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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

They shouldn't be sharing the name of the Plymouth shooter

67 replies

OverTheRubicon · 14/08/2021 21:41

In most terrorist incidents - and in shooting incidents in the US - the editorial policy has recently been to minimise press coverage of the aggressor, to allow for some background of why they did this and how they accessed weapons, but focus the attention on the grief and loss of the victims and not inspire further violence or adulation of killers.

Yet you can hardly move for coverage of the Plymouth shooter - he's the focus of most of the press and he's already being lauded on incel sites. He's the picture you see on every article, sometimes his mother, not other victims and grief stricken families even when they're names.

Aibu that we should be vastly downplaying him as the centre of this attention?

OP posts:

HunterGatherer · 14/08/2021 21:46

Is he being lauded on incel sites? I heard they were ripping him apart as a loser, for failing to kill more people. That's the level of utter bastards that populate those sites.

Perching · 14/08/2021 21:52

I know what you mean but otoh maybe this ‘movement’ needs a bot of sunlight to bleach it out? My husband wasn’t even aware of it and I consider him quite switched on. He was horrified when I told hom this evening about incels/reddit/red pill/blue pill and I only know about because of the feminist boards in mumsnet.

aiwblam · 14/08/2021 22:00

I think it’s necessary to publish his name/face and for all of us to analyse how something so horrific happened - to prevent it in future. There are several aspects to this:

(Underfunded and understaffed) police failures - his family notified the police that it was dangerous for him to have this gun
(underfunded and understaffed) NHS failures - his family also desperately tried to get mental health help
general life and consequences of not dealing with things like school bullying properly - he was not born waiting to kill people. He felt that life kicked him down, often. In general, bullies in UK schools get away with breaking the bullied kids’ spirits. I don’t know if it was a factor in his decline, but I’d be willing to bet it was.
the incel aspect is shocking - the internet can be a terrible place for people with sick thoughts to find each other. I have no idea how we “police” the internet but there is a desperate need for some regulation

Our society as a whole needs huge and varied improvement. Just writing him off as an evil man is not going to stop the next one doing this.

Badfootkk · 14/08/2021 22:00

I think it is important. He is not a monster.. His family tried to get him help. They were not heard. He was unwell ,unheard and cast aside. He was a person , that didn't ' fit in ' with an illness
He did an awful awful action. I feel destroyed for those , but he was not well.

newnortherner111 · 14/08/2021 22:05

This has had more coverage given it is mid-August than it might have had at some other times of year. It is also in the UK a very rare event, though of course nothing like this would be the ideal.

I agree there are lessons to be learnt to stop any repeat.

Weirdwonders · 14/08/2021 22:11

I actually think we’ve made a mistake in linking this incident so closely with incel ideology to be honest, for precisely the reasons you mention. I’m worried that it’s done more harm than good by overplaying it’s role. I also don’t know why we don’t seem to be assigning more importance to the fact that people have just been required to spend a year indoors with no proper social interaction. It’s going to have had a terrible effect on some people.

Supersimkin2 · 14/08/2021 22:12

An effect of bullying is not serial murder.

That aside, who else thought Not Again when it turns out the police had just let him go. Again. With a cheery smile and a shiny new gun licence.

Is there a single murderer out there who hasn't emailed the police first to tell them they're about to launch a killing/rape/attack/spree? Maybe a few amateurs, but all the big cases now in court come with files of warnings to the police.

Clymene · 14/08/2021 22:20

@Badfootkk

I think it is important. He is not a monster.. His family tried to get him help. They were not heard. He was unwell ,unheard and cast aside. He was a person , that didn't ' fit in ' with an illness He did an awful awful action. I feel destroyed for those , but he was not well.

No, he is a monster. He gunned down a three year old out with her dad.

TheHateIsNotGood · 14/08/2021 22:23

Why shouldn't they? We need to know and undertand the 'why', no matter how uncomfortable it is.

Mental Illness was a factor. The perp's close relatives confirm this and they sought MH assistance just days prior to the 'event'.

These Incels prey on vulnerable young men, and there are so many nowadays - disenfranchised young men - not a new thing, what is new is that they have very few outlets to do their thing;
it's all social media, cosmetic bullshit - too late to be a Sex Pistol or make a band, like Oasis.

