Page 8 | Why are A&Es getting so busy?

pabloescobarselasticband · 23/06/2021 12:16

@INeedNewShoes I completely agree that its an issue. No her wounds were not bleeding heavily or massively deep, just lots of them. Its not her fault the way the system is but A&E really isn't the place for her to be. A lot of the issue is constant buck passing by other health professionals, they don't know what to do or dont have the time/ funds needed so they want to cover their own arses and just push the problem on to A&E. The 111 service, minor injuries and GPs are absolutely terrible for doing this! Its then the ambulance service and A&E that end up unable to cope with demand.

earthyfire · 23/06/2021 12:19

My GP surgery isn't answering calls at all now. We have to send a message describing our systems and wait to hear back, I requested a web call or face to face appointment due to a serious eye infection what I now know is frozen shoulder, I was then just sent a call appointment for two weeks time without any consultation. I ended up in A&E as my eye got so bad and I couldn't move the left side of my body.

earthyfire · 23/06/2021 12:25

My GP surgery isn't answering calls at all now. We have to send a message describing our systems and wait to hear back via a message. I requested a web call or face to face appointment due to a serious eye infection and pain for what I now know is frozen shoulder, I was then just sent a call appointment for two weeks time without any consultation. I ended up in A&E as my eye got so bad and I couldn't move the left side of my body.

User5827372728 · 23/06/2021 12:31

I’ve taken my kids to the kids a&e twice now, both of which I would usually have gone to my GP, but they were only doing phone calls. I wanted my kids to been seen by a doc and not send a pic of a possibly infected cut.

sparemonitor · 23/06/2021 12:41

@User5827372728

I’ve taken my kids to the kids a&e twice now, both of which I would usually have gone to my GP, but they were only doing phone calls. I wanted my kids to been seen by a doc and not send a pic of a possibly infected cut.

So to avoid a perfectly safe way of assessing your child, you took them to a hospital where A&E will be overrun with covid and there is a high risk of you catching it?

FrankiesKnuckle · 23/06/2021 12:50

@User5827372728
Do you not see that this is the problem of our overwhelmed EDs?
A picture really would have sufficed.
My daughter had molluscum, and when they became angry and infected looking, I called and was asked to send a picture and I did. I was given cream which funnily enough was the right treatment.
I appreciate your intentions to get the appropriate care for your children but it is this mentality that is crippling our overstretched services.

User5827372728 · 23/06/2021 13:02

A&e isn’t over run with covid, it wasn’t very busy, in and out within 2 hours. Very grateful we saw a doctor.

The blame should lay with the GPS being unwilling to see patients thus people going to a&e rather than a 6 min timed covid secure appointment within walking distance from our house.

LadyWithLapdog · 23/06/2021 13:46

Dermatology can be done remotely safely and it’s rarely an A&E matter.

It’s a big shift in society, see also discussion about WFH versus lengthy commute & office. Some will find it more difficult to adapt than others.

Sceptre86 · 23/06/2021 14:02

Not being able to access a gp for a face to face appointment makes community pharmacy even busier than it already is. I constantly get patients referred to me inappropriately that I cannot do anything for who need to see either a nurse or gp. For example I can't treat a utility in an under 16, I can't diagnose a broken limb or check your ears!

I have to refer these people back to their gp but they will not usually want to be stuck on the phone again so will end up at a &e.

Sceptre86 · 23/06/2021 14:02

*uti not utility

Pumpkinbrew · 23/06/2021 14:06

I've found my GP surgery to be absolutely fantastic. They've always been good and this hasn't seemed to impact care and I have a whole lot of health issues!

I have had conditions diagnosed after sending photos via email and so has my daughter. Both were correct and the doctor called once they had received the photos on different occasions. Then they printed prescription and sent to a pharmacy.

I haven't had any issues with my repeat meds not being done etc and phone appts are actually so much easier for me. I'm aware that not many do like them or prefer them but for myself it is the best option. Obviously if it is serious the GPs will automatically say to someone to come in and nurse appts are available also for anything the nurse needs to see to.

Whereas my previous GP surgery well before Covid were useless with most things including repeat meds so I dread to think about them now!

