Would you contact the parents?

[MeanyJoany]

Just wondering really about a situation and interested on what others think

Two cousins, boy of 8 and girl of 7, not overly close as parents aren't, probably see each other at grandparents once or twice a month and by chance not arranged. The girl is being babysit overnight by grandparents, the boy visits during the day and is told he can sleep over too if he is a good boy. While visiting during the day the boy is in the bathroom, calls the girl in and purposely flashes his willy at her, she screams, he laughs. He is given out to and taken home to collect his things and brought back for the sleepover.

I think while kids do stuff like this the sleepover was attached to behaviour and allowing it to go ahead is effectively rewarding him and he should not have been allowed stay.

The parents of the boy never contacted or told the parents of the girl. I think if that was me I would have at least sent a heads up text to say look x happened, we have explained its wrong but just in case your dd mentions it or has questions I wanted to let you know, sort of text.

Yabu - no text is required
Yanbu - a text would have been common courtesy

Also would you have let the sleepover for the boy go ahead?

Very inappropriate.

He shouldn't have had a sleepover and I would be very very pissed off not to be told it happened by the grandparents.

Very very pissed off.

Jesus. Let’s hope the behaviour doesn’t escalate as time goes on…😳 If I were her mother and I found out it had been hidden from me, I would go bananas.

That needed addressing there and then and the sleepover not go ahead. If he was six, I'd say that that he shouldn't be punished, but at eight, he should know that the behaviour is inappropriate. Perhaps the GPs have old fashioned ideas of 'boys being boys'.

Are you the mother of the girl, OP?
I would’ve expected to of been told about this.

I'd be fucking livid if any boy, regardless of relation, had some this to my child.

I'm not sure how I'd be able to approach it though without a basic understanding as to how the parents of the boy would react.

I wouldn't trust the grandparents again though. I wouldn't expect them to be able to pre-empt the behaviour but they should have been fully transparent and put sanctions in place.

I don’t know. On the one hand, yes that was obviously inappropriate. If he has form for such behaviour or is mature for his age then he should be sent home. On the other, if the eight year old is immature, say more like a 6 year old, then it was something silly he did when he was over excited. In that case he should be told he’s going home if he does it again and take the opportunity remind him about privacy and consent etc. Either way the girl should also be reminded about privacy and consent so she knows it’s wrong and what to do if anything similar happens.

Texting the parents makes it sound like they need to look out for signs of trauma or discuss the incident at length, which seems unnecessary. A glimpse of an eight year old’s willy isn’t assault. If there are concerns that the 8 year olds intentions were sexual then the parents would need to be told. But 8 seems very young…

As long as he was told firmly at the time why he mustn't do that then I think fine for the sleepover to go ahead. He needs to be educated out of that behaviour, but not punished. He's only 8.

The Grandparents should have told the parents of the girl as they were in charge and dealt with the situation.

Yes a phone call is very much in order.

Gahh, what were the grandparents thinking? They tell their grandson "he can sleep over too if he is a good boy" and when he demonstrably isn't a good boy, he still gets to sleep over! What the hell do they think this teaches him?

And yes, all parents should have been kept in the loop, especially the girl's. And the boy's parents should have come and collected him forthwith!

If I were the

I don’t think cancelling the sleepover is a natural consequence. His behaviour was silly and inappropriate and it was right that he was told off for it but he is still a young child and unlikely to have a deep understanding of why it is inappropriate beyond it being rude. Kids that age are often obsessed with bums/ poo/ willies/ farts etc and of course it’s not appropriate to show these things to others but I doubt he’s coming at it from a sexual point of view at all, more he thinks it’s funny because it’s crude and forbidden. I would have been wary of turning it into something bigger than it is by cancelling the sleepover.

Obviously if it was a pattern of behaviour or had escalated beyond him showing it once I would say stricter action needed to be taken than just a telling off but if it is the first time he’s done anything like this I’d put it fine to him being silly and unthinking rather than intentionally inappropriate. That said I would have told his parents and urged them to do some work with him around private/ public body parts and places and the pants rule etc so he had a better understanding of why it wasn’t ok - as well as being potentially upsetting to other kids he is also putting himself in a vulnerable position if he doesn’t understand it’s not ok for him to show his willy to others.

I would’ve told the parents of the girl and boy . Told the boy off . Girls parents need to know in case she talks about it .