"Too much time to think, too little to do....." (The Stranglers)

Splendo · 14/08/2021 22:27

I voted YABU because I think the perpetrator, and the incel community/cult need to be talked about more widely, so that ideological violence and hatred against women can rightly be classified as a hate crime.
While I agree that the focus should be on the victims (but not to the extent of pursuing grieving families for comments), if this is just dismissed as a lone wolf attack by someone with a mental illness then nothing will be done to tackle the online cesspools that radicalise these incels in the first place

aiwblam · 14/08/2021 22:31

Supersimkin2 - so many American school shooters have been bullying victims - it very often happens. I know that bullying doesn’t cause mass killing but since it is so often a contributing factor, it is worth some consideration. This individual felt like society was against him and bullying (and subsequent non-resolution) can be the start of that.

BingoBhango · 14/08/2021 22:37

His name and photo was shared on social media almost immediately after his death. I'm not sure what difference a mainstream media ban would make.

Antwerpen · 14/08/2021 22:40

@Badfootkk

I think it is important. He is not a monster.. His family tried to get him help. They were not heard. He was unwell ,unheard and cast aside. He was a person , that didn't ' fit in ' with an illness He did an awful awful action. I feel destroyed for those , but he was not well.

Apologist nonsense. He really was a monster

BrideofAberdeen · 14/08/2021 22:45

Erm, psychiatrist here. I find it extremely offensive to say that he had mental health problems and that made him kill people.
I agree with the PP who described him as a monster.

Ripasso · 14/08/2021 22:48

YANBU The mass coverage with his photo and even worse showing videos of him can inspire other inadequates to copy. The focus should be on the victims and no publicity given to the murderer.

Blossomtoes · 14/08/2021 22:54

He was a monster as far as I’m concerned. The more publicity this is given, the better. The incel community needs to understand how abhorrent a decent society finds this kind of violence.

RightYesButNo · 14/08/2021 22:56

I agree with you that we should be downplaying him, but this

In most terrorist incidents - and in shooting incidents in the US - the editorial policy has recently been to minimise press coverage of the aggressor

Really? The most recent mass shooting there, this year in Boulder, I decided to just look up in the news to see if this held true. I couldn’t find an article that didn’t name the shooter, even in the NY Times (in case this was supposed to be their editorial policy versus smaller local papers). Some named him in the headline, some had pictures of him before the article even started. So if this is what they claim they be doing, it’s not working.

Bunnycat101 · 14/08/2021 22:57

He was a monster. From the accounts I’ve read (and wished I hadn’t) the way he killed the little girl in cold blood makes him an absolute monster. I have relatives with severe mental health issues who have been sectioned frequently. They were very sick but would have never hurt a child. Yes let’s find out what contributed to this but I firmly believe he was evil - granted he may have been mentally ill as well but I wish the press would stop reporting on him and his vile face.

RaininSummer · 14/08/2021 22:59

He is a monster. Mental health may play a part but as far as I know he had a job, went to the gym and was no more disenfranchised than any other young working class person. One of the biggest issues is why it was thought sensible to allow a person with anger issues, autism and online violent rants to have a gun.

OnceUponAMidnightBeery · 14/08/2021 23:01

@Perching

Likewise, DH had no idea this was even a thing, and was horrified when I tried to explain.

I only know the little I do about it because of MN. I should learn more. I’ve kept away because it makes me so angry, but you’re right, these despicable ideas need exposure.

MrsPsmalls · 14/08/2021 23:04

You sure you're a psychiatrist bride? I have certainly never heard any of my colleagues call a patient a monster.

justasking111 · 14/08/2021 23:13

A very bright searchlight needs to be shone on the incel movement. My OH has no idea what they're about nor my sons.

toocold54 · 14/08/2021 23:13

He was from the area so as he was walking around people were already saying his name saying he had a gun. I think his name was out before the police even got there. He walked casually past a couple of people with the barrel pointing to the ground so they rang and said what they saw.
I went into his FB before the news said what actually happened and there were thousands of comments of people accusing him already.

I think because his name was so wide spread so quickly they had to release his name and then of course now the media is in a race to find out information about him before other media sources.

I also think there is an element of why it happened. So lots of people are doing their own research just to try and find a reason.

BringBackThinEyebrows · 14/08/2021 23:17

Charlie Brooker said similar in an old episode of Newswipe-

I think in this situation there was so much available for the media to use, recent YouTube videos plus loads of online comments, they probably couldn't resist.

AfternoonToffee · 14/08/2021 23:31

Something (many?) has gone terribly wrong to get to this point, it is 'easier' though to just write these people off as bad, evil, monster then to actually reflect as to how society has caused / allowed / enabled this to happen and to take serious steps to try to prevent it. All costs time and money, and when you have services cut to the bone this is the outcome.

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