Aibu to think this is terrifying? Police, crime, sentencing and courts bill

[Graphista]

Someone else started a thread about this ages ago.

The amendments have all been defeated at the commons yesterday

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-57680917.amp

This bill has many features which are worrying.

Most frightening of all are that it will effectively end the right to protest.

Even a lone person protesting can be criminalised and face up to a year in prison .

The Home Secretary - currently priti Patel - will have powers to prevent protests, to enact certain police powers and even to relocate parliament

There will be new offences enacted that will make it virtually impossible to assemble, protest or basically in person criticise anything but especially hi the govt.

Aibu to think this is outrageous and terrifying ?

Nobody else is concerned about this?

YANBU

Very worrying indeed

I completely agree OP, its another ominous threat to our basic liberties, in addition to those which have been slowly chipped away piece by piece over the last year. You're unlikely to find much joy here though in my experience; most people on this forum are obsessed with the Government "keeping us all safe" and convinced that the end justifies the means - you only have to look at the number of people begging for rules, regulations and restrictions to continue indefinitely to see that. This is just another way that the police and the government are tightening their grip, and they're trying to slip it through while everyone is frothing about the 19th of July. Sometimes you don't need bars to keep people under control; you just need a few "right minded" citizens who are obsessed with doing the "right thing".

Nope, Can't see a problem if it stops rent a mobs and anti-social behaviour.

@adawong

Nope, Can't see a problem if it stops rent a mobs and anti-social behaviour.

Well, it might. But it will also stop justified protest which is a corner stone of democracy. Not worth the trade off in my view. I’m very concerned @Graphista. And all the ‘opening up’ stuff yesterday (not confirmed) to get people talking about that instead. This government is very, very scary.

If we had a rational and balanced government, I wouldn't be worried. Sometimes extreme laws can be justified, if used to prevent extreme harm or injury.

We don't have a rational government. We have a government, and a Home Secretary, that seem intent on causing harm to anyone that doesn't conform to their ever more extreme values. I'm particularly concerned for the traveller community, who need support and better access to education and healthcare, not further demonisation.

You're not unreasonable at all.

I think it is terrifying, It is utterly undemocratic that the government can decide which protests are acceptable and which aren’t.
Our last hope is with the Lords.

Thank you for the thread. It felt as if nobody was much bothered except for some FB friends, who are v politically engaged.

@adawong

Nope, Can't see a problem if it stops rent a mobs and anti-social behaviour.

How do you suggest people register dissatisfaction politically, if their MPs choose to ignore them, as many do?

It is very worrying - and people are getting knickers in a twist about mask wearing impinging on their civil liberties.

How do you suggest people register dissatisfaction politically
Nothing in the bill stops protests.

@Unescorted

It is very worrying - and people are getting knickers in a twist about mask wearing impinging on their civil liberties.

This is the irony, isn't it? Meanwhile voting rights, the right to peaceful protest, the right to legally seek asylum all being taken away. "Freedom Day" - what a joke. Religion used to be the opium of the people, now it's football, flags, pubs and barbecues.

ada - much in the bill prevents lawful protest. The SoS just has to decide it is causing annoyance. I suggest reading up on part 3 & 4 in the HoC library briefings commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9273/

Thanks all I was beginning to feel a lone voice!

@HotelCalifornia88 when it was last discussed a lot were in agreement it was outrageous, this was around the time of the Sarah Everard protests

and they're trying to slip it through while everyone is frothing about the 19th of July

Totally agree - I had to hunt for a bbc link and its not been on any news broadcast today

@adawong I would urge you to read the bill

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/58-02/0133/210133.pdf

It goes WAY beyond dealing with way out of control situations

A single person with a placard and a megaphone can be imprisoned for up to a year

Nothing in the bill stops protests. Have you actually read it in detail? It may not clearly and overtly outlaw protest but the minutiae equates to that - or at the very least allows the Home Secretary and senior police officers to have the authority - just one of them - to veto protests they basically don't agree with or are against them

This government is very, very scary.

I genuinely feel many are sleepwalking into a horrific situation where this govt has far too much control

They're supposed to work for us, on our behalf

We don't have a rational government

I would be concerned at such a bill under any govt but it's especially frightening under this one

intent on causing harm to anyone that doesn't conform to their ever more extreme values.

Absolutely

I'm particularly concerned for the traveller community, who need support and better access to education and healthcare, not further demonisation.

Yes there are parts of the bill which are very clearly aimed at the traveller community and "bringing them into line" which is horrific

Our last hope is with the Lords.

Yes - I want to write to those lords with particular interest in the issues under debate. But I'm not sure whether to do a template and email them all or do individual ones -but to which lords? Anyone with experience of this kind of thing please advise

How do you suggest people register dissatisfaction politically, if their MPs choose to ignore them, as many do?

Exactly - this is a crucial part of democracy

I'm not a particular expert but I can't help thinking this is unconstitutional in some way?

I know we don't have a written constitution but we have laws that address this

There must be something we can do to get the lords on side?

Kerslake would be on my list.

Ok thanks for that suggestion @Unescorted may I ask why?

I think I may have an idea but don't want to assume

On the surface of it, the changes seen a good idea, ya know, to deal with the "trouble makers". People "not like me" and "not like the people I know". But, as the poem goes:

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist

Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist

Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist

Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew

Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

Rather Godwin's law but that's how it feels doesn't it? Fascistic, Orwellian...

And there was no one left
To speak out for me

So apt

It’s a big worry…

Yet more proof of how and why she/they cannot be trusted

www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jul/18/priti-patel-misled-mps-over-plans-for-protest-crackdown

Very worrying. Democracy seems to struggle not to tip over into dictatorship at times.

Yes terribly concerning.

@PicsInRed

On the surface of it, the changes seen a good idea, ya know, to deal with the "trouble makers". People "not like me" and "not like the people I know". But, as the poem goes:

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist

Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist

Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist

Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew

Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

Thank you for this, a timely reminder.

Losing the right to protest is bad enough but don't lose sight of the ethnic cleansing in there.
Please support the Drive2survive campaign

www.travellerstimes.org.uk/news/2021/07/drive-2-survive-rally-protest-anti-traveller-law-makes-history