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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Developer Wanting to Put Temporary Fencing on Our Land

50 replies

itsnotmeitsu · 22/07/2021 21:19

We border onto a school/playing field which is having around 150 properties being built on it. We were informed recently that the developer wants a party wall agreement with us, as the block of apartments due to be built alongside our boundary requires laying drainage, etc, under our land, and deeper than our foundations. The party wall agreement offers several options. We've taken the option of having the surveyors acting for the council (the owner of that land) also acting for us. Today we had a visit from a surveyor to document the inside and outside of our property on that boundary line, as any damage due to the works carried out will have to be put right by them.

We already knew that the original school fencing would be removed - inconvenient for us (animals, etc) but perfectly reasonable - the fence belonged to the school, and thus the council. But what we found out today was that the developers want to remove the current fence and then put up a temporary plastic fence on our land to carry out these works. That part of our boundary is only about eight feet from that side of our house. It's one storey and has four bedroom windows and a bathroom on that side. I think (hope) the joint surveyor is going to say that's not reasonable.

OP posts:

Herhereherhere · 23/07/2021 07:07

As a minimum, they should be paying you rent for erecting the temporary fence on your land of it goes ahead. We made a few thousand by agreeing to have scaffolding on our land. You really want an independent surveyor here - not theirs. Was this listed as an option? If so, why didn’t you take it? If not, you know they are already misinforming you so you need to be really careful dealing with their surveyor.

lannistunut · 23/07/2021 07:08

@Herhereherhere

Agree with this!

ivykaty44 · 23/07/2021 07:13

itsnotmeitsu Can you imagine getting divorced and using your spouses solicitor for free, they are being paid by the other party so they are going to keep them happy and you’ll have to lump it

Eskarina1 · 23/07/2021 07:14

We had to pay for an independent surveyor for our neighbours when she signed a party wall agreement (we get on very well but she's had major building issues in the past and wanted reassurance). She chose the surveyor

eurochick · 23/07/2021 07:16

It sounds like they are trying to do you up like a kipper. Be very careful to protect your interests.

ChardonnaysPetDragon · 23/07/2021 07:21

If there ever was a time to make a nuisance out of yourself, now it is.

Developers are greedy bastards and will make everything they can to stuff you and the council aren't much better.

Don't sign a thing until you have your own surveyor agree with it. They have to pay for it, but even if they don't it's money well spent to protect your interests.

FixTheBone · 23/07/2021 07:23

They're taking the piss, and, I think (because they misled you initially) you've ended up in a poor situation using their surveyor.

You need to get your own surveyor and you absolutely must get a solicitor specialising in property law onto this immediately, at their cost so that you can work out the purpose of the work and who it benefits. If it's purely drainage for their properties, I'd be minded to tell them to stick it. If it's to prevent surface run-off onto yours, it may be worth considering.

You need an expert to tell you what the future implications of this work are for your property, and to draw up the appropriate covenants as to who will be responsible if for example further works need to be done on the property in the future.

Finally, you need to enforce a reasonable recompense for the damage and inconvenience - legally binding that they restore everything after the work, and pay for the inconvenience of not being able to use your garden with penalties for overrunning.

If they argue, just say no. full stop. The only reason they'll be going onto your land is so that they can cram houses right to the edge of the boundary. If you say no, they'll probably just have to can a few houses or find an alternate (presumably more expensive way) to sort stuff.

LakieLady · 23/07/2021 07:25

I'd be very unhappy about them laying drains etc deeper than my foundations on my land, tbh. Are the drains themselves going to be as close as 8' from your house?

I'd definitely be insisting that they pay for your own independent surveyor, and for proper fencing, not that plastic stuff. If your animals include dogs, you can't run the risk of them getting out. Ask for details, with images, as they may just be proposing to use this stuff
premierbarriers.co.uk/?gclid=CjwKCAjwruSHBhAtEiwA_qCppt2HAjtG4PBma50Axw97bZZVf3vCQs_-uxauouYFKxyld9yCf5j6FxoCGMAQAvD_BwE, which will be no use at all.

This sounds like you're being railroaded to me. I wonder if asking on a site like Gardenlaw might get you some good advice as to what would be reasonable.

Seeing a solicitor just for advice doesn't mean going to court, it would just mean that you have a clear idea of your rights and what is reasonable, and would be money well spent. If your house insurance includes legal cover, you may be able to get the fees paid by your insurers.

And remember that the developers will be making a huge amount of money from 150 properties. They can easily afford proper fences. Don't let them fob you off. And make sure that any agreement you enter into includes restoring your garden to at least how it is now.

This must be such a worry.

sandgrown · 23/07/2021 07:26

Sounds dodgy OP . Get independent advice. On a different note . I hate to see school playing fields sold off and then constant complaints about the number of obese young children.

