To think being forced to get a job when a student is ridiculous?

[onedaybabywelbeold]

I am a 29 year old single mum, I have just finished my 3rd year at uni and going into my honours year. I worked for 10 years full time before going back to education. During the term year I receive student loan which is topped up by universal credit. I have about 1100 pounds to do me for the month so it's doable but tight.

Now that uni is finished for the summer I am obviously getting more universal credit to see me through. However, today I had to meet with my work coach and he told me I should be job hunting for a job over the summer and should treat job hunting as a full time job.

I told him that I might struggle to get a job as I can only work during the hours my daughter is in school, I have no one to help me and she finished school for the summer end of June. Also I told him it would be hard to get a job as I would be leaving again in September, to which he suggested I stay in a job whilst at uni as 'you don't really have to do much work until the end of the year'.

To be honest I don't really want to work when at uni, I mean I wouldn't be any better off than I would be on universal credit yet running with a substantial decrease in time so why would I? Honesty I don't understand the point in this, surely it's just wasting employers time as I'm not very serious about getting a job as I don't have the childcare. However, I'm worried that if I don't get a job they'll start reducing my payment.

AIBU to think the system is absolutely fucked?

@Babyroobs

OP can get a job, but the money provided from the state means she can choose not to. Personally I think that’s wrong. Kids or no kids.

Children are a life choice and if you can’t afford to have them without handouts then you shouldn’t be having them at all!

Do you have any idea how much work is involved, including placements, essays etc

The real issue here is the fact that OP has financial responsibility towards a child.
Choosing to let the state foot the bill and thinking that getting a job while studying is ridiculous sounds very entitled.
Someone else (who might have wanted to spend more time with their children) had to earn this money.

[quote Suffolkpunch345]@Babyroobs

OP can get a job, but the money provided from the state means she can choose not to. Personally I think that’s wrong. Kids or no kids.

Children are a life choice and if you can’t afford to have them without handouts then you shouldn’t be having them at all![/quote]
The Uc she does get is significantly reduced by her student loan anyway, so I doubt she even gets that much in UC.
One massive thing to consider which no-one seems to have mentioned is that a student parent on the old tax credits system can claim student loans without it affecting their tax credits at all wheras students on UC have their Uc amount deducted pound for pound ( except for a small disregard ) by their student loans. A grossly unfair two tier system whereby those on UC are hugely worse off.

One massive thing to consider which no-one seems to have mentioned is that a student parent on the old tax credits system can claim student loans without it affecting their tax credits at all wheras students on UC have their Uc amount deducted pound for pound ( except for a small disregard ) by their student loans. A grossly unfair two tier system whereby those on UC are hugely worse off.

Exactly this. I don't understand all the outrage here. Plenty of single mums who can't afford childcare in their current jobs, or who are financially struggling, get urged on here to retrain. Op is doing that, and now people are urging her to work as well, as well as finding some kind of miraculously available summer-holiday-only childcare that would be affordable on a minimum wage job. Even worse are the ones who complain on the basis that they worked themselves when they were a student - even though it's massively different when you don't also have a child to care for.

I'm a lone parent too, and work full time and get no benefits beyond childcare vouchers, but still am absolutely happy to 'fund' op, and bet most of the smug posters wouldn't want to swap circumstances.

@OverTheRubicon

There shouldn’t be some kind of special dispensation because she had a child! That was her choice! She is already getting more money from the state to cover this and free childcare. It’s ridiculous that people think they can just get paid from the government for doing nothing. She might even be in Scotland in which case her fees would be covered anyway!

I don't think the world revolves around you enough to declare that because something doesn't suit you it's ridiculous. On the whole it's reasonable for someone to seek work during a very long summer break, but, due to the intensity of your degree and the fact that childcare will be a big issue, it's not unreasonable to find it pointless for yourself. Your attitude stinks though in some of your post, let's hope you aren't as condescending in your postgraduate job!