Thank you all. I am the girls mother. The boys parents were there at the time too, they told him it was inappropriate. I just feel as they themselves had attached the sleepover to good behaviour that that shouldn't have happened. I said that whatever about punishing him that was their call but I felt the sleepover was a reward.

My daughter told me about it over the phone when I called in the evening to see how she was. I met my sil the next day, and as I hadn't spoken to my parents yet I didn't mention it until she left as I wanted to get the full story. I don't know if I would have been told by anyone to be honest had my daughter not told me.

This is maybe a drip feed, I didn't mention this is in op as I was 100% sure I am not wrong on this but I wasn't 100% on the flashing/texting/sleepover thing so I needed opinions on those. Another thing that happened is that my kids aren't allowed visit my brothers house without me, my parents know this. I reiterated it before I left and on the first morning I was away I called to see how my kids were my daughter told me they were going to his house, I got my mother on the phone and told her again they weren't allowed there without me (even at that I only go once a year for my nephews birthday), and she still took my daughter (other dd is older and didn't want to go), now I know I am not wrong about this, I had one request and I am very cross over it. I just wanted to make sure my crossness on this wasn't clouding my judgement with the flashing/sleepover/no contact from parents

@MeanyJoany

Thank you all. I am the girls mother. The boys parents were there at the time too, they told him it was inappropriate. I just feel as they themselves had attached the sleepover to good behaviour that that shouldn't have happened. I said that whatever about punishing him that was their call but I felt the sleepover was a reward.

My daughter told me about it over the phone when I called in the evening to see how she was. I met my sil the next day, and as I hadn't spoken to my parents yet I didn't mention it until she left as I wanted to get the full story. I don't know if I would have been told by anyone to be honest had my daughter not told me.

This is maybe a drip feed, I didn't mention this is in op as I was 100% sure I am not wrong on this but I wasn't 100% on the flashing/texting/sleepover thing so I needed opinions on those. Another thing that happened is that my kids aren't allowed visit my brothers house without me, my parents know this. I reiterated it before I left and on the first morning I was away I called to see how my kids were my daughter told me they were going to his house, I got my mother on the phone and told her again they weren't allowed there without me (even at that I only go once a year for my nephews birthday), and she still took my daughter (other dd is older and didn't want to go), now I know I am not wrong about this, I had one request and I am very cross over it. I just wanted to make sure my crossness on this wasn't clouding my judgement with the flashing/sleepover/no contact from parents

I'd be cross on all fronts OP, the flashing & not telling you and then defying your request not to take DC to your brother's house. I wouldn't be falling over myself to allow my children in their care again based on that.

Is your brother the father of the boy who flashed at your daughter? And is there a chance that this is learned behaviour? I'm trying not to ask directly about something that may be very upsetting for you, but do you have reason to assume that there is a safety issue with your brother being alone with a young girl (and by extension, a potential issue with his son )?

@bloodyhell19 I definitely won't be asking again, my mother said she won't mind kids with restrictions and I told her I only had one and I wasn't lifting it

Gah, I posted halfway through a thought!
Your mother put your daughter at risk, even after being told directly not to (I'm making the assumption that there is actual risk there because it seems otherwise odd to forbid it). You weren't told about the incident with your daughter (which is much more concerning than the actual incident, IMO).
I know how hard it can be to get childcare, but your mum can't be trusted to care for your daughter. She just can't.
Also, if someone is not safe to see your child without you there, then they aren't safe to see your child full stop.

@QueeniesCroft

Is your brother the father of the boy who flashed at your daughter? And is there a chance that this is learned behaviour? I'm trying not to ask directly about something that may be very upsetting for you, but do you have reason to assume that there is a safety issue with your brother being alone with a young girl (and by extension, a potential issue with his son )?

He is the father to my nephew who flashed. The reason I don't want the kids up there though isn't anything sexual. My brother and I do not get on, he has so many issues, honestly I could write a book but my main reason is that I find him volatile, and many family occasions and for no reason he explodes with rage and name calls and storms out, it's always me that seems to get the bring of the name calling and I don't trust him for that reason. I don't think if he exploded (though it seems to be other people's occasions he likes to ruin not his own), that my parents would concentrate on getting my kids out I think they would stay and trying to calm him down so without me I don't want them there and as I say I only go once a year

Personally, I wouldn’t expect my parents or parents in law to tell me before pick up, as sounds like just silly behaviour from a young child that was dealt with at the time. I also wouldn’t expect grandparent to exclude one grandchild over it. The context for me though is that I have good, healthy relationships with my siblings and husband’s siblings so have no reason to feel particularly worried. It sounds like there is some ongoing issue that makes you feel unsafe in relation to your brother which I suspect is impacting how you feel. You feel upset about it and that’s what is important.