Socksey · 23/07/2021 07:28

@eurochick

It sounds like they are trying to do you up like a kipper. Be very careful to protect your interests.

This... also speak to your mortgage lender as this could affect your property value and they will be all over that one...

Crockof · 23/07/2021 07:40

What happens if you just refuse access to your garden?

Stop worrying about having to mention any issues regarding the dispute when you sell, the work proposed could end up taking more off the value of your house than you standing up for your rights

titsintiers · 23/07/2021 08:00

If I were you I'd contact RICS which is the professional body representing surveyors. You can get a free 30 minute independent consultation

Developer Wanting to Put Temporary Fencing on Our Land

TwoLeftSocksWithHoles · 23/07/2021 08:08

I feel that whilst they have offered three options this doesn't mean they can only be three option. I suspect that there are more including your right to have your own surveyor at their cost, and possibly to be able to refuse it completely and then they would have to work within their boundaries.

(I am not a lawyer or a surveyor or an astronaut)

TedGlenn · 23/07/2021 08:10

This meant we were given notice of what was planned and had three options

You say three options but only list two. Was the third option to appoint your own surveyor at the developer's cost? That was the option you should have gone with. Its not too late to rectify this.

Gh0stontoast · 23/07/2021 08:23

Check the plans on your local council’s planning portal to see if there is any info on the proposed drainage.

mustlovegin · 23/07/2021 08:32

I agree, get some independent legal advice, as I imagine the developers would also not be interested in getting involved in a dispute. They would have to disclose it and they will have to flip their stock too (sooner rather than later?)

I'm not a legal expert, but from your post, it seems as if they are trying it on

LannieDuck · 23/07/2021 09:14

Why does the temporary fencing need to be on your land? Why can't it be on the boundary line?

endofthelinefinally · 23/07/2021 09:19

I agree with pp that the developers want to build right up to the boundary. Refuse permission for them to set foot on your land. If you don't do this they will be climbing all over your property.

endofthelinefinally · 23/07/2021 09:34

The party wall rules cover any building or digging within a distance of several meters of your boundary, so they really are misleading you.
I could tell you some horror stories about developers and planning departments. Trust neither.

SilverDragonfly1 · 23/07/2021 09:50

Not a q specifically for the OP, but isn't refusing all of that an option? No to the utilities and everything? It seems wrong that a company can just say 'right, we're going to be digging up your garden so we'll need a party wall agreement'.

lannistunut · 23/07/2021 11:29

You can;t just refuse, or people's houses would fall down if their neighbour wouldn;t allow works.

endofthelinefinally · 23/07/2021 11:34

Access for essential repairs is a completely different thing from access for development.
Even access for essential repairs can be refused initially and has to be pursued by both party's insurers. I have personal experience of this when a neighbour's tree roots broke the shared underground pipes and our house was subsiding. The neighbour wouldn't allow access and our insurers had to take legal action.

Crockof · 23/07/2021 11:59

@lannistunut

You can;t just refuse, or people's houses would fall down if their neighbour wouldn;t allow works.

But this is different, why should they be allowed to dig up land belonging to someone else. There should at least be financial recompense.

Original poster

itsnotmeitsu · 23/07/2021 20:20

I think I've probably not represented the situation fairly in my original post. It was the council appointed surveyor that got in touch with us. @endofthelinefinally > I've done my Google research. I know everything about everything, thanks to Google . @FoolsAssassin > Yes, you're right; if we'd just consented the 'Party Wall' agreement wouldn't come into play. We chose to disagree with part of what was happening, which meant we had the option to have the surveyor equally operating for us and them. This is at no cost to us, and the surveyor is impartial. He was here for over one-and-a-half hours yesterday, measuring and photographing from our side of the boundary. Any new damage to our property will be the responsibility of the developers.

The surveyor mentioned that the developers want to put the temporary fencing 2 metres back onto our property to carry out the drainage works for new builds. He viewed our property, so now knows that not feasible. That's the first (and probably the last) time I've laughed about all this development going up around us. That boundary is about seven feet from three of our bedrooms and a bathroom (one-storey building). So good luck with carrying out your development from within our bedrooms and bathrooms. Am I supposed to supply mugs of tea as well ?

OP posts:

Original poster

itsnotmeitsu · 23/07/2021 20:32

@FixTheBone > "The only reason they'll be going onto your land is so that they can cram houses right to the edge of the boundary. If you say no, they'll probably just have to can a few houses or find an alternate (presumably more expensive way) to sort stuff."

Absolutely agree with this, because this is what's happening on this site. I really hope it turns out they'll give up on this particular block of apartments [boxes], so we'll still have access to light on that side of the house, which is our longest wall.

OP posts:

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