To be irritated by the Londoner exodus to my town?

[thesecondnamegame]

I've been priced out of my Greater Manchester town by the London diaspora. Anybody who knows the area will know which town I mean. My tatty council town centre terrace is worth 300k. A load of Londoners came up after the BBC moved to Manchester. Half the kids in my kid's school's parents are from London and they love to make sure you know that. House prices have become ridiculous and are in a different world to the rest of Greater Manchester. It's ridiculous as it used to be a very unremarkable market town (albiet with not much to it) and now it's gone all 'naice' and I'm having to move 10 miles away because it's reaching the surrounding towns and I simply cannot afford to live here and I want to buy a property. It annoys me, I keep imagining somebody who had a London salary and bought a house in London, sold it, and came up here and bought a house 3 times bigger for the same price as their smaller London home. It just seems like they cheated. There are no school places either, because a lot of the Londoner's chose this particular town for the schools. The catchments are bloody tiny, I know somebody who lives in a village about 4 miles away. The schools in this town are the closest schools. No school would take her child and she ended up having to home educate for months.

All my relatives who bought properties or private rented have had to leave, even those who went to uni and got great jobs.

I'm not on about the Londoner's who couldn't afford to buy a left to get on the property ladder. I'm on about those who already owned in London. They come here, buy much bigger houses with their equity and inflate the area. Then those who suffer are the more local population who aren't even able to buy shitey starter homes.

I perfectly accept I'm a hypocrite because I'll be moving to a cheaper area so I can buy. Though I'm only going 10 miles not selling a house that's gained crazy area based equity beforehand. If I owned my 300k valued terraced council house, sold it and then was pissing off to the north east to buy a detached 3 bed, then I'd be one to talk.

This issue is only going to get worse. What about when the North West gets completely priced out and then suddenly half of Manchester is rushing to Newcastle? Because believe me, that will happen and will be equally as wrong.

The sector of society that has been most disadvantaged are younger Londoners who have been priced out of London

Bad for them, but worst off of all are older low income Londoners - those in their 40s, 50s, and beyond. Shut out even from social housing due to London's particularly acute shortage.

The BBC move to Manchester. Well some people are never satisfied. Eaten up with misplaced jealously over London's 'investment', they scream for 'levelling up', then have a tantrum when they get what they asked for...

I moved and bought in London specifically to get a better equity on my property and relocate later, so did most people around me, no one stopped you from doing the same, I will buy a cheap(er) property away from London and I will celebrate the bargain and my new life!

@Pinuporc

On MN you could be forgiven for thinking that every other person earned a 6 figure salary. In RL I think the average salary is 30k. That will include many people living in London. Do you suppose all the retail, hospitality, cleaners, transport workers and public sector workers in London are on about 80k?? I work in London (incidentally in none of the above sectors) and I earn 26k. A good salary in my sector is 40k.

Indeed. I earn less than the average and have 30 years experience in my field.

Er, many Londoners who are moving north are actually northerners who moved south for a few years and are now bringing their (hard earned) cash back home to spread it around up here. Yes, the housing sitch is rubbish. We bought and sold in London and made nothing more than we spent renovating the house.

Many young people live in other cities (or countries) for a few years in order to save a deposit. You don't need to be a Londoner to do this.

You need to blame the government for allowing foreign investors for buying property (with possibly laundered money) and leaving it empty thus causing prices to rise. Many Londoners like myself are forced to leave because it's not possible to get on the property ladder.

Don't forget that "locals" are accepting the high prices which makes the problem worse. Can you honestly say that if you were selling a property you'd accept the offer from a local who could only afford half the price offered by a Londoner?

@Honeycombskl

Given that it seems there are now lots of jobs that can be done remotely there is nothing to stop the 'locals' from also accessing these jobs and therefore increasing their wages. Or are you suggesting that 'locals' are somehow entitled to benefit from a lower cost of living than others in the UK?

Many locals don't have the same skill set to do the same kind of jobs online. There are less opportunities up here so they don't have the same skill set. The cost of living is cheaper exactly because historically wages are far lower, so people working here aren't 'benefitting' from a lower cost of living as you say. They don't make the wages that would make it a benefit. And now they can't afford homes where they live. Surely you've got to understand why that causes resentment for those moving in? It's not the fact that people are moving here, that's always happened, but at present it's en-mass which is having a significant impact in small communities where homes and opportunities are limited.

