To be annoyed at DD's school

[Worried54321]

DD (11) is currently being assessed for ASD. It has taken years of fighting hard to be finally taken seriously by our GP, who got the ball rolling last year and we have come a long way since. This week a member of the ASD assesment team was sent to her classroom to silently observe DD. I got a phone call the day before from the practitioner for permission so I knew it would be happening. The practitioner also mentioned that this observation is not always necessary but the forms sent back from the school had confused her by painting DD in a very different light. School described her as a happy, confident and bright child and they had zero concerns about her. This came as a shock to me despite their dismissive attitude over the years because yes, she is bright, but every teacher she has had told me of her struggle to focus and concentrate in class. She hates school and this year has cried most mornings with "a tummy ache". It's emotionally exhausting and heart breaking and someone with a school refusing child will truly understand the daily battle. Anyway, they know all this.

My best friend's DD is in the same class and told her mum (and me) numerous times that DD is very, very quiet in class and the teacher always tells her to stop daydreaming/talking to her seat partner/fidgeting. So it's all very contradictory.

Tonight DD told me that her newish teacher and another member of staff (separately) asked her why she has a sad face. The latter also inquiring if she has any trouble at home and if that's what is making her sad. This has really, really fucked me off to be honest. Not only are they insinuating that her issues or sadness stems from DH and I but for years they have collectively minimised - no, dismissed - my concerns about DD. If she had the right support she wouldn't feel so sad or perhaps hate school so much! And they're now giving her a complex that there's something wrong with her face. She asked me if she really has a sad face and how to make it look happy even though she doesn't feel happy. DH says to drop it but it's hit a nerve with me and I feel like I should bring it up with the teacher or something. We have had zero support from the school despite me reaching out to the SENCO and pastoral worker, and I'm so glad she will be leaving this shithole in a few weeks.

But wwyd? Am I over reacting? Anyone had similar experiences at their DC's school?

Absolutely not overreacting. In your shoes, I’d get a private referral. I was in a not too dissimilar position and not only did the school do fuck all, the proactively went after me for flagging concerns. Always the fault of the mother (ffs). 12 years later we are finally coming out the other end but the services currently are a shitshow.

Gather all the external support you can as you have a battle ahead of you if the school are behaving like this so early on. It’s a disgrace in my opinion but you are not alone OP.

If you haven't already join the Facebook group 'Not fine in school' you will get lots of help on how to deal with school.
Keep all communication with school in email so that you have a trail.
Unfortunately a lot is based on the opinion of school during the assessment process. Dds first school insisted she just had behavioural problems when she started school refusing due to anxiety. Luckily she moved school and they were far more supportive and helped with the process. She was diagnosed with ADHD and ASD at 15 and 16 after starting having problems at 13. However there were signs from the start of secondary school but the first school insisted she was 'fine'

You haven't really described the school issues, but it sounds similar to inattentive adhd.
Tbh having to get opinions from teachers is part of what has put me off assessment.
As i have girls the symptoms etc being different. Dc1 is very difficult but slowly getting better at school. And has always been up and down so issues are put down to other things. She has always hated school. Is bright but pays little attention.
But is very sensitive re hair brushing and sun tan lotion/creams
Struggles with friendships.
I tried to raised adhd with reception teacher during an awful year but they had it down as naughty behaviour.

I'm glad you are close to getting a diagnosis for your DC @Pleaseuseatissue

I have to say our local NHS ASD team has been brilliant, DD initially had some anxiety counselling in May last year and then the psychiatrist and GP made a referral for ASD assessment in September, first appointment being in January. Now we are close to being told their final decision according to DD's practitioner. So I'm glad it hasn't dragged on for years and if DD does have ASD then she will hopefully have the right support in place in time for secondary school, despite her current school's attempts at sabotaging that! If they say DD does not have ASD then we will appeal the decision or explore the private route. But the practitioner has already given the go ahead for some more counselling for DD's anxiety so they do recognise she is struggling.

