AIBU to think schools should make more effort with virtual open days?

[greyinganddecaying]

I might be, but want other opinions.

I live in an area with lots of selective secondary schools - we're in catchment for 7 grammar schools (although some are single sex/religion based, so we couldn't actually apply for all of them). There's also a number of decent non-selective schools, although we're only in catchment for one.

We don't know anyone who attends these schools, although many of them are ranked fairly high (locally and some nationally).

We've been looking at the virtual open days for a few of them over the last few weeks and a few of the schools have been fantastic in terms of the information they provide and how they've tailored this to the prospective students. But others have hardly bothered. My DC is basing opinions on schools on this information and some of the good schools are way down the list because of this!

I wondered if the schools weren't making the effort because they don't have to (people will apply regardless), but saying that, both the highest ranking school & the local high school have put the most effort in, so it's not the case for all.

We're obviously going to discuss with DC the pros and cons of different places, the distance to travel etc. But I feel that we can't compare them properly because we don't have the information that matters to the DC.

AIBU or are there other ways we can find out about the schools?

I'm hoping g we can go and see the schools in person this year!

We viewed several online parent tours last September, as we were moving house and schools were a big part of the decision process. None of the virtual tours were that useful. All they showed was who could build the best website.

We know where we live now DD is 99% guaranteed a place at a school we are happy with. Shes also got a chance at another school which uses the lottery method... we are hoping she can visit the schools and chose whether she wants to try for lottery school.

(I say 99% as you never know... there could be over a hundred catchment siblings...we are in the next category, catchment area + feeder school and one of the closest families. )

Yeah I had hoped for in person visits here too, but they're not happening. All we have are websites and looking it schools from outside the gates!

YABU because school staff are on their knees, budgets are drained and this isn’ta skill schools have needed until now.

They may be hoping to run in person open days in September/October.

It’s almost like, with TAG grades and blended learning, that they’ve had more important things to worry about…

What sort of information is it that you haven't been given? If it's things like clubs etc that are available the schools may be wary of telling you what the school will look like next year/year after as at the moment they just don't have the information /guidance

I found local Facebook mums groups/ local area Facebook groups quite useful for getting reviews of local schools as well as asking mums at your current school who have older siblings.

What information are you looking for?

It's hard choosing schools at the moment. We're in the middle of moving our kids across primaries (consistent failures with SEN provision and bullying that's not being addressed) and I've found that requesting to look around when the kids aren't in school - even if it's just being allowed to walk around the exterior of buildings - seems to be getting some results.

There's a huge contrast between the information provided.

One school had presentations from kids in different years, talking about school trips, clubs etc (obviously these are covid-permitting), presentation from the head teacher and a real emphasis on pastoral care and how important it is.

Another school did similar to the above but also talked about science/computer activities, how they bring subjects to life etc.

Then another did a 3-5 minute tour of the inside of the school, eg where the canteen is etc.

It varies hugely and it's difficult to compare them, especially for DC.

I've asked a few parents, but I don't get much other than "yeah they're doing well there"

Then another did a 3-5 minute tour of the inside of the school, eg where the canteen is etc.

Was this a virtual open day / evening or just a video tour on their website?

@Whinge

Then another did a 3-5 minute tour of the inside of the school, eg where the canteen is etc.

Was this a virtual open day / evening or just a video tour on their website?

It's under virtual open day & this is all it shows.

Personally (as a teacher with a teacher husband and 2dc in secondary school), I would never base any decisions on Open Days (virtual or otherwise).

There is no reason to believe that a school that waxes lyrical about its philosophy, the importance it places on pastoral care, or how it brings subjects alive is any better at those things than any other school. It's all marketing. It costs nothing to say all of that. You can easily be swayed by a motivational talk by a particularly engaging teacher or pupil and find that your own children's experience once they get there bears no resemblance whatsoever to what was described.

Base your decisions on factual informatiom from the website, brochure, results, data about intake, plus any opinions from reliable sources who know the school. And how the school atmosphere feels, if yiu can possibly geta look around. Open days are pure window-dressing.

@lazylinguist

Personally (as a teacher with a teacher husband and 2dc in secondary school), I would never base any decisions on Open Days (virtual or otherwise).