Do you really not see that of course it is a benefit to live somewhere the the cost of living is low so that you can afford to live on a low wage. Do you think that there is no one in London on NMW? Do you think that cleaners and nurses and teachers and retail workers in London are all on massive salaries?

@thesecondnamegame

I'm not on about the Londoner's who couldn't afford to buy a left to get on the property ladder. I'm on about those who already owned in London. They come here, buy much bigger houses with their equity and inflate the area. Then those who suffer are the more local population who aren't even able to buy shitey starter homes.

I perfectly accept I'm a hypocrite because I'll be moving to a cheaper area so I can buy. Though I'm only going 10 miles not selling a house that's gained crazy area based equity beforehand. If I owned my 300k valued terraced council house, sold it and then was pissing off to the north east to buy a detached 3 bed, then I'd be one to talk.

This issue is only going to get worse. What about when the North West gets completely priced out and then suddenly half of Manchester is rushing to Newcastle? Because believe me, that will happen and will be equally as wrong.

Those who already own in London won't be a massive number of Londoners either.

Your subsequent points may have some validity re house prices in the UK overall (we've seen it magnified in many "second home" threads since Covid) but your OP was so ignorant and inflammatory this thread won't really address that now.

@thesecondnamegame

I'm not on about the Londoner's who couldn't afford to buy a left to get on the property ladder. I'm on about those who already owned in London. They come here, buy much bigger houses with their equity and inflate the area. Then those who suffer are the more local population who aren't even able to buy shitey starter homes.

I perfectly accept I'm a hypocrite because I'll be moving to a cheaper area so I can buy. Though I'm only going 10 miles not selling a house that's gained crazy area based equity beforehand. If I owned my 300k valued terraced council house, sold it and then was pissing off to the north east to buy a detached 3 bed, then I'd be one to talk.

This issue is only going to get worse. What about when the North West gets completely priced out and then suddenly half of Manchester is rushing to Newcastle? Because believe me, that will happen and will be equally as wrong.

Freedom of movement OP. Why cannot not put your righteousness to good use and do something to stop it?

@Tealightsandd great post.

The amount of times I've heard on Mumsnet 'if you can't afford to live there then move, noone has a right to live in an area'
Yet when these people move the locals get pissed off. What annoys me the most is that London has immigrants moving in constantly from other parts of the UK and all over the world, imagine if Londoners had the same attitude as some of these locals? You'd be called xenophobic or racist and rightly so. But the continuous influx to London is the reason the prices are so high and that people have to move out, to be then greeted by insular locals. Yes it sucks when you can't afford to buy a house, that's just life, but 'londoners' aren't to blame.

I live in Greater Manchester.
I think you are wrong to blame the BBC or Londoners, and I think you are wrong to think that any particular one area of Manchester is having its house prices pushed up!
I was very surprised by someone guessing Ramsbottom- I’m guessing you’re Altrincham or Didsbury.

This is just the general tide of gentrification wand nothing to do with Londoners.
Didsbury was up and coming, then became too expensive so people spilled into Chorlton. Then chorlton got too expensive and it has spilled so large swathes of south Manchester are unaffordable.
I remember as a kid seeing men knock seven shades out of each other outside the Whalley Pub- then it got converted to £250k a piece flats not so long ago!
I grew up in south Manchester but could not afford to buy there- I bought a house in north Manchester. When we were viewing all the other young couples were also renting in south Manchester but couldn’t afford to buy there or had been continually gazumped.
Now the tide has spread and my house value has increased by 40% in 3 years...the affluent buy and the lower earners are pushed out.
Highly recommend watching Manctopia.

I'm betting its Didsbury. And I'm with you OP.

Yes, must be terrible to see the equity in your house rise by so much.

Remember when people complained all the money in the country was concentrated in the south. You want your “northern powerhouse”, you have to pay for it.

I'm on about those who already owned in London. They come here, buy much bigger houses with their equity and inflate the area.

Most of those 'Londoners' are not Londoners. They are returning locals or people from other parts of the UK, who moved to London, priced out Londoners, then move back home or on to somewhere else.

Then those who suffer are the more local population who aren't even able to buy shitey starter homes.

Welcome to the 'levelling up'.

Locals? Traffic can't be one way. People come to London, others leave.

London is the capital of homelessness.

