To mention some water safety issues we all need to know?

[Northernlurker]

Having read of some awful tragedies over the weekend with open water I thought I would start a thread with a few points and others can add. Because not everybody has had the same exposure to open water risks so what is common sense to one person is utterly unknown to others.

Open water in the UK is cold. Really cold. Even on sunny days. The deeper you go, the colder. This can take even fit and well people by surprise.

Don't jump in to unknown water ever. We are a rocky country populated by messy people. Water hides rocks, logs, metal and all manner of hazards.

Piers and jetty lead out from the shore to deep water so boats can be accessed. Don't regard them as an extension of the shore. The water will be both deep and cold.

Swim parallel to the shore, not out to sea.

No inflatables in the sea ever.

Tides move faster than you can walk, know what your exit route is.

If you can't swim, don't go out of your depth. Don't try and help people in trouble. You help just as much by fetching help or fetching items people in the water can hold on to.

Make sure your teenagers know these principles.

And remember 'float to live'

There was a primary school trip today at Bournemouth beach and 2 teachers must have had about 20 7 year olds in the sea! Really surprised me

@Nicknacky

I wonder if that YouTube family are still continuing with their “legal action” which will be extremely inappropriate given the recent deaths.

They should be apologising to the man who highlighted how dangerous it was for their kids to be on paddle boards without buoyancy aids. And they should be telling their cultish followers that they think their behaviour towards him, especially the death threats, was disgusting.

They won’t though. They just don’t care.

We have excellent models for safer outdoor swimming from much of europe and also canada - why on earth can't we follow it

I agree. The OMG IT"S ALL SO DANGEROUS approach is counter-productive - and I say that as an A&E doctor/urgent care GP who has sadly seen many victims of drowning.

We need to instil respectful confidence, not terror. Using the water is like driving: occasionally, accidents occur that are outside anyone's control, no matter how skilled, but most accidents are preventable with the right skills. Teach children skills to empower them to survive - like floating - not a long list of don'ts, which no teenager has ever listened to.

I'm not saying this because I don't take drowning seriously. I have worked in NZ and Australia, so have seen more than my fair share. I am saying it because an overly risk-averse approach doesn't work. Australia is the example to follow. They do have a higher drowning rate that the UK but almost the entire population lives within easy reach of the coast, and almost 100% are in easy reach of a pool, so their rate "should" be way higher than it is. Their drowning rate per hour spent on or near water is way lower than ours. How do they manage that? By teaching kids to enjoy using the water safely. and with confidence. From kindergarten age, kids are in surf club, learning to use the ocean safely, while enjoying it.

@TheFairyCaravan I hadn’t heard of them until this thread then found the vide. I can’t bear to watch their video where they give their version of events.

They should be thanking him and putting a video out applauding him for making them aware.

I have always taught DS a few golden rules passed down from my childhood.
Don't jump or dive into water you can't see the bottom of, if you can't see the bottom, you have no idea what else is under there.
Get used to the water slowly, wade in and dip down a few times to get a feel for the cold, don't go beyond waist depth until you no longer gasp when you do.
If you get caught in a rip or get pulled out of your depth, don't fight it, you will get knackered very quickly, float on your back, if just out of your comfortable depth just kick back towards the shore until you can touch the bottom, if its a rip, I will be watching you like a hawk and someone will be coming to get you asap, just keep floating and shouting if you can.
Personally, I usually only allow DS in the sea if the tide is coming in and I prefer small bays or really shallow shelving beaches with lifeguards and make him swim between the flags. I also make him wear really bright swim stuff to make him easier to spot in an emergency.

@Nicknacky

I don’t know about other posters, but I have noticed a definite craze, for want of a better term, for people I know doing cold water swimming. More and more people entering water and being caught unawares.

Cold water and open water swimming is a hugely beneficial activity - great for physical and mental health and can really help with water safety. The more used you are to cold water, the less your body reacts by going into shock. When I first started swimming in our nearby lake i couldn't breathe, and struggled to swim 50m. I now regularly do over 1km, 4 months later. However. And this is an enormous however. People need to be encouraged to do this is managed facilities. So my lake has lifeguards. We must wear tow floats and bright coloured hats. They ask you to use a buddy system when you first go out. They regularly run safe open water techniques. We should be encouraging more people, especially children, to take part in these lessons rather than just swimming in heated indoor pools.

Sockbogies that’s an interesting point about approaching anyone struggling from behind to avoid them grabbing you. I’ve swim in very cold lochs in Scotland for pretty long distances for years including Loch Lomond on icy New Years days. I’m a very strong swimmer, but today when I read the facts about the family that died, I wondered what the best way was to try and save someone without risking your own life if they are panicking.

[quote Seadragonusgiganticusmaximus]Talking about horror safety films, this one, “Lonely Water”, is not for the faint hearted:

[/quote] Wow! That just scared the shit out of me.

@Alannawhorideslikeaman That is wise words and I think it looks like an incredible pastime but it’s not what I’m seeing on my social media. It’s people jumping off harbour walls etc.

So sad to hear on the news today that none of the people who lost their lives at Loch Lomond were able to swim.

If you can’t swim, please just stick to paddling along the shore. Even if you are a strong swimmer in a pool, at this time of year most UK waters are still very cold and can cause shock and undercurrents would challenge the best of swimmers.

Another thing to add, don't try putting an AED (defib) kit onto a wet person, you will be in for a bad time!

That is a myth. You can defib someone who is wet perfectly safely, as long as you give their chest area a quick wipe and as long as you keep well back when the AED delivers the shock - as you should always do, of course.

