AIBU to think DS may be being groomed for county lines?

[countylines]

DS aged 16 likely ASD/ADHD has never been included in any social groups at school. Has occasionally had one friend for a short time but never more than one and never had a sleepover. Everything has always ended in disaster for him with attempts at friendships or in most situations really.

He left school after GCSEs last month and is suddenly part of a big group of people whom I have rarely heard of from school and is at sleepovers in London (40 miles from where we live). He is 16 and might just leave if I grounded him as would see it as very unfair as I have no evidence of anything and he is on cloud nine at being included for the first time in his life.

I have told him to call me at any time of day or night and I will collect him without judgement and obviously warned him about county lines and any other criminal activity. Any other advice on what should I do?

Thank you

@Meruem

It sounds like you have a good relationship so I would just keep the lines of communication open. There does come a point where they have to learn to make their own decisions. As you say, you can’t ground him, he’s done nothing wrong as far as you know. Yes county lines is a thing, but it’s not as big of a thing as MN would have you believe! I’ve worked in the field so I do have some knowledge of the scale of the issue.

This is the best advice - I also know that despite the media hype County lines are not that common and most cases it turns out that the children involved are younger siblings of the dealers - or looked after children. An awful lot of what is now called a county line was just plain drug dealing a few years ago - this masks the so called increase - the risks are only marginally greater now than ever before.

Has his behaviour changed in any way other than meeting with these friends - the biggest give away of being involved in drug dealing is having a lot of extra money or expensive items such as trainers.

I do understand your concern both for your child's welfare but also for his emotional need to be gaining more independence.

Watch and wait would be my advice - if any other concerning aspects of behaviour start showing i would think again but for now keep communication good and let him know he can come to you with any issues.

@countylines

Eleanor - what would you do ground your child? Lock him in the house/remove phone? He has ASD and would really struggle to see grounding as fair when he has been very open with me and answered everything I have asked which was quite detailed. If I had been his age I would never have forgiven my parents if they had ruined my first chance of a sleepover/friendship. My relationship with my parents would have broken down for life at the lack of trust. Luckily my parents showed me trust. I cant speak to the sleepover parents as they are on holiday and presumably unaware of how many kids are in their house. I accept it is not ideal kids are sleeping in their house if they dont know. Obviously the boy has told my son his parents are fine with it!

I wonder whether you could go with him to check it out next time and that be a condition of allowing him to go. I completely understand it’s not straightforward for you with him having ASD. I suppose ultimately it’s about safeguarding him. He may not see that as fair but it’s necessary, especially if you feel there’s something criminal potentially going on there. It’s definitely a fine balance between keeping him safe and giving him space and freedom. Is your son coming home with anything new, or does he seem to have more money than he should. I would honestly speak to your local Police who will have pointers for you.

I'm not sure OP - he might have found his tribe, but I don't think it's necessarily a huge stretch to what you're fearing. What I do know is the bit about your son going to the park and being told to go home has made me teary with rage and sadness. Fuckers. I remember an article in The Sunday Times about a woman whose son was bullied to suicide. The thing that stuck with me was her saying he was so happy one day and asked for a fiver because 'everyone was going to Subway'. He gave it back to her that night because he went to find them at lunchtime and they'd gone without him. Unbearable. I hope to fuck your son has just found some friends, I really do.

You are unfortunately probably right OP. I know of kids being given parcels to take and handover in a park and then they are mysteriously 'robbed' and then owe the gang thousands or have to do their bidding. Speak to child safeguarding but they might offer nothing or they might go in heavy handed. Its scary stuff. Tell him red flags to look for - will his new friends accept him saying no sometimes.

Hi Op, is he actually showing any signs that he is being exploited? Does he suddenly have more money, new stuff, disappearing for several
hours at a time? Are these friends from school are there any older people or people he doesn’t know from school? How about inviting these friends to yours? Often the young people exploited/chosen for county lines don’t have a high level of parental involvement. Could it just be that he now has friends? I have two children with ASD and for one of them it was in their later teen years that they started being able to make and maintain friendships

Lobotomised - Yes that is exactly my fear. He will be heartbroken if it transpires he is being included to be used in whatever way - not necessarily county lines. We have had loads of examples like the subway one over the years where he gets his hope up that he is being included but it has never actually happened. It has been heart breaking and is making me so sceptical about it all now. Going to the kids houses wont help me to know this.

As others have said, keep the lines of communication open. Make sure he knows he can ring you anytime and you will come get him, no matter what has happened without being cross.
Talk to him about peer pressure and how to say no.
Perhaps have a safety text thing where he can text a sentence to you, something like 'will you pick me up some shampoo' and you will ring or text with a pretend family emergency and you need to pick him up.
This could help if his friends were doing something he was uncomfortable with but he felt he couldn't say no.
Make sure he knows if he has drank to much or taken anything to ring and you will help and that your main concern would be keeping him safe not punishing him.
I wouldn't panic too much about county lines just keep your eye on things.
Did he have a person at school who you had a close relationship with like a pastoral manager or form tutor? I would ring for an informal chat. Don't mention county lines as you have no evidence of this, just say he has a new friendship group and do they think you should have any concerns. They probably won't tell you anything due to data protection but you should be able to tell a bit by their reaction.
You could also invite a few of these boys over or give them a lift to a theme park or event to get the measure of them.

I work with young people involved in county lines op. Firstly, you have to know if this is something that he is involved in, rather than just a group of friends meeting up and doing usual teenage silliness. Signs such as; coming home with new expensive items of clothing/computer/phone games/alcohol/drugs. Other signs can be owning more than one phone (one being the old style phone-trap phone) numerous calls or texts, travelling to the countryside or coast on day trips/overnight. Mentioning one or two names of 'friends' a a lot and having an almost idolised ideal of them.

