Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder why there are NO legal aid divorce lawyers in London?

122 replies

KhalliWhalli · 22/07/2021 22:01

Just to add, this isn’t for me, I got divorced in 1998 and had my choice of lawyers in London, prepared to take on my case. This was in spite of the fact that I was a Legal Aid case as I had just given birth and was on Mat Leave, so no spare cash.

Fast forward to now, I am trying to help a friend with a legal problem in relation to her ex and her children. She is on benefits as she is a full-time carer for one of their children.

Between us, we called as many solicitors offices as we could. We were told that the Legal Aid rules mean that she is restricted to solicitors in her geographical area, but... none of them take on Legal Aid cases.

We tried calling the Law Society, but they have suspended their public helpline.

So is it really the case that there are no Legal Aid solicitors who take on divorce cases anymore? If so, what are women in awful marriages supposed to do? Stay married because they can’t afford to get divorced?

OP posts:
knittingaddict · 23/07/2021 08:05

And to echo others, do not take the children to another country to visit the father who is threatening to abduct them. Confused

DamnUserName21 · 23/07/2021 08:07

Agree with PPs--it's mad that she is taking DC to visit when he is threatening abduction.

If she wants DC to visit their father, he needs to come to the UK. It would be safer...

I've been piss-poor on benefits bit if I was desperate for a divorce, I'd take out a credit card and self-file. Can she do this?

Ifailed · 23/07/2021 08:14

As she is in London, has she tried Cambridge House on the Walworth Road?

ch1889.org/

Terhou · 23/07/2021 08:18

[quote KhalliWhalli]@DelilahDingleberry She is taking the DC to visit him, but wants it in writing that she can bring the DC back to the U.K. I thought she could get a solicitor to write something, but they have quoted thousands of pounds to do so.[/quote]
Highly unlikely that the courts abroad would pay any attention to something written by English solicitors. Your friend really shouldn't risk this.

ChainJane · 23/07/2021 08:21

[quote KhalliWhalli]@DelilahDingleberry She is taking the DC to visit him, but wants it in writing that she can bring the DC back to the U.K. I thought she could get a solicitor to write something, but they have quoted thousands of pounds to do so.[/quote]
She can afford to take the children overseas to visit their father but only has enough money to pay the usual bills and food costs from her benefit payments?

In her situation I would tell the father that if he wants her to bring the children to him, he can pay for a solicitor in the UK to draw up the legal agreement she wants first.

Terhou · 23/07/2021 08:24

It also used to be the case that if you were a man, and your wife could get legal aid, you were completely fucked in a legal dispute, because legal aid lawyers had an unlimited budget with which to fight you. They could just keep going until you ran out of funds. (Read this on a divorce lawyer web site once.)

That website was nonsense. It's never been the case that legal aid lawyers have unlimited funds. The pay rates are pathetic and have not been raised in several years, and limitations are placed on solicitors both in terms of costs caps and how much legal aid will cover. If they need to go beyond a cost cap or other limitation on the certificate, solicitors have to justify it by reference to considerations such as chance of success and whether it is an expense that a litigant with moderate funds would want to incur. At the end of the case, they have to produce a very detailed bill and effectively justify every penny.

Nowadays, solicitors only tend to do legal aid work in civil cases out of a sense of duty and if they have a reasonable source of income from charity/grant funding and/or private work to enable them to keep the practice running.

NoIDontWatchLoveIsland · 23/07/2021 08:30

Your friend needs to just not take them to visit him.done

Pinkdelight3 · 23/07/2021 08:31

She is taking the DC to visit him, but wants it in writing that she can bring the DC back to the U.K. I thought she could get a solicitor to write something, but they have quoted thousands of pounds to do so.

Just don't take the kids to visit him then the problem won't arise. It's no good doing the foolish thing then expecting £££ from someone else to sort it out. There are dreadful things about this country, but the situation you describe with legal aid in this case isn't the issue.

ButYouGottaHaveASkillJeff · 23/07/2021 08:37

If he is that way inclined to abduct the kids a letter isn't going to have that much clout.