Wear proper life vests and not bouyancy vests. The former are designed to keep a head from slumping forward and drowning if the person falls unconscious for any reason. There was a terrible boating/kayaking accident where children died on a loch in Scotland due to this. The water was cold and I think that the children developed hyperthermia and slumped forwards.

Always ensure that a small child has leg straps under their life jacket to prevent it from riding over their head. Unfortunately I witnessed a toddler on a boat today where the dad hadn't bothered to do the leg straps up. Also, always wear a life vest when SUP/inflatable kayak etc and follow the harbour rules. Last year, unfortunately my friend tried and failed to save a man's life when he fell off his SUP and then got tangled in the boat's anchor lines. The tide was moving out quickly which then pulled him out under the boat. This was in Rock in close proximity to the life station and boat hire place.

I live on the coast, South Wales. We have fast moving tides. They can literally come in within minutes. So I second being aware of tide times.

Don't jump of rocks or cliffs in to the sea, you don't know what's underneath and sometimes there are undercurrents and they will drag you down and under.

Never use inflatables in the sea.

If you are not a confident swimmer never go up further than your upper thighs or knees. If you are chest deep and a wave hits you may find yourself swept under and out to a depth you can't cope in.

The amount of times I have had to swim out to children trapped under inflatables isn't worth it. I will drag your child out of the water but I'm not saving your inflatable doughnut! So don't give me agro about it.

FLOAT TO LIVE.

Never swim in reservoirs, never swim in open water. Cold Water shock is real and it's crippling. There is a reason we do open water triathlons in wet suits.

If you do go out paddle boarding please have a tag in the board with your name and phone number. The RNLI spend way too much time looking for people who are safe, but have lost their boards after falling off. They do not stand down until they find the person or they are reported safe.

@Wantingtogetitright, no my dad was one of the people volunteered to go looking for missing child. Sorry, English isn't my first language, I wasn't very clear.

@WiddlinDiddlin because MN is different to the population that is the general public
The general public (speaking as a mass) are generally not loaded with common sense and are (sorry) not the brightest
If I say in a decade of 999 calls, I hadn't had ONE person that had thought to put water on a burn. People will stand there and watch blood spurt out. They don't know what motorway they're on. This isn't panic, I do a job now where I ask people for their address and about 50% of people struggle with that question

So a lake will be "ooh that's a lake" about a reservoir. No alcohol before swimming will be "well I only had a few". Trespassing "well it doesn't really matter, it's hot"
Add to that bravado and teenage brains and it's just a general shit storm
How long has covid been here and people still don't know a mask goes over your nose? 🤷🏽‍♀️

Excellent thread OP.

It's been on my mind a great deal this week for personal reasons.

I'm in Scotland but linked back to the borders. The river tweed has claimed many, many lives and has been in the news a great deal the last few weeks thanks to one mum. She tragically lost two of her sons, many years apart to the same river. She asked the council for permission to have life rings installed along the river bank. Permission had been refused on the basis that it "was not aesthetically in keeping" with the area. She started a petition and they have backtracked.

The river runs right through all the local towns and villages to Kelso. It looks so tranquil and is, sadly, deadly. It has steps and horrific currents. I can't bare to think about how many have lost their life's to it.

As many have said you should urge caution against following someone in unless a strong swimmer and as she has stated in her campaign many could easily throw a ring to someone without putting further life's at risk.

@User5827372728

There was a primary school trip today at Bournemouth beach and 2 teachers must have had about 20 7 year olds in the sea! Really surprised me

Unlikely a primary school as dorset schools are closed now, could it have been a swim school? Not saying I think it's a good idea but doesn't sound right.

never swim in open water

Come off it. Let's all sit on our arses and die of obesity and diabetes, then.

50% of UK drownings are people who never meant to enter the water, e.g they have fallen in.

33% of drownings are related to alcohol use.

Obviously these two groups overlap but, even allowing for that, most people who drown are not intentionally swimming. The number of sober people in the UK who drown while intentionally swimming for exercise is very small.

Open water swimming, done sensibly, is fantastic for exercise and mental health. Like many sports - cycling, riding, rugby etc - it carries a small element of risk. That risk can be reduced but not eliminated. That doesn't mean we should stop swimming.

Great thread, just wish more people would listen.

It’s not just open water that can be unsafe - indoor pools can be risky too, especially if you’re at a new place and unfamiliar with the pool. When I was 9 I almost drowned in a swimming pool. A friend’s parents had taken several of us, I was a strong swimmer and used to swimming lengths all the way down to the deep end. I didn’t know this particular pool had a wave machine. I was out of my depth when the waves started. They were washing over my head and I couldn’t swim because I was gasping for breath. Luckily a stranger noticed and lifted me out of the water. Friend’s parents hadn’t even noticed.

@WiddlinDiddlin Thankyou, very sensible post. There's some excellent advice on this thread but there's also a really unhelpful undertone of hysteria. The driving analogy made by a previous poster is a very good one.

We are so lucky in the UK to have so much wonderful coast, so many rivers and lakes to enjoy. People absolutely need to be educated on safe swimming - and again there has been some brilliant advice here - but it's so unhelpful to talk about never letting DC swim here or there. Learn how to do it safely yourself, then teach them so that when they're not with you, they are capable.

@MissLucyEyelesbarrow I certainly don't want to put off people taking part in open water swimming, but they tend to be adults who do it as part of an organised group with all the accompanying risk assessments. The idea of random people chucking themselves into deep cold water without any back up is against all the open water swimming rules, I hope ?

My son age 10 has never had swimming lessons in school.

I think that is shocking. His school are raising generations of children who cannot swim.