My GPs also are not referring onto hospital like what some other posters are saying. Obviously if it sounded like an emergency then it would be standard practice to do so but they're not sending you up for no good reason and they usually always want to see you beforehand so they can type letter and let hospital know you're coming.

The phone appts for regular, common issues that aren't painful etc are sometimes taking just under a week now but again, not a problem seeing how it isn't an emergency. If you have something seriously wrong then they will fit you in somehow even later on in the day after the usual emergency appts had been given out first thing. Cannot fault them.

Only very minor grumble is childcare issues but to be fair it is best not to attend with a child as mine tend to be quite distracting at the best of times! But the phone appts and sending photos if needed are the best service for me and I'm very glad that that is available.

Aware surgery might be in the minority as all the receptionists at mine are lovely also!

Pumpkinbrew · 23/06/2021 14:09

Even urine tests are being sent away by my surgery if you hand them in via their window.

I fully appreciate everyone who has ended up with worsening conditions as my experience with hospitals have not been great at all even before Covid but more so now...

tttigress · 23/06/2021 14:26

I think GP's need to open up face to face appointments again.

I think the waiting list is so long now, and there will have been so many late diagnosis leading to death, and so many suicides. We will realise in about a years time, from a saving lives point of view we would have saved more lives by work through Covid.

sparemonitor · 23/06/2021 14:36

@User5827372728

A&e isn’t over run with covid, it wasn’t very busy, in and out within 2 hours. Very grateful we saw a doctor.

The blame should lay with the GPS being unwilling to see patients thus people going to a&e rather than a 6 min timed covid secure appointment within walking distance from our house.

No, the blame should lie with parents who take their kids to A&E when it is neither an accident nor an emergency.

sparemonitor · 23/06/2021 14:37

@tttigress

I think GP's need to open up face to face appointments again.

I think the waiting list is so long now, and there will have been so many late diagnosis leading to death, and so many suicides. We will realise in about a years time, from a saving lives point of view we would have saved more lives by work through Covid.

@tttigress have you actually read the thread? we are seeing patients F2F who need it. Phone triage is not new - my practice has been doing it for 8 years and will never go back. it's the only way to manage the mismatch between supply and demand.

CovidCorvid · 23/06/2021 14:40

I'm currently sat in the gp waiting room.... Only person here.

I'm sure they're doing phone appts as well but normally the waiting room would be heaving. It needs to be quite a good reason for a face to face appt and you only get one after a phone appt if deemed you need one.

So a week wait for a phone appointment, then a week wait for a face to face one. I can see why some people just go to hospital.

sparemonitor · 23/06/2021 14:41

@CovidCorvid

I'm currently sat in the gp waiting room.... Only person here.

I'm sure they're doing phone appts as well but normally the waiting room would be heaving. It needs to be quite a good reason for a face to face appt and you only get one after a phone appt if deemed you need one.

So a week wait for a phone appointment, then a week wait for a face to face one. I can see why some people just go to hospital.

Yes @CovidCorvid that is exactly the point! The whole aim of phone appointments is to allow social distancing in the waiting room. The flip side is that with the new technology available that we didn't have pre covid, we can continue to manage some things on the phone, which suits some patients particularly those whose work is not close to their GP surgery.

Didiplanthis · 23/06/2021 14:43

Another GP sticking their head above the parapet.. yesterday, I logged on at 7.20 am, I logged off at 9.30 pm.. I ate my packed lunch at my desk. I drank tea people brought to me. I did not leave my desk. I read letters, processed results, answered e consults, phoned people , spoke to consultants, dipped wee handed in, wrote referrals , saw 18 patients f2f yesterday, spoke to 24 others. I at no point had less then 4-5 ,pressing tasks that needed doing NOW at any one time... today on my day off I have done the 3 hours of paper work I didnt get done yesterday..can anyone tell me where the hell i could have fitted 'more' in ???? I saw a patient who had called 999 seen in a+e who wrote and handed her a list of tests and referrals I needed to arrange, I saw someone i have have done everything we can do i primary care and referred who has a letter from the hospital saying they aren't offering appointments at the moment... I got a letter from a consultant saying as they are busy they are handing back their routine work to primary care !!!! Where the hell are we supposed to put that ?? I physically could not see anyone else..but that means I'm lazy not seeing people to the person who called and I had literally no where to turn 🤷‍♀️ the reason the phone isn't answered is because they are already speaking to hundreds of other people,not letting it ring fir hours... there limited phone lines and limited staff number...

