To apply for a job when I know the recruiting manager?

[habitbabbit]

A maybe-perfect job has come up close to home, with an organisation I would very much like to work for. I'm very well qualified for the job, but two things are making me hesitate:

1. The recruiting manager is (coincidentally) someone I know personally - an aquaintance rather than a friend, though we have always got on very well and I like her. I actually applied for her team management role when it was advertised, but didn't get an interview. I don't know if that was because I didn't have enough leadership experience (likely) or another reason because they gave no feedback. I only found out later by accident that she got the job.

1. The salary information just says 'competitive', which is meaningless because its a professional role which can pay anything from 30k in some organisations to 70k in others. This means I can't guage whether they are likely to match or exceed my existing salary (mid 50s), and won't know until I have gone through the rigmarole of applying.

I'm worried about working for someone I know, but the greater worry is the potential embarassment of applying for the job and being turned down, either because other candidates are better/cheaper, or because my salary expectation is too high in comparison to their budget. Should I risk my dignity and apply anyway? Should I contact her privately and ask her the salary range?

One of my friends applied for a job working for my DH. It was a horrible situation. DH said “your friend’s portfolio is shit but I’m worried if I reject her it’ll affect your friendship. Not to mention what will happen if she gets the job and I have to discipline her or fire her”. Also my friend was contacting DH privately to ask for inside info about the job and how to succeed, saying things like “good job I know the manager, wink wink”. And she was purposely telling me about her financial woes and how she really needed this job. Just all round awkward.

In the end DH had to lie and say he wasn’t in charge of the hiring decision. He interviewed every candidate except her, and he asked someone else to deal with her and make it look like DH wasn’t in charge. Basically to save face for both of us. Afterwards he said she never had a chance, there was no way he could hire her and have a professional relationship with someone he already knows on a personal level.

I'm definitely well qualified and experienced for the job, but my length if experience means I'm at the top of the pay scale with my current central-London employer. The hiring employer is a similar sort of organisation (not commercial) but in outer London, so may expect to pay less. I would happily take a small pay cut, but not a big one. So I'm leaning towards not applying. Difficult though, as its 5 mins from home and I've always been on the look out for a job coming up there.

Isn't it quite common to know the manager recruiting? Lots of people get jobs through their network - acquaintances/friends/former colleagues etc. In certain industries it seems highly likely you would be interviewed by someone you know as the world is quite small.

What exactly do you fear? It's not embarrassing to apply for a job and not get it. The vast majority of candidates applying for the job won't get it, after all.

The salary thing is annoying, I agree. But very common. It often means they haven't actually decided yet and will see what sort of range candidates are looking for.
Yes, you might end up being too expensive. But that's not embarrassing. It just is what it is - don't let that stop you from applying. I have had several conversations with recruiters where I have been too expensive for them.

Don't contact her privately about the salary. In some organisations (like mine) applications are anonymised for the shortlisting process so she may not even know that you have applied unless/until you are offered an interview. They may give you an idea of the salary at interview, if not then if they ask you what your salary expectations are ask for what you would expect to receive at your level and what you would be willing to accept. There is no point in asking for a lower salary in order to get the job if it's not going to be enough for you. If it's really local you will be saving on your commute and time, which could compensate for a slightly lower salary.

I wouldn't worry about knowing the recruiting manager.

Companies that don't state salary ranges are fucking irritating though. They will, without doubt, have a budget in mind but they will mistakenly believe that by not revealing it they will get someone cheaper than they are worth.

I'd say go for it OP as you have nothing to lose. I was in this position where I knew one of the interview panel ... he steered me to focus on what was perceived my weak area in the interview which was really helpful and yes, I did get the job. With regard to salary, cross that bridge when you come to it. Apply first and foremost!

@Paulinna

One of my friends applied for a job working for my DH. It was a horrible situation. DH said “your friend’s portfolio is shit but I’m worried if I reject her it’ll affect your friendship. Not to mention what will happen if she gets the job and I have to discipline her or fire her”. Also my friend was contacting DH privately to ask for inside info about the job and how to succeed, saying things like “good job I know the manager, wink wink”. And she was purposely telling me about her financial woes and how she really needed this job. Just all round awkward.

In the end DH had to lie and say he wasn’t in charge of the hiring decision. He interviewed every candidate except her, and he asked someone else to deal with her and make it look like DH wasn’t in charge. Basically to save face for both of us. Afterwards he said she never had a chance, there was no way he could hire her and have a professional relationship with someone he already knows on a personal level.

That sounds really unprofessional all round really. When he saw the application he should have just flagged it as a conflict of interest, and when she messaged him just said he isn't permitted to talk about it as part of the recruitment policy . Doing essentially a fake interview when her portfolio sucked anyway and then saying she had no chance as it would be awkward for him is out of order.

Go for it Op.

You should apply for the reasons you gave!

@habitbabbit

I'm definitely well qualified and experienced for the job, but my length if experience means I'm at the top of the pay scale with my current central-London employer. The hiring employer is a similar sort of organisation (not commercial) but in outer London, so may expect to pay less. I would happily take a small pay cut, but not a big one. So I'm leaning towards not applying. Difficult though, as its 5 mins from home and I've always been on the look out for a job coming up there.

Don't not apply because they might not be prepared to pay you enough. You don't know what they're prepared to pay, and there's no shame in not getting it because they can't afford you (or because they had cheaper candidates they were happy to settle for).

My guess is that if they look at your current salary and can't match it, they'll probably work out that proximity might mean you'd take a little less (putting "including central London weighting" or something may hint at that, too). You just need to have decided what the minimum is you'd want, so that if they say "we'd like to offer you the job but we can only offer £", you are ready to make a decision (remember to factor in other benefits/pension scheme). And you never know, they might be able to offer more.

As for the issue of knowing the recruitment manager, just keep it professional. If they're worried, they can probably organise not to be too involved in the appointment decision.

You should totally apply, most of my jobs have been through connections, so if you’re confident in your ability that should be a bonus! In fact do the company offer a referral bonus - might be worth checking out as your friend may want to do that!

Also for salary, have you checked on indeed and Glassdoor? Both can give good insights.

Best of luck!

Go for it (and good luck x)

I would ask them to meet for a coffee and say you're interested in applying, do they think you would be a good fit, and raise the salary thing. Say you would need £x to move (whatever you think is fair) and see what she says. I've been in this situation before and I've just said I don't think the role or company is right for them. To be honest I would think it was strange if someone applied for a job with me who I knew and didn't speak to me first to tell me they were looking.