People are suggesting to contact police, but they can do very little to be honest at this stage. Your local social services might have 'prevention programmes' which can offer support to young people at risk of county lining. There are also organisations such as St Giles Trust which do a lot of work with county lines and can offer you advice.
Hope this helps a bit.

A few things from experience.
When my own sons were that age parents called me if their ds was staying overnight. They were day boys at a boarding school so some parents lived miles away but still called. I also called them if ds was staying . They always fought me about calling but l still did and so did most other parents.
So l would call, get to know parents.
Also l found as my boys got older they became more confident to be more inclusive as they matured and were not as worried about peer pressure. So guys they saw as different in earlier years they began to get to like as they weren't as concerned about their image. I don't mean that in any horrible way. It was their own insecurities that caused them to run with the herd in earlier years but age taught them to get over that. So they could be genuine friends. I really hope so.

@countylines

Yes - I completely understand that, while County Lines is obviously your biggest fear, there are alternative scenarios that aren't much better. I'm so sorry your son has gone through all this. It's unthinkable to me how abhorrent teens can be to each other.

What was the reason for him going to a school 40 miles away or have I misunderstood? If he is travelling 40 miles to the school area and that's where all the other pupils live, it sounds perfectly reasonable thats where the social stuff will happen.

Maybe the kids are now kinder and more inclusive, I hope so. I would still want to know some of the kids or parents though.

I have a son the same age and his social life has exploded since the end of school, he has suddenly become a lot more independent but we always have a back up plan when he goes out that if I don't hear from him I will collect him from x at y pm.

I think if you arranged to collect him one night instead of him sleeping over (make a dentist appointment for him the next morning or something), you could see it for yourself and assess the situation he is in.

Are you in a position financially to get him to do something over the long holiday like signing up to a gym and different activities that he can do to keep himself busy?

@Hijokp

Parents away? Huge sleepovers?... Drink and drug fuelled parties basically!

YANBU. My son is the same and he's vulnerable, a sitting duck for people like this.

He belongs to a gym and signed up to other activities too. He doesnt go to a school 40 miles away some of the other kids do! I understood that social activities might not be local as we knew kids came from a wide area. It is the fact that he has never been included before at all. If I collected him I dont know what I could assess as it would embarrass him for me to go in so I would just be waiting in the street.

Personally I would contact the school and speak to his old Head of Year- they aren't responsible for these students anymore but as someone who works in a school I would rather a parent of a former vulnerable pupil phone to check on some names in this type of situation than not phone and something unpleasant happen to that child. They are not going to be able to give you details about the children you name to them but should be able to comment on whether they find the new friendships between them and your son strange and whether they feel there might be anything to be concerned about.

Could you explain his vulnerabilities to him and make him aware of what he needs to be aware of? Point out that not everyone is genuine and that if these or other people ask him to do them a favour like delivering a package , or minding something for them, then this is something he can't do. Could you explain that you have no issues with him seeing these friends during the day but that you would prefer that he didn't sleep over until you know their parents etc? It's nice that he is being included but there does have to be a balance between protecting him and allowing him freedom and this sounds like he is getting way too much freedom all at once.

@countylines you need to speak to specialist organisations don't rely on the fact that non urgent police will have the right knowledge.

www.bespaceaware.co.uk/

Please don't rely on random mumsnet advice like 'you have nothing to worry about ' or 'just tell him to stay home' - he is becoming a young person with will to move about on his own and you are right to be concerned - from what you say he is quite vulernable.

hopefully you are wrong but good luck - I work in this area and it is a mssive risk.

@countylines

He belongs to a gym and signed up to other activities too. He doesnt go to a school 40 miles away some of the other kids do! I understood that social activities might not be local as we knew kids came from a wide area. It is the fact that he has never been included before at all. If I collected him I dont know what I could assess as it would embarrass him for me to go in so I would just be waiting in the street.

Oh I think I get it now, they are all from a school where people come from a wide area, but travelling to the most fun place in the area to socialise?

I would still want to collect occasionally. Even just to sit in the street. It makes a connection between his new life and his familiar life. If you ever have to collect him in a crisis, he knows that you already know where Fred's house is.

I also think it is worth asking to swap contact numbers with at least one parent. Just in case his battery goes flat. This is what I have done with my son, so I know where his main friends live and have a few parent phone numbers. Via them I'd be able to contact many more if needed.

If another mum contacted me saying 'our kids seem to have become friends, could I ask you if your son would be a bit of a buddy for my son as he is new to all this socialising and I'm worried about him getting left out' I would definitely make sure my son looked out for yours.

Really all you need to know is are these nice kids that are befriending your son. The only way to find out is to interfere a little, or wait and see. I would go with the slightly interfering approach.

What a hard thing it is to stand back and let young people make mistakes/get hurt.

However, it is through challenge that we grow. I am thinking of the park thing not more serious issues here.

If he’s going to sleepovers at theirs could you reciprocate and organise something at yours? Then you can get to know them a bit and make an opinion of the kind of teens they seem to be.

Maybe they’ve just grown up a bit? Some 12-15 year olds can be silly little twits but by 16 are growing out of it and maybe these kids are recognising that they’ve been a bit mean to your son in the past and realising that it doesn’t hurt to let him be part of the group.

Could you contact a teacher at the school? Although they’ve now left the teachers will know if they’re likely to be including him to be kind or because they’re using him for something.