Todaytomorrowyesterday · 23/06/2021 14:57

Our GP surgery have been good - yeah it’s a message sent but I’ve had a call back every time. I had to go to A&E May 2020 & it was so quiet, due to Covid it meant that people didn’t attend for fear of catching it I guess - doesn’t make it right but it meant they actually seeing patients that needed treatment not the time wasters (not putting everyone who attends a&e in that group) I had to attend A&E again May 2021 - was busy very busy! Some definitely needed to be seen but others it’s like they forgot to self care & I was taken a back for some of the reasons they where there. (I had a blood clot in my lung for the 1st visit, 2nd visit my daughter had an ovarian cyst twisted - so I had a reason to attend!)

I do need my coil changing (it was due April 2020) I’m finding that frustrating! It’s no longer done at the surgery. I requested it last October and referral was lost now back on a waiting list :( The issue is I have it for Endometriosis and it has kept it under control until the last few months- bleeding & pain is back with bells on :( I know I have to wait my turn & Covid has created a backlog. The impact is I may need another operation to remove it which creates a ripple affect that could be stopped if I could be seen sooner :(

CovidCorvid · 23/06/2021 14:57

@sparemonitor yes I get that and for me it worked fine. But others will think they can't wait 2 weeks to see someone face to face and go to hospital.

sparemonitor · 23/06/2021 15:00

[quote CovidCorvid]@sparemonitor yes I get that and for me it worked fine. But others will think they can't wait 2 weeks to see someone face to face and go to hospital.[/quote]
That's why we phone triage. If it is urgent, we see F2F same day.

Sidge · 23/06/2021 15:25

@User5827372728

I’ve taken my kids to the kids a&e twice now, both of which I would usually have gone to my GP, but they were only doing phone calls. I wanted my kids to been seen by a doc and not send a pic of a possibly infected cut.

But you didn’t even try to call them, it sounds like. Why didn’t you give them the benefit of the doubt?

They’d have taken a history, looked at a picture or assessed the wound by way of a video consultation. If they wanted to see the child in person, they’d have brought them down, and saved you a trip to ED.

See this is the nub of the problem in so many cases. “I wanted my kids to be seen by a doc”. Wanted. We are there to meet clinical needs, not your wants.

alloalloallo · 23/06/2021 15:41

We are very lucky here in that we have an urgent treatment centre/minor injuries unit so that A&E isn’t particularly busy. The UTC is very busy though.

My daughter has Tourette’s and one of her tics is her hand locking in a fist, usually with her fingers entwined. It can last for an hour or it can last for days. We were given a prescription for a low dose of diazepam so when it’s painful or her fingers start to go blue, it relaxes the muscles.

I have been trying for weeks to get through to the GP for a new prescription (they won’t give us a repeat prescription as she’s under 16), but no one ever answers the phone, replies to emails or responds to my e-consult queries so we ran out.

Inevitably, her hand locked and 48 hours later when it was still locked, I called 111 and we were sent to A&E - not sure why we didn’t get sent to the UTC to be honest

They gave us a box of diazepam and we went on our way. All of this could have been avoided if I could have got through to the GP. We didn’t need to see anyone, a phone consultation would have been absolutely fine

sparemonitor · 23/06/2021 15:47

@Sidge has it spot on. The NHS is here for needs, not wants. We do wants when we can - for example we offer a choice of contraception, not just one type, we use principles of shared decision making when we can but in the end we are here for medical needs. Stropping off to A&E because you're not happy with the way that your GP wants to assess you (and they are likely much more experienced and qualified than the junior doctor you'll see in A&E) is just the equivalent of a toddler having a tantrum.

Sidge · 23/06/2021 15:53

Well there’s that too @sparemonitor. A misconception that ED staff are superior to primary care staff.

Yeah of course if you need advanced life support or have a dislocated fracture ED is the place to go. They have more drugs than us too 🤣 but primary care is chock full of seriously qualified, experienced staff.

Conversely, GP surgeries aren’t there for first aid or acute injury or illness. I think people forget that.