Once again we have the traditional AIBU put the boot in from uninformed posters who love to have a scapegoat and run like a scalded cat from doing their own research.

What is wrong with you people - how about we are critical of this system and lobby our MPs rather than dump on someone trying to upgrade their life. Or are you jealous of someone who is doing what they can despite their circumstances.

It's not like she doesn't want to work - it's that there is literally no point when all the money from her job get deducted making it pointless. I bet you think she should have pride and work anyway even if its for no net gain - even though 'pride' isn't a currency - not even a cryptocurrency.

Children are a life choice and if you can’t afford to have them without handouts then you shouldn’t be having them at all!

In that case, given the bottom 50% of tax payers are net takers from the welfare state, a considerable proportion of the population would never be able to have children. So, no free maternity care, education and healthcare for children then, not to mention the range of benefits like housing benefit, UC, working tax credits, child benefit, etc for some?

Society as a whole agrees to support the cost of raising children, because when we are old, they will be the working population, keeping the country going. Many countries use policies to encourage children, because few in the West or E Asia have fertility levels anywhere near total replacement. Supporting single parents while they seek higher education, should be one of those policies in this country; not focusing on the tax take of forcing them to work for a few months in the summer, given the patchwork of private childcare here!

I doubt many parents set out to be single parents, and IMO looking after children is a full time job; and the best people to do it, are usually the parents. It is futile to force single parents into NMW jobs, while their children are looked after by other people on the NMW - what exactly is the real benefit to the country tax wise? OP might as well look after her own children in the summer!

As for SW, we have had seven. Four were absolutely useless, one was ok and two did their job as they were supposed to. As someone else said to me, all they usually do is come round, have a cup of tea and smile. The only ones, who were any good showed empathy, offered practical suggestions and gave support - and that is more likely to come from understanding how hard actual parenting is; not shelf stacking!

One massive thing to consider which no-one seems to have mentioned is that a student parent on the old tax credits system can claim student loans without it affecting their tax credits at all wheras students on UC have their Uc amount deducted pound for pound ( except for a small disregard ) by their student loans. A grossly unfair two tier system whereby those on UC are hugely worse off
the system was wrong under tax credits so had to be changed at some point. It's inevitable that there would a transition stage where some benefit more than others. It's the same with those getting a 100k inheritance who can still claim maximum tax credits. This thankfully has been stopped with UC. Soon everyone will be under UC and the system will be fair for everyone.

Re not having children if you can't afford them. People's circumstances change. If I'd had a crystal ball I'd have known that my ex"D"H would bog off leaving me a single mum and dealing with children's additional needs on my own. But since I did not I now make the best of my situation like many others. People are told to retrain, not accept NMW for life etc. But then berated for not working and needing a bit of help while doing so. I studied this for my masters degree and calculated that using average figures for graduate pay, housing costs etc it will cost the government less long term to fund a single mum of two to do a degree and get a graduate job than to be unemployed or on NMW and in work benefits. Obviously there are many variables but the principle stands.

There are some confusing mixed up on this thread. That OP is retraining to get into a field that is struggling to recruit, and is in high needs is fantastic. Of course the system should encourage single mums to do so.

That OP is likely not to be able to work when she is doing the course and placements, that's quite reasonable.

That she might struggle to find a job just for the summer. Very possible and that's to be accepted.

That she thinks it's ridiculous (as per the title of the thread) that she should be expected to at least attempt to find some hours, during the 3 months she won't have classes or placements, because she wants to enjoy the break and time with her daughter without worrying about looking for work, let alone working in a supermarket or as a carer, yet expect to claim the full range of benefits during that time: Not acceptable at all.

That she thinks it's ridiculous (as per the title of the thread) that she should be expected to at least attempt to find some hours, during the 3 months she won't have classes or placements, because she wants to enjoy the break and time with her daughter without worrying about looking for work, let alone working in a supermarket or as a carer, yet expect to claim the full range of benefits during that time: Not acceptable at all.