@MeanyJoany

Thank you all. I am the girls mother. The boys parents were there at the time too, they told him it was inappropriate. I just feel as they themselves had attached the sleepover to good behaviour that that shouldn't have happened. I said that whatever about punishing him that was their call but I felt the sleepover was a reward.

My daughter told me about it over the phone when I called in the evening to see how she was. I met my sil the next day, and as I hadn't spoken to my parents yet I didn't mention it until she left as I wanted to get the full story. I don't know if I would have been told by anyone to be honest had my daughter not told me.

This is maybe a drip feed, I didn't mention this is in op as I was 100% sure I am not wrong on this but I wasn't 100% on the flashing/texting/sleepover thing so I needed opinions on those. Another thing that happened is that my kids aren't allowed visit my brothers house without me, my parents know this. I reiterated it before I left and on the first morning I was away I called to see how my kids were my daughter told me they were going to his house, I got my mother on the phone and told her again they weren't allowed there without me (even at that I only go once a year for my nephews birthday), and she still took my daughter (other dd is older and didn't want to go), now I know I am not wrong about this, I had one request and I am very cross over it. I just wanted to make sure my crossness on this wasn't clouding my judgement with the flashing/sleepover/no contact from parents

Why are the children not allowed to visit your brothers house without you? Is there some sort of history that means they are not safe? I get that you would be worried about the fact the 8 year old showed his private parts to your daughter. But not being allowed to visit your brother without you Seems that's not a new thing?

The boy needs to be sat down for a conversation about why this behaviour is inappropriate.

Both parents should be told.

The sleepover should have gone ahead. Cancelling would be disproportionate overreaction.

@Radio4ordie

Personally, I wouldn’t expect my parents or parents in law to tell me before pick up, as sounds like just silly behaviour from a young child that was dealt with at the time. I also wouldn’t expect grandparent to exclude one grandchild over it. The context for me though is that I have good, healthy relationships with my siblings and husband’s siblings so have no reason to feel particularly worried. It sounds like there is some ongoing issue that makes you feel unsafe in relation to your brother which I suspect is impacting how you feel. You feel upset about it and that’s what is important.

Thank you that is a very fair and balanced reply. I think you are right about not telling me before pick up for sure. I get they were probably trying to not ruin my night away. I'm not sure if I would have been told at all unless my daughter had.

@Tomuch I just don't trust him, it's not so much a safety thing as in he would physically harm them but he just has so many issues and has form for getting into rages, name calling, ruining family events at the drop of a hat that I don't trust that if he flew in a rage that my parents would get my kids out before trying to calm him, I think they would calm him. I sort of see my kids being there as just unnecessary, he is toxic in our family and I have no relationship with outside of being polite in my parents home. If I never saw him again I'd be fine with that, they just don't need to be around him really (that's the shortened version, I could actually write a novel)

OP,

Have you parents see your children at your house.

They don't appear to respect your requests.
They brought your child to your volatile brother's house despite your explicit instructions.

I don't have this issue with our families but I cannot get my head around grandparents thinking the know better.

In your situation,my children would not be going to their grandparents home again.
They brought your child to your brothers house when asked not to.

8 years is way old enough to know this ehaviour in inappropriate and he did it for the reaction.

I would NOT be happy at all.

[quote MeanyJoany]@Tomuch I just don't trust him, it's not so much a safety thing as in he would physically harm them but he just has so many issues and has form for getting into rages, name calling, ruining family events at the drop of a hat that I don't trust that if he flew in a rage that my parents would get my kids out before trying to calm him, I think they would calm him. I sort of see my kids being there as just unnecessary, he is toxic in our family and I have no relationship with outside of being polite in my parents home. If I never saw him again I'd be fine with that, they just don't need to be around him really (that's the shortened version, I could actually write a novel)[/quote]
Ah ok I understand that makes alot of sense. I hope your dd is OK and it gets sorted out. He is only 8 still very young. But yes I think you should have been told. The children need to be spoken to as well. Explain to the boy that he must not show his private parts that they belong to him and he should not show anyone. Also the same conversation with your dd. So they both know the boundaries what is ok and what is not.