything and can do what she wants with it. Unfortunately lots of people don't think through that that means the wife (esp if not the mother of the children) has no obligation then to leave the children anything in her will. It's possible that's what he wanted but all too common that people don't work through the next steps ie should I leave all/part of my estate on trust to X and then to my children/grandchildren.

Sorry that it isn't the answer you wanted.

GreyhoundG1rl · 19/08/2021 20:09

Ah, that's a bit shit, op. If he wanted his grandchildren to inherit he should have specified it was alongside the bequest to his wife.
Shame.

GreyhoundG1rl · 19/08/2021 20:09

It's not ambiguous at all, unfortunately.

Nixandwotsit · 19/08/2021 20:13

You should check with a solicitor. However I think it's pretty clear. His wife inherits everything providing she survives him by 30 days (that's not unusual). That's clause 3.

If she didn't survive the 30 days then clause 3 does not apply and the rest of the will was to be enacted. That includes the bequests to your sons. That would be what it stated in clause 4 and beyond.
Also - if your dad at any point decided to direct that clause 3 should be omitted and not take effect - that your step mum wouldn't get anything - the rest of the will would apply.

She survived over 30 days, and he didn't direct that clause 3 should not take effect - therefore the will has been executed correctly.
I'm not a solicitor but I do read legal documents in my line of work.

Lemming20 · 19/08/2021 20:28

I am a lawyer. Sorry but wife gets everything as she survived 30 days. Your dad would hopefully have been advised that his wife was free to leave her estate as she wished ( I always advise that).

HasaDigaEebowai · 19/08/2021 20:42

I dont think a solicitor would be involved in that kind of ambiguous wording

As a solicitor I can confirm that’s not ambiguous and it is drafted in a normal way. I appreciate to a layman it might not seem that way.

Wheretoeattweenandteen · 19/08/2021 20:45

Very painful op.

Very painful... I wonder why so many do this and effectively cut out their direct descendants...

This man clearly wanted to give his gc someone money ie he thought about them and included them in his will. Except for he gave the lot to a step mother to his dc who now has met someone else.

Do solicitors not point this sort of thing out because I reckon so so so many people do think their surviving spouse will honour their wishes or love their dc enough to pass on their money.

Yet we know from real life and here that unfortunately... As soon as person dies the step parent left totally consolidated their fortune totally cutting off the blood family.

NoSquirrels · 19/08/2021 20:47

Do solicitors not point this sort of thing out because I reckon so so so many people do think their surviving spouse will honour their wishes or love their dc enough to pass on their money.

In my FIL’s case I think he would have felt having that conversation with his new wife was not possible and tantamount to saying he didn’t love her. Or something. The outcome is super shitty though.

HasaDigaEebowai · 19/08/2021 20:52

Do solicitors not point this sort of thing out because I reckon so so so many people do think their surviving spouse will honour their wishes or love their dc enough to pass on their money.

That isn’t what he wished though. If it was what he’d wished he’d have said £10k to each of my grandchildren upon reaching age x and the rest to my wife.

He didn’t say that. He said it all goes to my wife. Only if she dies straight after me do I want to distribute it differently and in such a situation (but only in such a situation) my grandchildren would get £10k.

It isn’t a mistake. In many cases it’s because there isn’t a lot of cash and they don’t want their spouse to be forced to sell the home in order to give gifts to named beneficiaries.

NoSquirrels · 19/08/2021 20:55

It isn’t a mistake. In many cases it’s because there isn’t a lot of cash and they don’t want their spouse to be forced to sell the home in order to give gifts to named beneficiaries.

This is very true, circumstances can prevent it being possible to distribute anything. Not in my FIL’s case but it’s a good point generally that it’s not always possible depending on the nature of the estate.

notanothertakeaway · 19/08/2021 20:57

@ChainJane

It's quite a common clause to put in, because for example if there was a car accident one partner might be killed immediately but the other might not die until a few days later.

30 days would be used to get around the argument that sometimes happens of who died first. To use the car crash example, if both were killed simultaneously it would be impossible to determine which died first - it would simply be the case of which was confirmed first.

Actually, if two people die in the same car accident and it's unclear who died first, then I think the elder person is presumed to have died first

Wheretoeattweenandteen · 19/08/2021 21:03

No, your correct

It's not a mistake.

However the point is he isn't estranged from the his family and he would have liked his gc to have something in that scenario.

One wonders did the solicitor, do they ever clearly point out.

Your wife can now take your estate and take evry single asset, momento, keep sake, and not give a penny to your family.

Do you want to risk that or... Leave them something specifically because it's very usual for step families to cut out the original family?

Wheretoeattweenandteen · 19/08/2021 21:05

Hasa.

Yes but they can still express wishes and write a letter off wishes that they want ££ to go to their family or that they leave the estate and wish that x on the death of x.

Lougle · 19/08/2021 21:09

The will needs to be read as you would an algorithm.

At the time of his death, was his wife still alive, and did she live for 30 more days? Yes: she gets it all. No: read clause 5.

Clause 5 only comes in if clause 3 isn't satisfied.

HasaDigaEebowai · 19/08/2021 21:18

However the point is he isn't estranged from the his family and he would have liked his gc to have something in that scenario.

Not as far as the will records. If he did it would be in the will.

I’m sorry, it might not be what the Op wants to hear but it’s clear. He wanted everything to go to his wife.

Nixandwotsit · 19/08/2021 22:20

I think people need to appreciate that solicitors know how to draw up wills. The solicitor hasn't made a mistake, they have produced a will in line with Op's dad's instructions. They will have gone through what he wanted, what the will said, and made sure it was correct.

He wanted his wife to have all of his money. The rest of the will lays out the "plan B" if she wasn't around for that to happen.
Maybe he believed that his priority was looking after his wife and he felt she would need the full estate. Whatever he thought, the will is clear.

1BlueSock · 20/08/2021 12:38

When we draw up wills (after taking instructions) we send a covering letter to the draft that details point by point in layman's english what the will is saying. And we ask the client to confirm it is their wishes.

I would say that these are the clear wishes of the deceased. I understand it may be painful (and I have seen how much pain can be caused from such things... I recall one client whose DParent had died exclaiming ' hang, X has been married to DParent for 2 years and cops the lot?!' )Sadly, yes.

1BlueSock · 20/08/2021 12:41

I would also add my constant plea that people get wills drawn up by trained legal professionals, not random will writing services you can find off the internet. It is all too easy to accidentally create something that does NOT do what you want (or even creates whole or partial intestacies) and it hardly ever ends up cheaper. Just get one done properly -by someone who knows what they are doing AND has professional indemnity insurance backing them up just in case they do stuff something up. I never understand why people wish to be si cavalier about such important things.

igelkott2021 · 20/08/2021 12:43

@MadeForThis

Clause 5 only applies if the wife dies within 30 days. It all goes to his wife.

Yes. Sorry it's not what you want to hear.

1BlueSock · 20/08/2021 12:44

(The abpve is my own personal hobby horse, not specifically relating to this thread). I once had to clean up a home-made will that was actually written by a lawyer (but a human rights lawyer, not a probate lawyer) as if he had died with that will standing would have caused all sorts of issues- mainly around gifts failing and an attempt to leave the same set of property to two completely different people.

DingDongThongs · 20/08/2021 23:48

Wills or the lack of clarity and equity in wills suck

DingDongThongs · 20/08/2021 23:49

Anyone here who hasn't get a decent legal will

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