Thanks for the FB recommendation @Foobydoo and I agree it is very opinion based. The SENCO got very defensive when I asked which single member of staff can genuinely say they know DD very well. The truth is staff changes so often none of them do.

Salts picked up both dc's ASD despite school not thinking that they had ASD and one school blaming parents.

@HSHorror with DD she has terrible anxiety and it spiked during lockdown last year. Worrying about death, illlness, shadows at night, rats in her bed etc. She still sleeps with the lamp on. We also had intrusive thoughts about killing herself and us.

At school she hates the noise, the smell of other children, the toilets, the teacher shouting (the teacher has told them they are the naughtiest class in school and she finds this deeply upsetting), she hates sharing a table at dinner time as they 'spit' in her food whilst talking. She struggles to focus on what teacher is saying, has a mental block that stops concentrating. She forgets things very easily ans struggles to write more than 5 lines in English work. There are numerous other issues. There is symptoms of anxiety, OCD, inattentive ADHD. But it's up to the experts to decide what they feel best fits DD.

No, no diagnosis, she not a minor anymore so they’ve thrown her out the system. School was a disgrace and community CAHMS not fit for purpose. Any further suicide attempts are ours to deal with apparently.

Good luck OP and keep an email trail of everything. Private referrals will be of great benefit, not that you should have to take that path of course...

In my experience primary provision is absolutely crap.
DD had severe language issues and the school didn't believe me even though she never spoke. I finally got fed up, did a private report when she was 10 and it all came back as her being in the 1st to 3rd percentile aka shocking. 2 days before this report came back we were told by the school that we are overreacting and nothing is wrong and we would never get an EHCP as she's a lovely child. A week after the report the school suggested we move her to a local special school where kids are on oxygen....

I feel for you. I'm glad your local provision is great as ours was really bad, if not for the private reports we would just have reams of paper talking about her strengths.

@Pleaseuseatissue sorry I don't know why I felt your DC was finally receiving some help. It's horrific and in no way acceptable how services are withdrawn once a DC reaches adulthood. How can parents be expected to cope alone. Not everyone can afford to go private, we certainly can't. I would borrow money if I had to but why should it even come to that? The system has failed, and is failing, so many young people.

@meadowbreeze I hope you told them where to stick their suggestion. I have seen so many threads of late with posters (rightly) complaining about their dc school and the lack of support. Instead of aiding camhs etc to reach a decision they attempt to sabotage a diagnosis by dismissing a parent's concerns and painting a very different picture. I know it's what a child is like according to their observations but we all know in many cases children with ASD mask very well. Or like my quiet DD who gets on with work best she can, refuses to ask for help though she needs it and remains invisible in a class of 30 by trying hard to not bring any attention to herself. Its emotionally exhausting for her and we experience the effects of that at home. So how can they claim to know her better than me? Why can't they put their hands up and admit they know FA about her.

I had a chat with DD's newish teacher on Friday, I was highly emotional and I wish I had remained calm (I'm probably the staffroom gossip currently...), but I had to get things off my chest. I may have also said some unpleasant truths about the senco and pastoral worker who aren't fit for their jobs. Oh well.

@Worried54321 I laughed. I just thought it was hilarious that within 2 weeks they went from accusing me of making things up and being a hypochondriac, to wanting to send her to a school with kids who can't talk or walk!
If I was to do it all again I would just make sure to keep my emotions in check. There are a few situations I cringe at now where emotions got the best of me. The reality is, a good school can fail a child and that is nothing personal to your or your daughter. She has a great mum by the sounds of things and a great team behind her. My DD doesn't have ASD but because she had language issues that was one of the concerns and she was assessed 3 different times! (A really inept NHS SALT decided to check if it wasn't 'just autism') and the situation at school is only one part of the ASD process.
It's very thorough and involves more than one professional so the likelihood is you will get someone lovely in that midst, we did.
Re additional things- as your DD hasn't had much support, you will probably find that the list of things they say is wrong is seemingly endless. We had DLD, dyslexia co morbid with dyscalculia, high likelihood of dyspraxia, anxiety etc etc I held that report and felt like a failure. The actual problem for us was untreated DLD which was causing delays across the board and on a test looked like all those other diagnosis. The private EP we saw explained this to me but it still felt raw. She has had amazing support for the last 2 years of secondary and is so happy, confident and besides some issues in maths and understandibly English speaking, all those other diagnosis are now retired.

