To think Sunflower Lanyards have been hijacked

[Sharkology]

By those who just don't want to wear a mask in some cases rather than those who actually cannot wear a mask?

Fourth Avanti train trip this week, had three train journeys with them a couple of weeks back - either they have a bloody awesome EDI hiring policy, in which case it should be published as national pride, or some of their staff are taking the piss.

I've seen two members of staff out of around 50 actually wearing a face covering.

It absolutely devalues the sunflower lanyards for those who really need to use them. It's such a shame for all with hidden disabilities.

@Whammyyammy

Saw two young women having a cigarette in a queue to Sainsburys yesterday, advent bother me, but a few people moaned at them about the smell.

They then proceeded to get sunflower lanyards out and walk in! So ok to smoke, but have difficulty breathing.

I'll be glad if they announce the binning of the stupid things.

A hidden disability doesn't just mean difficulty with breathing. It can be all manner of things.

How do you know what's going on in the lives of other people? Just because people look okay doesn't mean they are. Hidden disability - the clue is in the title.

I can't believe how many judgmental people there are on this thread.

I have a sunflower lanyard, purchased from the Hidden Disability website around 2018 for use at work. I have multiple 'hidden' disabilities, all covered under the Equalities Act. I tried to wear a mask at the beginning of the pandemic, but ended up with a black eye, bruised forehead and multiple bruises to my arms and legs. Wearing a mask affects my balance and spatial awareness (as well as increase anxiety which is a co-morb. of my diagnosed autism).

Whilst there may be people taking advantage of the lanyards, a) who am I to judge (I wouldn't and don't) and b) the more people who wear them takes the heat of me because I have been challenged by middle aged men who think it's their mission to tell a lone woman to put a mask on. The irony is, I never get these comments when I'm out with DH, only when I'm alone.

I just tell them to fuck off and mind their own business.

I do have a hidden disability by the way just in case people are feeling like I don't know what one is....

But I have always had a crap time at work when I have to explain it... I do wear a mask and don't have sunflower lanyard but do fly with a letter to get me onboard free seating planes as I need to be near an air hostess incase the shit hits the fan.

I do have a hidden disability by the way just in case people are feeling like I don't know what one is...

Then why are you so doubtful that other people might have hidden disabilities too?

Lots of people only have to announce their hidden disabilities now because of mask-wearing (and the licence people seem to feel they have now to pry into others' business) so it's obvious why more people are being open about their previously hidden disabilities at the moment.

I don't understand why you're so resistant to accept that other people might also have similarly hidden disabilities if you've been on the receiving end of disablist crap from people who can't appreciate that everyone's different.

Most people don't actually have a hidden disability though. I know Mumsnet makes it seem like everyone and their mother has one.

@Tightwad2020

The irony is the majority of people who have a genuine hidden disability (diabetes, COPD etc)

Sorry if this is a derail, but how does diabetes constitute a hidden disability? I'm aware that diabetes can (if very poorly controlled) have people pass out with hypoglycaemia, or even have a fit - both rather visible; that neuropathy and retinal degeneration can create mobility and sight problems - again, more obvious than not. So a potentially disabling condition - but how is it a hidden disability requiring signalling to others so that the person affected can be given due consideration?

My mother has diabetes, so any information on additional help that she might need in daily life would be welcome. She doesn't wear a lanyard - should she? (She would not, of course, forgo a mask, because she is very aware of the additional risks that age and diabetes pose her in the event of infection with Covid.)

It's not only people with "very poorly controlled" diabetes who are at risk of severe hypoglycaemia. Some people with diabetes, particularly type one or other insulin dependent diabetes, might choose to wear identification so they aren't assumed to be drunk if stumbling/disorientated etc. They may not want to be challenged for eating, checking their blood glucose or injecting in public. They may need to sit and rest while their blood glucose returns to normal. They may want to be able to request details on the carbohydrate content of foods (so they can adjust their insulin dose) without the "omg fussy" eye roll that can accompany this request. They might need to take their mask off if hypo (to ingest glucose and because of the physical symptoms of a hypo). They are also considered disabled to ensure they have the rights they need to avoid discrimination, to be allowed time off for medical appointments and to have accommodations to ensure they have the opportunity to manage their condition during their school or working day (which may include access to their phone if they use it to monitor their glucose).