Sure, she should look - and if she can find a job a nanny with her own child, or a facilitator on a holiday club where her daughter can attend at lower rates, or something that's well paid enough to cover holiday club, that's great. Or if she has friends, family or her dds dad to look after her daughter while she works, also great. But realistically, she's likely to be on nmw, paying someone else on nmw to look after her child, and taking home very little extra in return for the hassle of rescheduled shifts etc, because summer jobs are not notable for their flexibility.

I think a lot of people don't really understand how 'lone' lone parenting can be.

But realistically, she's likely to be on nmw, paying someone else on nmw to look after her child, and taking home very little extra in return for the hassle of rescheduled shifts etc, because summer jobs are not notable for their flexibility
And that's called life as the outcome of the choices she made. It would only be one summer as she will earn more next year, so the hassle will be more worth it.

I say that as one who was a single mum of 2 under 5 for 10 years, always working FT with no help at all from their father or family, so yes, I know exactly what it is like. Not easy, but life is not easy for many people for different reasons.

let alone working in a supermarket

Have you experienced working in a supermarket? Two of DC have; and I cared for DGD while DDIL worked at M & S. Shifts change all the time - often with less than 24 hours notice. Once DD was at the bus stop, on her way to work - her manager rang up and cancelled her shift! Usually it was the other way round - she applied for 3 x 6 hour shifts, and ended up working 55 hours a week! It was lucky I was flexible for DDIL, as M and S changed her hours every few weeks. I doubt it would be possible to change the hours with child care providers, so often?

I have also never met anyone who didn't work whilst at university. It was expected people would, especially parents. I also worked in a university for many years - all the students had jobs. Work history is seen as an important part of job applications. You could get a job that compliments social work, in fact this is an area I have alot of insight into through family who recruit in this area. Most social work students also worked in fields that complimented their speciality ie part-time support worker for domestic violence charity or the women's refuge, Play worker or mentor for local branch of Barnados, Night Shelter worker, support worker in care home or children's home, teaching assistant, holiday club or nursery worker etc. It doesn't have to be stacking shelves, food service or cleaning, though there is no shame those either. Employers want people with a proven good work ethic, recent employment history etc.

Have you experienced working in a supermarket?
Yes, and nothing at all like your experience. My DS got a 16h job after his GCSEs over the Summer. Was going to be a summer job only but he really enjoyed it so wanted to continue after doing his A levels. He asked if he could change his shifts due to his classes and it was agreed. He has been working the same shift for 2 years now. He has been asked to work additional hours less than a handful of times.

vivainsomnia

DC have worked between them at 3 supermarkets, plus DDIL at M & S. I was also talking to one of DC’s friends last night, working at a major supermarket. Some supermarkets are better than others, as employers.

DD tells me where she is working atm, they have lost £millions due to Covid, and they have made many staff redundant.

Good points about summer jobs often being on zero hours contracts, with shifts being allocated at short notice, or staff being told not to come in at short notice, or leave early because it's not very busy.

Impossible to arrange childcare around, unless you have a very supportive relative like Intercity225.

The amount of reasons people can come up with for why someone cannnot work is actually impressive.

Haha how entitled are you?

@SchrodingersImmigrant

The amount of reasons people can come up with for why someone cannnot work is actually impressive.

still less taxing that actually working I guess!

But they're not reasons 'not to work' though, are they?

They're the practical realities of being a lone parent, only able to work for a few months over the summer and needing to find childcare.

OP has worked for 10 years and plans to continue to do so for another 40 after she qualifies, so I assume that it's not her you're talking about when you're referring to people not wanting to work anyway.

A quote from the OP:

To be honest I don't really want to work

No but lots of my students are/have been.
They typically work alongside studying.
Can i ask you whst degree you teach and its entry requirements?

It id false economy to work during term time. You are paying £3k a term and a similar amount in living expenses, you dont want to squander that by not giving 100%to your studies. That's s why oxbridge do t allow youyo have a termtime job (or they didn't when my dc were there) and most of the other RG give bursaries to sudents from households with an income