Tistheseason17 · 23/07/2021 08:43

So shr can afford to take the children and herself abroad to meet him but she can't afford a divorce?

ssd · 23/07/2021 08:44

@Tistheseason17

So shr can afford to take the children and herself abroad to meet him but she can't afford a divorce?
My thoughts exactly
ssd · 23/07/2021 08:45

I'm totally against cuts to valuable free legal services, but they aren't there to cover stupidity

Ozanj · 23/07/2021 08:50

Though legal aid isn’t available some may do international custody cases pro bono. Contact Law Works for advice, they are a legal charity that can put you in touch.

Essentialironingwater · 23/07/2021 08:53

In this situation I think the only sensible thing is to refuse to travel with them. If he wants contact he should come to the UK, and she should lock up the children's passports elsewhere. In light of his threats she really shouldn't be entertaining this!

SisterBeaverhausen · 23/07/2021 08:53

Tell your friend to fill out an EX160 form (help with fees) she may be eligible for complete or part exemption. Tell her to file for divorce (Citizens Advice Bureau will help her complete the forms and won't charge) she can then file everything at her local court.
Under no circumstances is she to take the children abroad if she is concerned they won't come home. He can come to the UK to visit.

MichelleScarn · 23/07/2021 09:00

@Pinkdelight3

She is taking the DC to visit him, but wants it in writing that she can bring the DC back to the U.K. I thought she could get a solicitor to write something, but they have quoted thousands of pounds to do so.

Just don't take the kids to visit him then the problem won't arise. It's no good doing the foolish thing then expecting £££ from someone else to sort it out. There are dreadful things about this country, but the situation you describe with legal aid in this case isn't the issue.

Agree, who's paying for the flights? Where are they all staying and which country is it?
Nearlythere21 · 23/07/2021 11:27

@Terhou it was the case 10 plus years ago that men struggled in divorce proceedings as they were typically working and didn't qualify for legal aid in the same numbers that women did (to some extent my sympathy is limited by the fact that arises from patriarchy) so men were at a disadvantage, often representing themselves - as both men and women do now. The difference is though that there isn't a huge scale problem of domestic abuse against men.

irresistibleoverwhelm · 23/07/2021 12:34

Surely that differential was there to reflect the fact that a lot of women who weren’t working didn’t have any access to money? In that case it was an attempt to address a significant disadvantage to women, not to create one at the expense of men.

It’s not long ago that it was routine for a lot of/most women with children not to be working at all and to have great difficulty getting back into the job market.

knittingaddict · 23/07/2021 12:53

Exactly. My daughter left the marital home with the grand total of £10 in a pre paid account. She needed protection for herself and her children. No child benefit because her ex claimed it and didn't tell her, despite him earning over the threshold for recieving it. He therefore deprived her of national insurance years towards her pension too.

The ops' situation seems self inflicted to some degree. They do have options as suggested by others on here.

Nearlythere21 · 23/07/2021 13:07

That is why it was there but the reality was that a lot of men still couldn't agree the legal fees for court proceedings and represented themselves - and were at a disadvantage. The average income doesn't stretch that far.

Hereward1332 · 23/07/2021 14:28

If she insists on taking the children abroad, she would need a legal agreement in that country confirming return of children. The divorce is a red herrring.

igelkott2021 · 23/07/2021 14:36

Agree with everyone else. Do not take the kids overseas.

And also echo the people wondering how she can't afford a divorce but can afford travel costs unless no-yet-and-not-very-dear-H is paying.

Ohsugarhoneyicetea · 23/07/2021 14:43

If he took the kids illegally she would be entitled to legal aid but for goodness sake don't assist him to do this by bringing them to him!! If its not a Hague Convention country she may never see them again. Some information here for her: rightsofwomen.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Children-and-the-law-child-abduction-DIGITAL.pdf

Original poster
KhalliWhalli · 23/07/2021 14:49

It’s a bit of a grey area, as the DC are citizens of the DH’s country and they’ve lived there longer than they have lived in the U.K. If she doesn’t take them, he could probably accuse HER of abduction.

OP posts:
MrsTerryPratchett · 23/07/2021 14:52

Where are you normally resident? Did she takes them away from his country without permission? Is it a Hague Convention country?

These are fairly easy questions to answer.