The only time my son has worn a sunflower lanyard is going through security at airports where he has encountered multiple problems due to using an insulin pump and the fact that some of the devices he uses and their spare parts can't pass through certain types of scanners.

One time my son ran out of glucose on the public bus home (I think an asymptomatic stomach complaint may have been affecting his carbohydrate absorption so he had run through the huge amount of supplies). He had a severe hypo but was able to get off the bus and into a local cafe where he grabbed a sugary drink from the fridge and drank it while queuing to pay. Fortunately all was ok but something like a sunflower lanyard would have helped if he had been challenged or if he hadn't been able to get to the cafe.

My understanding of the lanyard is not that you just have a hidden disability but also you would like support/help - you wear it so shop assistants/airports approach you to offer help or are aware you may need more support when they interact with you. Not just to flag up you have eg asthma, coeliac etc. or that you have a genuine medical reason for not wearing a face mask. There are medic alert bracelets for medical needs. By people wearing it otherwise you are no longer likely to get people offering support when you wear one which rather undermines the whole point.

This explains it.

@igelkott2021 I'm not unhealthy because I'm on the shielding list, I just have a blood disorder I developed randomly. Nothing wrong with my heart or lungs or blood pressure and I'm not dying imminently!

Those who have genuine reasons for never wearing a face covering get grief or stares or unpleasantness because of those who to put it bluntly are lying. There is also a difference between situations and places where they are worn, and also how long someone can wear them without removing them.

Incidentally, one of the first group to call for the retention of face coverings (which I agree with at least for public transport and in hospitals/surgeries) was one of the trade unions for rail staff.

I'm autistic and already had the lanyard. But stopped wearing it during the pandemic because of hostility towards others. I wear a mask but had the lanyard for other reasons. I saw a lady with downs syndrome being told off by the lady I the post office for wearing a mask and a lanyard at the same time

Wearing a mask affects my balance and spatial awareness (as well as increase anxiety which is a co-morb. of my diagnosed autism).

Feel free to tell me to bog off @Clarice99 but do you know why mask wearing impacts your balance / spatial awareness? Is it related to sensory (vestibular) issues related to ASD or something else?

We’ve noticed some unlikely things impact DT2 in a similar way and I’m just trying to get my head round it. More complicated in his case as he has a visual impairment we don’t fully understand yet and I thought it could be related to that but wonder if it’s something else.

@SinkGirl

I definitely wouldn't tell you to bog off

I have hearing loss (from childhood) and associated vestibular disorder. My ASD was diagnosed later in life, as is often the case with women.

My balance has always been 'off' and having hearing loss/vestibular disorder and ASD, it's hard to pinpoint the cause.

Pre mask wearing, I could never cover my face, with a scarf for example, as it made me not be able to walk properly without veering off, bumping into things etc.

There are specific tests for vestibular disorder and there's vestibular therapy. I suppose the availability of that would depend on where you live though.

Thanks @Clarice99 - I will bear this in mind as he becomes more able to interact with testing and therapies etc :) he’s a complex little monkey!

I overheard this conversation on bus last week:
Older woman with mask to student without
'You need to put your mask on'
Student without
"I've got one of these" and twiddles lanyard.
Older woman
"Where did you get that from?"
Student
"Just go into Morrison's and ask for one"
Older woman
"Ooh, I'll have to do that cos I get fed up trying to remember to put one on".

OP, you're totally correct.

It's very bizarre.

I wonder whether most of these people know they are for autism etc.

I wonder if someone said if you wear one of these sunflower lanyards people don't ask you to wear a mask?

I've seen it a few times.

One family I know use the youngest lanyard she got at airport due to an medical condition for their eldest because she doesn't want to wear a mask.

Youngest is under 11. Neither have SN.

My ds is autistic and he wears a lanyard but he also tries to wear a face mask if needed but usually lasts 5 minutes max.