It gets better op, hang in there.

I'm sorry you're going through this. It must be so hard.

Each school is different and each teacher will have a different level of expertise in dealing with additional needs. Unfortunately there is no national (any) training for recognising needs for teachers. They aren't diagnosticians but their evidence is used so it would often be helpful.

As a teacher (or whatever other adult in class), you are only allowed to report on what you see. The forms do not allow for discussion or much other information. They may well not know her very well, and may see her as a quiet child (which a child is allowed to be) so it may not flag up.

I have two children in my class with a diagnosis of ASC. One is very obviously struggling and finds school hard. I would be able to fill in copious paperwork for her. Mum had no real issues at home until lockdown so felt it wasn't really a problem for her. So the opposite situation than you are in.

The other child is an absolute dream at school. Quite quiet, works hard,very helpful and polite. Never any issues in school. Apparently is an absolute nightmare at home. (The bottle being shaken is a great analogy for them.) I had the huge advantage of them coming to me with a diagnosis so I know what to look out for in class. There are definitely signs of distress or difficulty but they are very subtle and if I didn't know to look, I'm not sure I'd see them.

I'm not trying to justify the school's position, more to help you see that it's not as cut and dried as you might imagine. And the system is very flawed!

It may be absolutely frustrating to deal with this and feel like the school isn't backing you. However, you will only ever be the person who knows the most about your child. Please don't give up the fight but find a way of becoming a polite but very squeaky wheel which demands help for your child. The SEN board will almost certainly have much more practical advice and support.

Hang in there.

Eurgh, very similar happened to us. It appears to be quite common. We deregistered and home educated in the end ...

I read your opening post and wondered if your dd is at the same school as mine!
Me before she started... she has these issues, struggles with these things, but is excellent at tying laces.
School... nothing wrong with her, just lively and curious.
School... she breaks a lot of things.
She chews her clothes. She hits other kids. She cant run, she does this or that....
Me ... yes, I may have mentioned these things to you over the years??
School.. can we have her assessed for adhd please?
Me.. where do I sign? I have my own pen!
Me. . How are we getting on with adhd assessment?
School. . Waiting for appointment.
Go to appointment, get told yes, she has something. We now refer you to a specialist to see exactly what. But cershowing adhd traits.
School.. please fill in this detailed questionnaire , we have to do the same for her behaviour at school.
Fill in form...
Me.. any news on dd adhd?
School... adhd? No? She is fine.

We had a very similar experience, but had paid for a private diagnosis (we were told it would be a 4 year wait in our area otherwise) with an expert in diagnosing girls on the spectrum. She said she fully expected the class teacher's report to come back saying quiet and shy but essentially no issues, as that is one of the things that makes female diagnosis so difficult and the issues outside of school so great - girls mask and they learn to mask very well, and do it all day long at school, which is exhausting for them and if you only see the mask it's very hard to spot the underlying issue unless you really know what you're looking for, and most teachers don't. I found an information leaflet I gave to the class teacher post diagnosis (ASD - which he still didn't believe) which was brilliant at explaining why girls can slip under the radar and be so hard to spot in school, but also identified a number of common traits that ASD girls display in school. The list was DD to a T, and he admitted that. It enabled me to say to him that whilst he may not see the more well known autistic traits during the day, the behaviour and personality he did see absolutely did demonstrate ASD. From going around all of the local high schools there is definitely a greater awareness and available support at secondary level. We found primary dire, but secondary is much better. I totally sympathise with the school refusal, we have it again at the moment and it's an emotional rollercoaster, just horrendous for the whole family. I'm seriously considering homeschool from September, not sure I can put her, and us, through this for much longer.