It's not ok that's it's happening anywhere. No one cared when it was only affecting Londoners. Now it's starting to happen elsewhere maybe something will be done?

The desperately needed solution is to build and buy more social housing. Lots of it.

@ChloeDecker

Somebody born and raised in London who was able to go to uni and go into a job on a London salary is incredibly privileged.

You really have no idea OP. No idea.

This.

YABU. And bigoted and misinformed. I’m sorry your area is gentrifying but it’s the same thing that happens to people born and raised in newham, hackney, Lewisham. Manchester is growing, which was supposed to help regional development and investment. So... that’s what happens. Of the kids in my children’s school maybe 20% of their parents were born and raised in London, if that. I’m not going down the pie and mash shop complaining about all the ‘out of towners’ cos this isn’t the 1960s and I’m not prejudiced.

You really don't have a clue about Londoners. Firstly, most people don't have huge salaries and are privileged for just being Londoners! Sky high rent, poor wages, huge competition means that most live hand to mouth! No chance to save a deposit for even a shoebox! The benefits are the same value as the rest of the country so really aren't enough to live comfortably if in london.

Yes there are some Londoners that are well off and have afforded houses etc, but the younger generations really struggle to get on the property ladder. So some do save up to afford a deposit in a place outside of London.

Also, don't be surprised if a lot of the property is being bought by foreign investors to rent out. Happened in London and now they have moved on to Manchester and other up and coming places. So don't blame it all on Londoners for prices going up!

Lots of Londoners aren't actually Londoners! When I lived there I yearned to live back where I grew up and eventually managed to make that move with my family. Should I have just remained stuck in a polluted pressure cooker?
I expect - shock horror - there are Mancunian Londoners who just want to 'go home' too. Are they not allowed?

So people can’t move from london to get more affordable housing but you can move elsewhere to do the same?

The investment in spreading out the country's wealth has been screwed up anyway because it's way too concentrated on certain areas. If you aren't in Manchester (well, south Manchester) or Liverpool, get fucked basically. And nobody cares about Birmingham which is always forgotten about because it's all about "The North!".

Many locals don't have the same skill set to do the same kind of jobs online.

Unless you are suggesting that people from Manchester are stupid, I would guess that previously people with relevant skills and aptitudes had to leave to find work. Now they can stay.

You can’t have it both ways. Would you prefer all well paid jobs to be concentrated in the South East? Would it be better if the BBC was still at TV centre in London?

@Puffykins

I would love to be able to live where I grew up in London. And we did what you suggested and bought the shoebox - the DC are 10 and 8 now, and after a year of both DH and me working from home and homeschooling etc. We have decided to move out of London - because our incomes have not risen in line with housing so we can't swap the shoebox for anything more than a very slightly larger shoebox quite a lot further out... Londoners have been priced out of London. And I totally understand your finding it heartbreaking - I do too, I would LOVE to stay here - but it's just not possible.

Same here. We moved from a teeny tiny, swelteringly hot one bed help to buy flat in London to a teeny tiny 2 bed flat with damp and slug problems in Kent. Wow!! Rich Londoners and their massive cheap houses... my hairy arse.

All the new flats in buildings going up in London are being sold to millionaires, or to Asian investors looking to park their money somewhere who probably never set foot in them. A “help to buy” flat can be anywhere from £500k upwards.

Where exactly are we supposed to go?

1. You’re doing exactly the same to the residents of wherever you’re moving to.

2. Prices in London are inflated partly by everyone and their granny moving here to start their careers.

3. The people who currently live in, say, N17 and can’t afford a family home are making precisely the same decision as you - who made you the king of greater Manchester?

4. You’ve presumably benefited from a British education and years (decades?) to move up in the world, so why is your earning potential what it is? As in, you criticise Londoners having the opportunity to build equity etc, but if you bought your house for an acorn 20 years ago why haven’t you been squirreling away money every month for a nice detached house in Lower Shitsville?

All these things cut both ways.

I had no idea any were in Manchester, they all move to Edinburgh.

Tell your local people with local interests at heart to sell their properties to locals earning local salaries and for local prices. Right?

It’s not really about ‘Londoners’ it’s all people who have made massive profits on their house sale which is the problem. It does cause huge problems for communities when people decide to move ‘en masse’ from areas where huge profits have been made. I can’t understand why it’s not subject to capital gains tax over a certain level.