@azimuth299

I think that we've probably got a lot of people with hidden disabilities who before the pandemic didn't need any public accommodations, so they were able to go about in public under the radar. Now that something else is being asked of them they are unable to comply so have now needed to 'out' themselves and so many more are visible.

When masks are no longer required their lanyards won't need to be used anymore, and a much smaller set of people will be wearing them.

It would be beyond ridiculous to have to ask these people to prove their disability (you want disabled people to have to pay for a GP letter?), and to have to make the sunflower lanyard charity responsible for verifying people's disabilities (think of how much extra infrastructure and the expense of hiring and training people with the ability to make medical decisions).

You are always going to have twats trying to game the system but that doesn't mean that we should put extra burdens on the most vulnerable people. Just believe people with a lanyard.

You said everything that needed to be said clearly and eloquently. Excellent post.

. I always thought they were an arse but this just cemented it

Well the arse i know who thinks everyone should wear a mask no matter what , has an ex wife who had to flee to a Refuge. Coercively controlling abusers are loving it.

places can still enforce them if they wish

Well maybe vaccination rates will slow some more if people see nothing changing

inews.co.uk/news/health/covid-vaccine-uk-how-many-people-vaccinated-rate-jab-my-area-second-dose-1088705?utm_term=Autofeed&ito=social_itw_theipaper&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1625645926

You can be exempt from the mask in France if you have a medical certificate signed by a GP saying that you're unable to wear the mask for medical reasons. However in practice there are a lot of problems because staff have no training and awareness of hidden disabilities in France. The sunflower lanyard scheme isn't recognized anywhere in France. Many people have been kicked out of shops despite their medical certificate or have had to wait 30 minutes and longer before they accept their medical certificate and let them in!

Yes I said from the start it would devalue the lanyard and stop people getting g help, staff no longer offer help when they see it just junk it's about not wearing a mask. The problem is the organisation who supply them didn't care, money for them, and I expect they thought at best it would raise awareness which of course it did... but people think they are for masks now.

My DH has a sunflower lanyard due to a brain injury. He only really wears it in busy public places like public transport/airports because he can become overwhelmed with everything that's going on, bright lights or noise. It makes it easier for him to ask for help if he needs it. There is nothing visible that would suggest he had a disability. He still wears a mask, however! It does wind me up how utterly self-absorbed some people are to abuse this! Shame that the lanyard scheme is being so poorly managed. He wears his brain injury ID card clipped on his.

I'm actually surprised at the number of people who would rather be though of as disabled by others rather than simply wear a mask (that may prevent you catching something and prevent you spreading it to others).
Particularly as it is a hidden disability which in this context which would generally be synonymous with a mental or development disability (I apologize if this is not the currently accepted terminology - no offence is intended). Especially as many of these people (from what I've seen) would be the ones likely to have been picking on the 'different' kid at school or using disabled slurs/names on others in the past.

Either we have a disproportionately ill or disabled population in this country or we have a hell of a lot of arseholes, and I think it is most likely the latter. I'm sure the vast majority would suddenly find themselves able to wear one if they had to jump through hoops to prove inability like in other countries mentioned by other posters
It is still amazing though the number even within this thread that say "I'm excempt but I still wear one". If you can wear one then you are not excempt! There are vanishingly few real conditions that will make you unable to at all.
If they were handing out gas masks because we were at war and the bombs were falling I'm pretty sure lots of new lanyard wearers would be looking to see if their prized lanyard would now let them jump the queue to get their gas masks faster... Though seeing how selfish and plain stupid parts of the population have been the past year I think Hodges would have his work cut out telling people "put that light out"

But yes OP you are right, they have massively devalued the meaning of the lanyards and rendered them virtually useless for their original/primary purpose.
They really are just an I done have to wear a mask lanyard now.
I think you should tweet Avanti (and the RMT & TSSA unions being that the unions are vocal on masking etc for protecting staff at this time) congratulating the on their EDI hiring policy - EDI is a fashionable thing in the industry, along with the trans agenda but that's a different battle.