Overpaid at work, do I have to pay it back?

[Illdoitinabit]

Posting here for traffic.

My ex employer has just emailed to say I've been overpaid on my maternity and now owe them just over £100. I left the company in February and this is apparently from January. They never sent me payslips and I never received my p45 or p60 so have nothing to check back myself, although I will request them. Where do I stand on this? If I have been overpaid do I owe it back?

@nowlook

I think in your shoes, if you genuinely didn't realise that they had overpaid you, I'd ignore the first email They don't have any wages to deduct from, after all.

If a second email arrives, I'd say that:
(a) In paying you the money, they lead you to believe that it was rightfully yours;
(b) You didn't claim the money, you had it paid to you by them;
(c) You changed your position in reliance on the money in good faith and have spent it over time on bills;
(d) They have taken some five months to bring this to your attention;
(e) You are not obliged to repay. If they were to issue proceedings, you would seek to rely on the doctrine of estoppel by way of defence.

For £100, that might get rid of it. Otherwise, I'd try to agree a payment plan.

Yeah, this is terrible advice.

I doubt very much they would take you to court for such a small amount. I would ignore it.

@UrAWizHarry

Why is it terrible advice?

[quote nowlook]@UrAWizHarry

Why is it terrible advice?[/quote]
Because it's complete bollocks?

Be glad it’s £100 and not two grand like mine was I got let off nearly a grand of that though which was extremely nice of them. A bonus! But was very scary at the time when it was all worked out (this was over a long period of time)

Get your pay slips and other info, establish whether you have actually been overpaid and if you have, pay it back.

@GreyhoundG1rl

Oh

I thought you could use estoppel as a defence (if certain conditions were met). Is that not the case now?

"Because it's complete bollocks?"

Yup.

I’ve done payroll. I would expect as a minimum for them to write to you and send evidence of overpayment. An email is not good enough. They need to give you everything first.
You can then say that you have spent the money as you were paid in good faith and offer a re-payment plan in return. TBH they might get bored and let it go.
I worked somewhere were some teachers were overpaid by thousands and they sent they had already spent it, so they just let it go! I have seen others pay back tiny amounts over a long time. As you aren’t an employee they might decide it’s too much hassle (have you still got a cheque book, I’d send them a cheque each month).

@UrAWizHarry

"Because it's complete bollocks?"

Yup.

I'm more than prepared to be wrong. But why is it bollocks?

Don't bother arguing the toss - it's a mistake by your employers and you aren't owed that money, it's not yours to keep. They are obliged to consider repayment plans if you need this, however you have to pay it back. I've been on both sides of this, chasing debts of over payments required to be repaid and having Ann overpayment.

Employers are required, by law, to provide employees with payslips, so do ensure you get those.

Also, please sign up for a Personal Tax Account with HMRC to check that your income has been reported correctly while you worked for them www.gov.uk/personal-tax-account. An employer that hasn't been giving you payslips might also be doing something else wrong/illegal, like not reporting your earnings to HMRC or claiming furlough against wages you haven't received.

If it is all above board I would ask that you pay it back in instalments - it might be enough to make them drop it.

If you've got another job elsewhere now, please also check that your tax is being calculated correctly on those payslips too. If you haven't been given a P45 from your previous employer, HMRC may think you have two jobs and will probably be taxing the new job incorrectly.

I'd also ignore the first email and see what happens after that. They might persist, they might not. If they do, arrange to pay in instalments which you can manage.

"I'm more than prepared to be wrong. But why is it bollocks?"

Because it is, all of it. Companies are entitled to recover overpayments under the Employment Rights act.

The OP can request a payment plan if they can't repay the amount in one go but ultimately if the company can show they overpaid, that money needs to be repaid. Waffling about the op not "claiming" that money doesn't change it, and advising them to ignore it is just fucking idiotic.

@UrAWizHarry

"I'm more than prepared to be wrong. But why is it bollocks?"

Because it is, all of it. Companies are entitled to recover overpayments under the Employment Rights act.

The OP can request a payment plan if they can't repay the amount in one go but ultimately if the company can show they overpaid, that money needs to be repaid. Waffling about the op not "claiming" that money doesn't change it, and advising them to ignore it is just fucking idiotic.

Are you talking about lawful/unlawful deductions from wages, then? I'd agree that were the OP still in employment, they would be able to deduct. However, the OP left the company months ago and, as such, this is a claim which wouldn't have anything to do with the ET, would it? It's a claim in the civil courts.

I didn't invent equitable relief, Wiz. And that "waffle" is a brief summary of estoppel.

Of course, it's always possible (and likely) for us solicitors to have different opinions from each other, otherwise none of us would have jobs .

So, having read what you've said, I stand by what I said.

And I stand by what you saying being utter bollocks.

If the company can show they overpaid then that money has to be returned

Fair enough! Like they say, two solicitors three opinions

As a fellow solicitor, nowlook does actually have a legal point and isn’t talking complete nonsense. Practically may be best to just agree to repay the sum as it’s so small but the previous advice isn’t totally wrong. Annoys me when people jump on something with an airy pronouncement of “bollocks”. Try to reason it out a bit more!

Yes you have to pay back any overpaid wages / maternity pay.

However as far as you are concerned the overpayment didn't happen until they can prove it. It's a bit dodgy that they haven't provided some of your payslips/ p45 / p60.

It entirely depends on what is written in your contract, there should be a section on overpayments. Likely that you'll have to pay back but you can arrange a payment plan.

@nowlook

I think in your shoes, if you genuinely didn't realise that they had overpaid you, I'd ignore the first email They don't have any wages to deduct from, after all.

If a second email arrives, I'd say that:
(a) In paying you the money, they lead you to believe that it was rightfully yours;
(b) You didn't claim the money, you had it paid to you by them;
(c) You changed your position in reliance on the money in good faith and have spent it over time on bills;
(d) They have taken some five months to bring this to your attention;
(e) You are not obliged to repay. If they were to issue proceedings, you would seek to rely on the doctrine of estoppel by way of defence.

For £100, that might get rid of it. Otherwise, I'd try to agree a payment plan.

you would seek to rely on the doctrine of estoppel by way of defence.🤣 I love it on here some days.

If you move house and change your number, what can they do if they realise a year later that they overpaid you? I don't think my company did but am a bit worried as I left following mat leave and sometimes I think I should have checked there were no issues before my last 'day'. They do have my personal email, would they get in contact that way?

@Moonwatcher1234

As a fellow solicitor, nowlook does actually have a legal point and isn’t talking complete nonsense. Practically may be best to just agree to repay the sum as it’s so small but the previous advice isn’t totally wrong. Annoys me when people jump on something with an airy pronouncement of “bollocks”. Try to reason it out a bit more!

It's not like you'd see it go to court, but it might be enough to get rid.

I'd be advising the company not to bother because of the amount involved. Try a couple of emails, then forget it.

I had this happen, work overpaid me by a few grand. Then requested it back when I was on mat leave. I had no idea until I got the letter from them. I went to my boss upset and he rang payroll and told them to bugger off, that it was their mistake...so they agreed I didn't have to pay it back! :)

Quite a lot of us were overpaid around 70 quid a few months ago. Large retail company. We all had to sign a form so they could take it back in the next pay.