There is no reason to believe that a school that waxes lyrical about its philosophy, the importance it places on pastoral care, or how it brings subjects alive is any better at those things than any other school. It's all marketing. It costs nothing to say all of that. You can easily be swayed by a motivational talk by a particularly engaging teacher or pupil and find that your own children's experience once they get there bears no resemblance whatsoever to what was described.

Base your decisions on factual informatiom from the website, brochure, results, data about intake, plus any opinions from reliable sources who know the school. And how the school atmosphere feels, if yiu can possibly geta look around. Open days are pure window-dressing.

I completely agree @lazylinguist - but all schools have said there will be no in-person visits, I've not managed to get anything much out of other parents & the results & other data are all very similar.

Personally I'd prefer the nearest one because it's more convenient - unfortunately that's the one with the least information on offer (from DC's perspective)

How frustrating! Do they not have a pdf brochure linked from their websites? Failing that, I'd be tempted to ask about the specific schools on MN! Maybe in the local section and the main boards.

I think you’re right that there’s a real difference between the actions of those oversubscribed and those not. Those newer or undersubscribed make so much effort to engage and to build a reputation. It’s as if those oversubscribed might sometimes rest on their laurels.

I will say that the school we're trying desperately to get our kids out of at the moment (with endemic bullying and SEN so variable depending on which staff member you get) put together wonderful virtual tours and introductions from the kids... and it's been shitty as hell and we're not the only family moving the kids.

I think it’ll be whichever school has fewest staff off isolating and most admin staff/teachers with gained time.

We are essentially doing double the planning and assessment teaching in class and providing online learning for kids at home and the time allocated for planning and assessment is the same as before covid so woefully inadequate. Teachers will be prioritising current pupils first. If you have specific questions definitely worth emailing in or asking for a chat with specific departments or subjects.

@CoffeeWithCheese

I will say that the school we're trying desperately to get our kids out of at the moment (with endemic bullying and SEN so variable depending on which staff member you get) put together wonderful virtual tours and introductions from the kids... and it's been shitty as hell and we're not the only family moving the kids.

I'm so sorry to hear this @CoffeeWithCheese - it just shows that sometimes there's no way of knowing how it's going to work out, no matter how much research you do

I think I'd probably be a bit suspicious of a school that relies on using kids to promote it. Why can't the teachers do that themselves?

What do you really need to know about a school really other than where it is, what subjects they do and what their grades were like in the past few years?

Those newer or undersubscribed make so much effort to engage and to build a reputation. It’s as if those oversubscribed might sometimes rest on their laurels.

True. But 'making lots of effort to engage' sounds good and 'resting on their laurels' sounds bad. Unless you rephrase them as 'desperate and cynical self-promotion to get bums on seats' and 'letting their results and well-earned reputation speak for themselves' . I wouldn't trust much that any school said about itself without hard evidence!

What do you really need to know about a school really other than where it is, what subjects they do and what their grades were like in the past few years?

Unless you know what their intake is like, the grades on their own don't tell the whole story. You might well want to know about sports and music provision (beyond classroom teaching) if your dc are very keen on those. Class sizes. Setting policy. Proportion who stay in the 6th form. Special needs provision if relevant. All kinds of things.

@SmokeyDevil

I think I'd probably be a bit suspicious of a school that relies on using kids to promote it. Why can't the teachers do that themselves?

What do you really need to know about a school really other than where it is, what subjects they do and what their grades were like in the past few years?

Those points are the bare minimum of what parents/children need to know. Personally, I found talking to teachers, talking to pupils and walking around the school far more informative than what the school wanted to tell us via presentations (live or virtual). Talking and asking questions gains you far more information as schools aren't particularly open/honest in formal presentations.

The big issue for us was bullying. All the presentations/website said was parroting their bullying policy. Talking to a pupil who showed us around the school gave us far more information about what bullying was happening and how it was dealt with.

Teachers are on their knees. Literally, exhausted. I’d expect lots just don’t have the time to put the effort into this that’s required.
If you ring the schools, most will do private visits after hours with the transition coordinator.